How Well Will Toyota Handle the Issues of Public Perception in its Recently Announced Recall?

I asked my sources about this and got the following:

Recalls are typically not counted in reliability standings even though corrective action may require a visit to a dealership to resolve the issue.

There may be cases where the issues surface and it is reported on the survey (say JD Power) as a visit for an issue. It is not clear if it is counted or not as a ding against the automaker, but it most likely is at that time.

So quick action can prevent reporting something as a reliability issue theoretically with some entities.

So I did play devils advocate asked if you can issue a quick recall and preserve a reliability ranking. While this is possible, is is also highly unlikely that it would occur due to the expense of the recall itself.

So does the short term cost of a recall cost less than a mediocre reliability record over the long haul?

Most of us can remember the reliability ranking of most of the brands out there for years, but very few can remember the number of recalls after a few months.

In this case it is wise for liability and safety issues to be addressed by issuing a total recall of the affected models. Better to get those mats off the road before the cockroaches come out of the woodwork and start suing.

— Agent009 (View Profile)

Posted on 9/30/2009 4:11:08 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -1   

a recal is a recal toyota should get branded as a not so reliable/safe auto maker.

Just look at ford, the fire stone tires were not made by ford but ford shure got roasted for it.

— carguy68 (View Profile)

Posted on 9/30/2009 6:31:31 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 5   

Toyota=New GM.

That's what you get for underestimating The Koreans, Germans, and Americans as trivial competition that can be pushed back at will.

GM made the same mistake in the 1970s when people were buying Toyota Compacts that were cheap to get in, cheap to service, and highly reliable and filled with good content for the price. They relied on customer perception from the 1960s that Japanese made "Sh-t Compacts" with no pickup.

A Sh-t Economy in the 1970s-1980s with constantly high gas prices and inflation along with Toyota's good quality and high fuel efficiency, sealed the brand as the cars you have to buy in America.

The Koreans are doing the same now.

In 10 years when I say Hyundai you will automatically know they are excellent Affordable Near Luxury Cars, that get great gas Mileage. When I say KIA that will mean in 10 years Sporty little things that you can ring out and still get good MPG, and are very affordable. Not cheap in quality, just cheap in price.

There will be no debate about it either.

— HyundaiSmoke (View Profile)

Posted on 9/30/2009 7:56:12 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -5   

I used to have a 2005 Prius with the OEM all season floor mats. I've personally NEVER had a problem with the floor mats. I'm thinking that it is USER error on this part.

The driver side floor mats come with these plastic clips that clip into the carpet floor to hook and hold the mats in place. I'm sure if people didn't use the included hooks then the floor mats will slip around from daily of just getting in and out of the car and they JUST MIGHT somehow manage to get caught up on the accelerator eventually.

Just another excuse for lazy people who won't spend the extra 30 seconds to install the provided clips/hooks to SECURE an item that was intended to be installed that way.

— KKO84 (View Profile)

Posted on 9/30/2009 8:03:24 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 3   

It won't change a thing. They responsibly issued the recall. I've never owned a Toyota and probably never will, but I respect their honesty.

Ford made a top-heavy piece of shit that rolled over easily and blamed the tires. They got off easy.

— rubenkincaid (View Profile)

Posted on 9/30/2009 8:17:32 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -2   

What should Toyota do, admit that their customers don't know that fasteners aren't optional and they're not there merely for decoration? The NHTSA didn't even bother to tell people what Toyota should be doing to correct this issue.

Just a smear campaign, this problem was solved 2 years ago and is the admnistration's best effort to pay the unions back. Pretty weak.
The NHTSA might as well have recalled the tires that Toyota uses because they have a tendency to wear out faster if the drivers use them past 20,000km/yr.

Most people I doubt will even bother to bring their cars in because most will see this for what it really is, a huge PR stunt for the domestics.

— huu76 (View Profile)

Posted on 9/30/2009 8:22:52 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -4   

Ford got very little bad press overall - they fobbed it off on a tire company. 200 deaths and 700 serious injuries caused by Ford. Toyota wouldn't even be in business in this country if they pulled that. We're talking floormats here, and one very unfortunate death.

— rubenkincaid (View Profile)

Posted on 9/30/2009 9:14:28 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -4   

Joe_limon,
Cracked brake lines, bad fuel pumps, airbags that don't work, those are concrete recalls with idenfiable causes (corrosion due to improper treatment or cracking due to improper tempering), answer = fix and replace. What is "Driver used in manner not designed for or used improperly?"
The NHTSA doesn't even demand Toyota fix the problem or do anything, they simply "recommend" that consumers not use them for now. If it really were the floormats (and not the people reinstalling them incorrectly), don't you think they'd tell Toyota to stop selling the all weather mats?

