REVIEW: If you drive a BMW, Mercedes or Audi luxury sedan, this Lexus may spoil you forever

It's nice to see that the owner of this site has enough common sense to appreciate the LS for what it is. If only this site's readers and commentators could do the same.

All great points, 001.

Will, doesn't that video screen get in the way of the rear view mirror or is there a camera to bypass it?

Got remote control?

Jeeez.

001, autospies used to be so much better before you became a sell out.

How am I a sellout?

001

i guess if u dont like the car, everyone is a sellout who likes it, lol.

Agent 001,

This site was much better when your opinions weren't swayed by the fact that Lexus pays this site. Your clearly biased, and the constant Lexus articles (always positive) destroy your credibility.

Just because I see tremendous improvement across the board with Lexus products and their brand is absolutely on fire, I'm a sellout because they advertise here?

Give me a break...NO ONE buys us.

If you read the article I said that I usually prefer driver oriented cars and the S550 is better looking...among other things.

The new LS is awesome...whether you like to admit it or not.

It doesn't mean the others are bad.

001

This is how much people hate Lexus. They are so threatened by Lexus that they deboost even the owner of this site. Pathetic these haters are, pathetic.

Most of your articles are about Lexus (you even start topics on the SAME car), or worse yet, have the nerve to compare the ISF to the M3--truly a joke, only with the intention of starting a flame war and promote Lexus.

I don't like Lexus, and your constant articles aren't going to change that. What they will do, is make me less likely to frequent this site.

EURO FANS: THE BEST WAY TO STOP THIS NONSENSE IS TO IGNORE LEXUS ARTICLES.

I guess some will just never have enough respect and composure...

Shame, really.

All in all, this color combination is my favorite for the Lexus LS, white & tan.

A very nice car, but looks out of place next to the S-Class IMHO.

Thank you and have a great day,

el34

a real beautiful car and so is the GS.

Let us face it this car really goes up against the Infiniti and Acura because of price range.

Statement of fact.

This car may have lots of pampering electronics, however there is still no "wow" factor. This car draws no attention when driving down the highway like an S550 or Beamer 7-series does. True Its instrument cluster, center consule, dash, and exterior do nothing for me. Just a personal opionion.

I am there with you ..

"WOW factor" is perhaps the most subjective aspect of automobiles out there. I have a friend that literally said "wow" when a Pontiac Solstice pulled up behind us in the drive-thru. Yet when a Continental GT rolled by on the highway....nothing.

"are you kidding? I just saw one pass me on the road a few days ago, and right after that the new 7 series. The LS 460 looks so much better on the road, and has a much higher WOW factor then the 7 series. The LS looks magnificent on the road. I especially like it in silver color. "

This is coming from a Lexus fan.

I am all for BMW's, but seriously, I hate the 7 series in the styling department, much rather take a M5 over it. The New LS looks good in my opinion. But its just like Agent 001 said, going for a performance car, go for Mercedes or BMW, or just looking for luxury go with the LS.

Yeah. I couldn't agree more on this point. The LS in real life looks so much better than the photos. It really draw my attention from the road. Stunning! ! ! In where I live, the LS is real exclusive car on the road.

I am notably not a lexus fan but this car aint to bad after seeing it. However i do not like the front end or the interior dash/console design. but i like the side profile, and the back. It is a very big car

Should make a great limo.

Or a great Taxi.

stupid article ~

Lexus can never match the status, that the S-Class give to its high status clientèles

Lexus gives us there faux version of what they percieve to be luxury. In my area the new LS won't even get a second look where as an S550 will. Most of my higher end clients won't even consider a Lexus. Alot drive 7 series and S classes however.

It's the stylish digital clock, I'm tellin' ya!!!

Whats with all the "Hate" comments ? and yeah I can't afford a S550 either.

It's a shame that there are people like "Servertoobusy" who try to pass themselves off as intelligent human-beings. Everyone with eyes knows that the rhombus-like headlight design looks nothing like the rectangular headlight design of the unimpressive VW Phaeton. And other than that, the new LS retains the same grille it has had for a while now.

Agent 001: How long till the lobotomy scars heal up? :)
So now that you've been assimilated, why don't you just sit in the car with a IV-drip providing your nutrition, and a collostomy bag so you don't have to get out. You're all set!

Actually, I think it looks quite nice for a Toyota. Their "stolen" designs are always better than when they do it themselves (as in the "Echo" ... a special design for US that went over so well).

