Toyota Defends the Hybrid: Now Says Diesels Not Cost Effective

Did they put all of the eggs in one basket?

This article clearly seems to be about Toyota's US operations. TOyota is not stupid, they know how to offer the best products tailored for each market. Hence they are developing a line of E85 enignes for Brazil, even though they seem to be smart enough to know that E85 in the US is all hype. Developing a diesel for the US that would meet the stringent emissions standards that Toyota has raised the bar to will be less effective than honing their hybrid technology. Toyota has a lot invested in hybrids as not only a fuel efficient, but also an exceptionally clean engine. If diesels cannot meet these standards then Toyota will have to admit that emissions are no longer important, thus negating all the work they have done on selling the concept of clean emissions-a risky proposition no dount.

Let Europe keep their dirty diesels. There's a whole lot about Europe I like more than the US, but American acceptance of hybrid technology over diesels is a clear pro on the US side. Someday diesels may match the cleanliness of today's hybrids, but by then hybrid technology (mpg, emissions and power) will have advanced to amazing levels.

Flame on, I'm sure.

Don't lump all of us in with California.

Actually Gogo, they are buying hybrids, hype or otherwise. Lexus's dramatic growth the past year in Europe has been fueled by the sales of its hybrids.

And tho hybrids haters love to throw the word hype around, let's just be clear. Hype is marketing, word of mouth and other forms of communication, all of which has been VERY successful for hybrids. Toyota and hybrid fans have successfully COMMUNICATED their amazing capabilities. So if hype is bad then I guess we should all go back to days of neanderthals, and stop communicating.

We can see how well the cab forward designs age.....not well, not well at all. Why is cab forward the way to go? If that were true, all race cars would look like halved eggs. There are many ways to be modern without looking like an egg.

race cars are NOT the arbiters of space efficiency. THAT is the advantage of cab-forward.

SPACE with reasonably aerodynamics as a bonus.

Toyota is banking on hybrids for the US only. It has been making putting diesels in Land Cruisers and other cars around the world for years and will continue to do so. If the US ever gets a knack for clean powerful diesels, Toyota can quickly bring them to market with it's partnership with Isuzu.

That is bull. Toyota is saying that because they have put so much money on hybrids in order to pass Honda, and now because Honda is talking of a new design in diesel, they're trying to down play diesel technology.

I guarantee you if Honda stays with their new clean diesel program and becomes very succesful, you will see ad from Toyota saying "We are the leader in diesel technology."

Thank you! That's exactly the reason. Toyota is a company just like GM. It's all about money. And no one has invested more in Hybrids than Toyota...they don't want to lose their investment and allow America to get hooked on diesels. Remember..Toyota doesn't make that much money (if any) on hybrids.

True, I just think they're jealous. For all the Pro-German whose been hating on Lexus for obvious reasons, wait and see when Audi and Porsche come out with their own hybrids, I'll have to wonder what they have to say.

^^^^lol at the last two words.

This is the first stupid statement I've heard out of toyota. All they need to do is look at what happened to GM and Ford when they said the same thing about hybrids. And, if they don't, Honda will. A diesel odyssey will debut in 09, presumably with highway gas mileage in the 30's. Say goodbye to any minivan sales toytoa.

TPL

unlike conventional otto cycle and diesel engines which have been around and presumably 'developed' and improved for 100 years, hybrids are still in the early phase of its development curve.

for ANY given amount of fresh development dollars/yen, there will likely be BIGGER gains applying them to hybrids than to diesels.

I think that hybrid technology is great, but current diesel technology is better for long distance drivers.

From what I have read, hybrids are at their best in stop and go city driving conditions(due to battery charging during breaking etc.) Once we start driving long distances at high speeds, the diesels outperform them significantly.

For someone like me who drives about 120 miles to work round-trip every day, the diesel saves me money and consumes far less fuel than the alternatives.

Living in Germany, I typically cruise between 80mph and 120mph as traffic permits. My vehicle is a 2.0 D4D Toyota Avensis 5speed manual(116hp). I get anywhere from 35 to 45 mpg depending upon how fast I drive. If I stay at 60-70mph, I can get 55-60mpg. As painful as it was for me to drive that slowly, I tested it for a week using my daily commute. By the way, this is not a very small car; it is a mid-sized station wagon.

Regarding emissions, I know that the particle filters currently installed on most new diesels dramatically reduce harmful emissions to put them on par with many regular gasoline engines (see Toyota D-CAT 2.2 as an example). Additionally, since diesel fuel economy is better during highway driving, one must consider the emissions savings of the fuel that the diesel does not burn in comparison with gasoline and hybrid motors.

Another plus for Diesel engines is that they typically last longer and burn very little fuel when the engine is idling.

That being said, I do not disagree that Hybrids are interesting. They are great for city driving. They will, however, be far more interesting once hybrid and diesel technologies are combined into one automobile. Imagine the fuel economy and emissions savings at that point!

Also, one concern I have regarding hybrids is battery life. If and when these must be replaced, how much is that going to cost? Also, what impact do all of these batteries have on the environment? (P.S. I am not a Green party member, but since this is the big selling point for hybrids, it should be addressed)

As far as the U.S. market is concerned, I think that they will gradually see that clean diesel technology is actually better for their wallets and the environment than they realize. It is my opinion that bad experiences with diesels in the past (1980s)have prejudiced the entire American market.