What would you call someone wearing their seatbelt underneath their shoulder, thereby guaranteeing their face will bounce off the steering wheel in an accident? (I see busty women do this a lot). Must be a defective seatbelt.
Will probably only be considered a recall if its in a Toyota and the big 2.5 continue to lose market share.

Yes, this "recall" is intended to bring Toyota's image down, nothing more. Do you not see how weak it is? yes, I am indirectly blaming the domestics. Cash for Clunkers didn't benefit them as much as they hoped. They yell at Obama, Obama yells at NHTSA, NHTSA looks for any reason to announce a recall.

1uaw,
Its unfortunate. No other way to answer your question without having you twist the words.

If it were a true recall (again, brake by misplaced valve, first batch of Camry's had transmission tooth problem) then I wouldn't argue (like I didn't with those recalls). This one is just too absurd and blatant.
I don't hear any other countries recalling their cars. Could be they don't sell all weather floormats that could be improperly repositioned by the driver.

The more you guys argue that this is legit, the more you'll realize its a sham.

— huu76 (View Profile)

Posted on 9/30/2009 10:22:02 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -5   

Would this make you two happy? Toyota's press release.

"Toyota sincerely apologizes for accidents caused by drivers removing properly installed all weather floormats to put their original floormats underneath in direct contradiction of the instructions and warnings provided by Toyota Motor of America. We are truly sorry we were not there to lead them by the hand."


If Toyota ends up having a recall on gas tanks because of a new treatment process they had one of their suppliers try out, then that would be a real recall.
Concrete reason = coating peels if not done correctly.
Concrete answer = replace gas tank.
BS NHTSA answer = we recommend drivers not fill up their gas tanks.

— huu76 (View Profile)

Posted on 9/30/2009 10:26:36 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -2   

This minor recall will not hurt Toyota/Lexus.

— EL34 (View Profile)

Posted on 9/30/2009 11:45:38 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: -1   

1uaw and Joe .... as you can s even when death is the final result of Toyotas wrong doing some people think they can do no wrong. How sad.

— upwards (View Profile)

Posted on 10/1/2009 5:21:37 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 5   

It's very strange and sad at the same time that some can argue that the deaths of human beings for using a product, in this case a car made by one of the world's biggest automobile manufacturers, can be so easily and cowardly explained away.

Very pathetic.

— acronis (View Profile)

Posted on 10/1/2009 6:20:44 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 3   

It seems like this recall could also affect other manufactures in the future once more investigation is on the way.

Huu76, there's no amount of sarcasm or ridicule that can diminish the inherent danger of poorly designed or placed carpeted mats, even if you have an obvious disdain for the safety and well-being of Americans. I don't the accidents got blown out of proportions. And I certainly don't think the people at NHTSA have personal agendas with Toyota. But hey, people are entitled to their own opinions. Just spare us from your lame excuses.

— validus00 (View Profile)

Posted on 10/1/2009 8:42:55 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 4   

Toyota will handle this well and emerge as a caring company that spent millions on a recall for floor mats. Their marketing arm is a great machine.

— hyundaifansdotcom (View Profile)

Posted on 10/1/2009 9:13:57 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: -1   

how is Tylenol comparable to this? that company actaully killed people. these recalls dont do that. if anything, they're just minor mistakes that become a problem if ignored. i doubt this will even sratch toyotas image in any way. no company is perfect and thats the bottom line of it.

— KZ258 (View Profile)

Posted on 10/1/2009 9:50:05 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 0   

Same way they did when Lexus did their mass recall back in the day.

— Brembo (View Profile)

Posted on 10/1/2009 9:57:54 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: -1   

Loose floor mats sliding under the throttle pedals are a problem in many cars. My 2006 Audi A8 had that problem - it happened twice before I ascertained the problem, and it was a bit frightening. There were clips in the carpet that were supposed to hold the mats in place, but they worked themselves loose every few days - I just slid the mats back in place and reclipped them on a regular basis.

Interestingly enough, my 2009 Audi A4, which is a cheaper car, DOES NOT have that problem. Go figure.

But I digress. I checked with my local Toyota dealer. The service writer told me that the cars in question have clips in the carpet designed to hold the floor mats in place. This "recall" is not a recall in the normal sense of the word, but an advisory. Toyota will supposedly decide at a future date if the clips need redesigning, or if customers simply need to be informed as to how to use the clips.