Its a nicely bloated-up Camry with a VW Phaeton front end and BMW rear. Well done. Someone said it won't command attention on the road, but neither does the Phaeton that it obviously copied (with a slight "ricing up" of the headlights).

If I ever decide that I don't like driving and prefer to sit in the back with a chauffeur at the wheel, then this is the car, no doubt.
And I can compare lobotomy scars with Agent 001.

Wrong, entertainment PKG in the S550 comes in the rear headrests. Where it should be! You watch soon lexus will do the same and it will be a great innovation, an industry first... give me a break!

Wouldn't your neck hurt looking up and to the side all the time?

on the 7-series the video screen is between the front seats, it doesn't come down from the ceiling.

The TV is smackdab in the middle obstructing the view, but it has self parking so you won't drive into trash cans.

A positive remark.

el34

its funny how people get so worked up about cars. Understand, lexus fans are not telling you to disown your german cars and go buy a lexus right now. Agent 001 just wrote a nice article about a car HE enjoyed, hes not trying to make you try it, so keep your personally comments to yourself.

personally, i dont know what you guys are talking about when it comes to the styling. I think it looks great, but thats just my opinion. The S class looks great too, ill give you that. Ill even give you that the S class has more presence, but the fact is Lexus has created a luxury car that can stand next to the S class whether or not you think so. Guys are so weird :)

to clarify things, im a guy too, lol

I agree.

All cars in this class are beautiful.

Why else would we be paying $80K (or in the case of the Benz, $90K) for them?

The have a white one here in St.Maarten. My dad's friend drives it around.It makes no sense becuz we don't have highways or even big enuf roads for it.I even wonder why my uncle bought the 2000 S500 when its not meant for this island. He got it str8 from Germany. I love the interior of the LS it is classic rest is sucky.

"I’m convinced that no one understands what Americans want in their luxury car better than Lexus."

Exactly.
Americans.

I like the LS, it is my favorite/least disliked Lexus, and it sure is very luxurious, but I honestly could not compare it to the German competition and say "I'd have the Lexus". Lexus really doesn't have enough status or enough of a powerful brand image, and for me, is rather clinical. I know it's odd, but i feel the S class and A8 are more sumptuous. They may not have more equipment, but the feeling from the wood and leather is better. Hiding many of the buttons with panels or a single controller works well, turning a button-filled place into a more relaxing place to be. The S class in that way does it perfectly. The Lexus has too many buttons and switches on show, they should hide some of them behid panels. See the rear control area? All those seat control buttons? Looks to cluttered IMO, hide them! BMW and Merc put them on a foldable armrest, so they are hidden when you don't want them.
We don't even get the 460L in Britian, only the 460, so no rear seat ottomans for us.
However, I do think the LS is a brilliant car, and the best Lexus ever, but it just doesn't do it for me. Too many buttons, too much technology and electronic wizadry, less on the basics of pure luxury, which is to have peace and serenity, and in the rear of the car, there are too many intrusions.

And I would prefer 2, headrest mounted screens that can play 2 different things.

"Don't get me started on that one. I am so in love with BMW Individual, Audi Exclusive and Mercedes-Benz designo.

The quality of the leather, wood or any surface in the German competitors is just lightyears away from any competitor. "

YES!!!

Desingo is my favorite, practically endless customisation of everything. You can have stone in some of the models I believe.
The white leather (porcelain I think) is amazing, and with black wood and black pearlescent paint it's stunning.

Oh and the handling things is quite pronounced. Nissan spent 6 months making the Murano better for Europe, so good now the US get it! Nearly all cars have sharper steering and firmer suspension in Europe. It's when Cadillac doesn't change the Escalade's suspension that people really notice the complete slush-box of a ride it has, one road tester said "It has all of the composure of blancmange in an earthquake".

Rupert, Lexus are stingy with the TV's.

Only one until the next redesign.

Shocked. First person I've seen here criticize the LS for not being "pure luxury." It doesn't get more "strictly luxury" than the LS.

Also, the first person here to criticize the LS for "too much technology." I guess some just cannot handle self-parking, or an 8-Speed transmission. Sure they're needless, many may even say excessive, which has been an attribute of "luxury automobiles" for a long time. Guess not when a Lexus has it though.

It's simply a matter of your personal taste. Hassling through the "ingenuity" of iDrive and COMAND may make you feel like you're in a true luxury car. However, others may feel that the ease of more efficient, one-button functioning is more luxurious.

"Desingo is my favorite, practically endless customisation of everything."