I can't access the article on this PC. This might be rehashing of what is in that article, but I thought I'd share my experience with you if it is not covered by the article.

— Audiphile (View Profile)

Posted on 10/1/2009 11:00:40 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 0   

To be honest I dont understand how so many people are getting all hot about this. Unlike Hyundaismoke who works for hyundai I wil not be biased about it. I work for Toyota and recently I have been dealing with customers who just laugh at this so called issue. Im a customer relations agent for toyota and my job is to deal with problems with the vehicles we sell. It has been a couple of days that this has been out there and honestly, we have not had any calls about this. I was asked once about it by a customer and I told him that as long as he has the floor mats latched like they should this will not happen. If they are used like they should be, this will not happen. I drive a camry and when the floor mats are latched, all weather or fabric, they do not move around or interfere with the gas pedal.

If the story changes and customer call volume increases in the following days relating to this issue I will definitely inform you guys. Just stating the facts from a more up close point of view.

— Arsen89 (View Profile)

Posted on 10/1/2009 11:35:41 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: -2   

Go buy yourself a BMW! Then you'll find out having a recall is better than no recalls. Buy a BMW with a six speed automatic transmission and you will likely find out how easily you can get into many unsafe situation like unintended stalling! It can also be so jerky that you cannot concentrate on your driving... Of course BMW is going to tell you there is no faults according to their computer and you don't know how to drive a BMW: it's supposed to be like that. They won't tell you they didn't even make that transmission and have no control over its quality, not to mention fixing it.

— ItsMi (View Profile)

Posted on 10/1/2009 1:15:32 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 1   

I dont Work for Hyundai, but I can tell you this one fact about our cars:

HYUNDAI PRODUCTS HAVE FLOOR MAT CLIPS THAT NEVER GET LOOSE, SO THE FLOOR MAT ALWAYS STAYS IN PLACE!!!!!!!!

— HyundaiSmoke (View Profile)

Posted on 10/1/2009 4:49:53 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 1   

copying another post and my response from another forum:

Personally, I think the driver of the car messed up and panicked. He paid for this with his life. This thought may seem cold, but my Dad and two Uncles were pilots in the USAAF during WWII and many times people made mistakes in which they paid for with their lives.


i fully agree.

again, it may seem cold, but the guy was a state trooper and SHOULD HAVE KNOWN BETTER.

i suspect he must've earlier STOMPED ON THE GAS, which caused it to get stuck in the mismatched mat. (and then panicked when he could not UNstomp. ) that's what my new driver nephew did when he got the throttle stuck on their buick.

kids, and troopers, STOMP ON the gas a lot more than ordinary folks.

toyota is over reacting, fortunately on the cautious side, by recalling 4 million vehicles. only a few likely have the wrong floor mats. and only a few of those have drivers who habitually STOMP on the loud pedal. which is why this was NEVER SEEN as a big problem earlier.

— XYZZ (View Profile)

Posted on 10/1/2009 11:16:39 PM | reply to this comment | Votes: 0   

Hyundaismoke,
Jam another floormat undearneath and see how well your clips work. If somebody did, I'm sure it wouldn't be there fault.

In one ear and out the other with you. The NHTSA identified the cause 2 years ago. 2 whole years ago and they didn't think a recall was necessary then. The cause was people putting the original floormat underneath the all weathers when they're not supposed to.
http://uk.reuters.com/article/idUKN2626974420070927

"Highway safety investigators concluded there was no defect with the product. The problem occurs when the all-weather mats, an optional feature, are placed on top of standard mats."
This was way back in Sept 26, 2007 before Toyota became #1.

You see that line that says "no defect with the product". Why suddenly is it defective now?

Even the NHTSA knows its BS.

— huu76 (View Profile)

Posted on 10/2/2009 12:27:21 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: -1   

"Highway safety investigators concluded there was no defect with the product. The problem occurs when the all-weather mats, an optional feature, are placed on top of standard mats."

Yup, just can't wait to see what lame ass excuse comes up next to refute this one.

— huu76 (View Profile)

Posted on 10/2/2009 12:30:31 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: -1   

XYZZ,
If anyone on this site knew how to drive standard, they'd know that when you're learning, in an emergency situation (ie stalling) you drop it into neutral and get your berings to determine if you should brake, steer or check your floormat incase they're Toyota's. Not worrying about stalling is one less thing on your mind.

— huu76 (View Profile)

Posted on 10/2/2009 12:34:32 AM | reply to this comment | Votes: 1