Really? Here, we only get three design options for each MB model- and you can't change anything about the packages. It's not worth the extra $7K here, IMO. Some of them aren't any better than the standard colors- but there's one color on the S550, designo "Mystic White," which is an unbelievably beautiful white over black/white two-tone color, with black wood trim. I would gladly pay for that.

Audi Exclusive and BMW Individual cater to a more discerning client on all the other models, however.

Anthony, you didn't understand Rupert's post. He didn't say the LS wasn't luxurious. He just means that there's so much richness to the leather and the wood of the Germans. You can get a stitched, full-leather dashboard/door panel on the A8, or special matte wood in the 7 Series, or custom black wood on the S-Class. They come in many customizeable colors on the inside, and the pure class that radiates from these custom surfaces is just far beyond anything else under $160K. You'd have to sit in an S500 designo, A8L Exclusive or 750Li Individual to believe.

*S550 designo...

Eh, I guess it goes either way!

As far a leather quality is concerned..the leather on my 2001 E38 did not weather as well as the leather on my 2000 LX470. The leather was discolorating and cracking on the driver's seat while the one in LX470 was still very smooth. They were both driven on daily basis and the leather was treated regularly.

Let the lexus hate began.

You are getting gawkers in a Lexus. Dear God you must be in Southern Cali. I am yet to see the production Lexus that even begins to raise my pulse. Incredibly reliable, YES. Good value, YES. Exciting, HARDLY. Just accept the fact that some people find Lexus' about as bland as government cheese.

The thing that really bugs me with this car is the interior. The wood trim looks dated and cheap. And why must ALL of the buttons be this sparkly grahpite? IT LOOKS cheap!!! And stupid! Please, I'm sure those buttons are high quality, but they look terrible....
Please fix it Lexus! I think a more sophicated (exotic?) wood and nice black or grey buttons NOT sparkly, would look soo much better and raise this car up.
But I would just so much rather take a clean, sohisticated, austere, interior like in the S550, 750, or A8. Even the Jag XJ has a better interior design.
No, I am not bashing Lexus, I'm just giving suggestions.

The thing that really bugs me with this car is the interior. The wood trim looks dated and cheap. And why must ALL of the buttons be this sparkly grahpite? IT LOOKS cheap!!! And stupid! Please, I'm sure those buttons are high quality, but they look terrible....
Please fix it Lexus! I think a more sophicated (exotic?) wood and nice black or grey buttons NOT sparkly, would look soo much better and raise this car up.
But I would just so much rather take a clean, sohisticated, austere, interior like in the S550, 750, or A8. Even the Jag XJ has a better interior design.
No, I am not bashing Lexus, I'm just giving suggestions.

matt black buttons would lift it considerably. Or like I said before, hide them.

001, Tell us how many cars has Mercedes, BMW, Audi, Porsche, Aston Martin, Bently, Rolls, given you to play with as long as Lexus has? How many and for how long? I get the distinct impression that Lexus is the only one..I know if it was me, I would be very much swayed in my 'opinions' about the freebee. Heck, just going to the weekend drive they put on did wonders for my opinion of the cars..I don't blame you, its hard when someone is as generous as Lexus has been. But for a moment do you not think there is some bias because of this? I really am asking as I know it would be difficult if not impossible to be totally objective. I know Lexus is a fantastic brand but have you considered that in your reviews and worry that if you were not as positive in your comments you may lose a very very nice privlege that the others won't provide?

We get cars from all the manufacturers to test...whatever we want, we can get our hands on, except Aston...but we haven't pushed it with them yet.

And yes, they all hope we say good things but you guys should know us by now.

NO ONE gets the praise unless they deserve it.

001

This is actually my LEAST favourite Lexus.

Why?

Because the dashboard looks like it belongs in the GS, not a 'luxury flagship'.

Because the styling is confused. Why did Lexus make the LS look slab-sided, like the entire car has been 'pinched'?

The rear seats are novel, but don't make up for the more important shortcomings with the interior. It doesn't look 'flagship' special. That's because the architecture is too similar to that found in the IS and GS models.

And answer me this: Why are people who don't like Lexus called 'haters'? That's such childish word.

Overall my judgement is that the LS is refined enough to be a flagship, but fails to impress with its generic interior and challenged styling.

To like the LS is fine, but it isn't a patch on the S-Class.

"The rear seats are novel, but don't make up for the more important shortcomings with the interior. It doesn't look 'flagship' special. That's because the architecture is too similar to that found in the IS and GS models."

"Overall my judgement is that the LS is refined enough to be a flagship, but fails to impress with its generic interior and challenged styling.

To like the LS is fine, but it isn't a patch on the S-Class. "

My sentiments exactly.

I have posted almost the exact words before, but most of the Lexus fans (if not all) have passed them off as "Lexus hater" posts.

He was boosted, and I was de-boosted for agreeing with him?

Some things, I just don't understand...

Okay German fans, I here will never sell out but I have to give credit where credit is due. I do think the LS has the luxury required to compete in this category. The ride is comfortable and it does float. Luxury more than sport is what Lexus about.

I still think the A8 and the S550 is better looking. As for the luxury level, I can say that any car in this segment is high quality. The looks are all over the scale that everyone has to one to like. That's why we have flame wars.

I'm not going to fight over something that will never end. Despite the fact that Lexus barely has any history compared to it's German counterparts, I must agree that Lexus has come a long ways whether it's a hit or a miss in the luxury segment.

It's just when it comes down to it, I would be visiting a European dealership for luxury before a Lexus even though i love the GS. Don't get me wrong, Lexus owners have all the right to receive respect from others as their cars aren't all that ugly.

BUT! it's just the German's have been around longer therefore the symbols have been embedded into most people's minds that it is a symbol of class, luxury, & heritage. For Merc, it clearly shows who has been the innovator in luxury auto making. Benchmark technology first fitted on a Benz is an understatement in regards to what they have contributed in the auto industry in the last century.

Marketing is a great talent Lexus can hire and for the mass they have captured many on-lookers in the last few years. Only difference between Lexus and it's competition is that they need less of advertising. Then again Lexus is a teenager compared to the elderly BMW & Merc.

-Agent63

I know of many people, including Europeans that consider the Lexus brand a symbol of class and luxury. "Heritage" no, of course simply because they do not have it, but that does not mean that their products cannot or should not be regarded highly. This type of attitude, so prevalent on this site, really pisses me off at times. In the early 1900s, do you think people did not consider a BMW because "Daimler has so much more history than BMW." Ridiculous.

Audi is older than BMW.

But good post, LOL.

Why must every Lexus article turn to this? Why can't the LS be appreciated and admired for what it is and what it does well. Did someone needlessly bash the S-Class for its hefty price and questionable exterior and totally unoriginal interior with every article about it? No.

And if so many people really think that Lexus is paying this site, then why do you feel the need to post hateful comments here? It doesn't make sense to continue to visit a site that supposedly supports a brand that you have so much hate for.

"Did someone needlessly bash the S-Class for its hefty price and questionable exterior and totally unoriginal interior with every article about it?"

It's great to put this in your pompous "anti-flame" post.

it seems lexus have packed a whole lot of technology and luxury into this car, but have lacked on the design side, and from what i hear the driving side. IMHO it looks like a glorified Toyota Camry, moreso from the back.

Isn't it ridiculous?

The beauty of this Lexus LS460L is just "STUNNING"; can't wait for the Lexus LS600 hl. The beauty of the Lexus LS600 hl is comparable the Maybach, RR, and the Bentley.

The LS600 HL is not comparable to Maybach, RR, and Bentley. I'm sorry to bug you about this but you have to stop believing that. Just because it's a bit longer and it has reclinable seats and has seats like a Maybach it does not mean it can be comparable. It's in the A8, 7, and S-Class category don't forget that. Just because the LS is a favorite in the US does not mean it can compare with the big boys in Europe.

The LS is a nice car and I'm sure it is comfortable but the ambiance is nothing like the ultra luxury sedans for the elite. The LS is targeting the mass just like A8, 7, and S-class. Though it is expensive it is not as expensive & exclusive as the Phantom, Maybach, and Bentley's.

Nice car, some pretty good technology, looks the part of a limo type car for the mass consumer but is a fraction of the cost . So all in all good value for money it's cheaper than it's competition as well. It is expected and should be reliable or else the back order for these will drive Lexus to the ground in terms of credibility for what they stand for, RELIABLE automobiles.

-Agent63

I agree, Lexus is the new Cadillac. It's American luxury and that is why it fails overseas. Cadillac has now shifted its focus from big luxo barges to sporty. Cadillac > Toyota.

Yes but you miss the point.

Cadillac in the 50's and 60's was an icon of engineering and design, filled with character and a real 'all American' personality, and unashamedly so.

Lexus doesn't have those attributes. It could be compared to an efficient appliance, lacking design character and a forward-looking vision.

Unlike Cadillac in its heyday, Lexus builds cars for now, not the future. The designs do not break any ground and don't evoke any sort of passion.

And of course, apart from the Hybrid system, the LS and all Lexus models for that matter don't have any revolutionary technology the competitors don't have.

Lexus the new Cadillac? No.

Whomever can sit in front of their computer and call the new LS, self-parking, 8-Speed transmission and all, NOT revolutionary needs to pull the stick out of their hole.

"It's the most technologically advanced, most luxurious, most reliable car in the world."

This ISN'T biased?

Again, I'm not flaming the LS...

But "most reliable" is definitely the most debatable there. Just because it's a reliable car doesn't mean it's the MOST reliable!

The entry level Volkswagen Touran has self parking.

"Wasn't there an article on this same website about a week ago saying the 1998 LS 400 was more reliable then a 2006 Mercedes ML500? And that the 98 LS was the most reliable car? "

Does the fact that it's more reliable than an ML500 mean it's the most reliable car EVER? No! What is wrong with you? Your incredibly flawed logic is just beyond my comprehension.

And where did you hear that the '98 LS400 was the most reliable? Even if that was true, does that mean the LS460 is the most reliable?

zaza- you make no sense what so ever, just because a 98 LS is Reliable doesnt mean a car made 9 years later is also reliable, I am not saying the LS isnt reliable but your reasoning is way off.

I can't believe I was de-boosted for that!!!

Lexus fans, everything I said here was true!

I know the LS460 will be a reliable car, just not the MOST reliable in the world!

Unlike many here, I have been in the 7-Series, A8, new S-Class, and LS460L, so I speak from experience, unlike many here who I theorize are lying. Otherwise, a rational, unbiased person would be able to realize that all four of these cars would be a dream to own. A sensible, calm person would be able to understand that each of these four cars have different approaches to luxury. There is no question that the LS is more of a "chauffeur's" car and that the other three are more "drivers'" cars. (Although I must note that the A8's ride can be very unforgiving at times.) The 7-Series has very direct steering, and gives you an immense amount of confidence on very curvy country roads; it definitely handles the best. Does that mean the 7-Series is the best out of all of them? No. The S-Class also handles quite good, and does still seem to maintain a great deal of refinement.

I don't know what all the fuss is about the LS. Yes, its suspension is "softer" than all the others, but I can report that this is not a "bad" thing. The 7-Series and S-Class may take corners better, but there is no question that the LS can take a pothole or railroad track better than any of them.

Continuing, a reasonable person should also be able to understand that these four cars have different approaches in terms of design. The A8, 7-Series, and S-Class are all uber-German machines with the finest in cutting edge design and technology inside and out. There's no disputing that regardless of your actual opinion on the interior/exterior design of the 7-Series, it is a heavily-"copied" car as of now. The A8 is now the oldest out of this group, yet still, it is lauded for it's elegant and simplistic design. The S-Class is bold and "in-your-face" if you will. The S-Class design did throw me off the first time I saw it, and it honestly did remind me of the Nissan Altima (which has been noted by several others). However as time has passed I have come to realize and appreciate its design: the new S-Class's look commands attention and has tremendous presence wherever it goes.

And then there's the LS. I don't think anyone has made any bones about it: it's rear was inspired by the rear of the 5-Series. Do I think it's horrible? No. Do I think that it's a better utilization of the design for the overall car? Yes. As for the rest of the design of the LS, it still retains its "incognito" elegance, and even has a sense of endearing stealthiness to it in person. It is a major departure from past Lexus designs and I, a rational, unbiased person, can at least appreciate that.

The interiors of these cars also take four very different approaches. The A8 has always been marked for its outstanding interior. I drove one that had a pop-up navigational system, and even though I typically hate those, I found Audi's fantastic the way it hides itself elegantly into the front-panel of the dash. The 7-Series interior is in my opinion, the most radical out of the four. It tries to be efficient a

It tries to be efficient and very "to-the-point" but with iDrive it fails miserably. Of course it does not take too long to figure out iDrive but it is still a hassle, specially for a short trip to the grocery store. Many times, I didn't even bother listening to the radio. Also, Lexus gets ragged on a lot around here for extensively using black plastic. The same applies to nearly every BMW in the line-up.

The S-Class interior was honestly underwhelming when I first saw it. Here's the flagship of the most lauded automobile brand in history, and they use the same layout of the heavily-already-criticized rival, the 7-Series. This was mind-boggling to me. However, after spending time in the car, I came to appreciate what it does well. It is a very clean and efficient design. There are hardly any buttons in sight. Overall, I realized that they took the rival's idea and made it way better in their own right. COMAND is not the most brilliant system to use for any car, but again, it is an improvement over iDrive. The fit and finish of materials in the S-Class are also above anything else in the class, no bones about it.

The LS's interior has its own distinct character. It takes a totally different approach than the other three. Part of understanding this involves understanding the character of the entire different brands. Lexus is very anti-iDrive/COMAND. That much is clear. In realizing this, you will come to understand why there are more buttons in the car than in the others. All functions operate directly. More times than not, most functions can be controlled at the touch of ONE button, as opposed to the spinning of a knob through 4 different menus on the navi display. For the Lexus customer, I think this is what they want, and what they appreciate. There also should be no doubt in anyone's mind that the level of build quality in the LS is on par with its rivals, contrary to belief. No, every surface you touch is not leather or metal. However, are Lexus interiors known for looking just as good 15 years from now as they did the day they rolled off the assembly line? Yes.

I do not think anyone here is saying that the LS is better than any other car in the class. However I DO see some hypocritical and ignorant persons claiming that the S-Class is the best in this class. Why? They say because of heritage. It's a shame that a segment such as "heritage" and "handling" are the deciding factors as to what make a great full-size luxury sedan. It takes a truly mature person to be able to understand that "prestige" and "handling" can only take you so far. I'm truly tired of people on this site trying to literally castrate anyone who states that they value reliability and quality in their automotive purchases. Grow up.

And...I seriously doubt there are 15 different people reading this thread boosting/deboosting everyone. I too think it's amazing that even the founder of this site is not shown any respect, just because he posts a positive story about h

I too think it's amazing that even the founder of this site is not shown any respect, just because he posts a positive story about his own personal positive experience with a Lexus. Just goes to show that Will & Co. are correct in their observations that Lexus is the most hated/feared brand here. Never has brand made grown men feel so insecure about themselves. Grow up gentleman! You're arguing over $80K+ luxury snooze machines! Pick one and be happy that you are finally retired.



And no, I do not expect most of you to read all of that, I was just bored on a Saturday night.

Damn, I had no idea it was that long!

"Unlike many here, I have been in the 7-Series, A8, new S-Class, and LS460L, so I speak from experience, unlike many here who I theorize are lying. Otherwise, a rational, unbiased person would be able to realize that all four of these cars would be a dream to own. A sensible, calm person would be able to understand that each of these four cars have different approaches to luxury. There is no question that the LS is more of a "chauffeur's" car and that the other three are more "drivers'" cars. (Although I must note that the A8's ride can be very unforgiving at times.)"

I agree with you that they're all wonderful vehicles and simply gems to have.

The last line is what gets me, and makes me think you haven't driven the A8.

Unless you live in Europe, where the suspension is probably stiffer, then you're probably lying.

I drove the A8 SWB on two extended test-drives, one in November and one in January. My wife was going to get one before we decided to buy a new house instead.

I can whole-heartedly say that the A8 has one of the smoothest rides in automobile-dom. Normal too stiff for you? Set the MMI to "Comfort" on the air suspension. Although, I can't imagine why Normal would be too stiff. Only for a Lexus fan...

Side note: my wife has an RX330. Not the level of smoothness of an LS460, but coming out of a Lexus, she thought the A8 was super-smooth.

I have driven the S550. Two family friends have them. A close friend of mine bought an LS460 SWB, and I drove that. I haven't driven the 750, but I've driven the 745 (one of the families with an S550 traded a 745Li in for one).

One more thing:

"The 7-Series and S-Class may take corners better, but there is no question that the LS can take a pothole or railroad track better than any of them."

Another warning sign flashed here for me. I doubt you've driven the new S550 if you honestly believe this.

The S-Class's ride is still super-smooth. It is quite possibly the smoothest (non-$300K) car in the world. It just happens to also handle well.

Otherwise, I enjoyed your post(s). Very well-composed and mostly factual.

Aargh, LAST ONE...

"More times than not, most functions can be controlled at the touch of ONE button, as opposed to the spinning of a knob through 4 different menus on the navi display. For the Lexus customer, I think this is what they want, and what they appreciate."

I agree. I also believe that buyers of 7/S/A8 enjoy spinning through the cars' beautiful control interfaces. I surely liked my seat time in these cars. Not the easiest to operate, no, but all the gadgetry and the way it's all executed more than makes up for it.

"However I DO see some hypocritical and ignorant persons claiming that the S-Class is the best in this class. Why? They say because of heritage."

That's not how I see it. "Heritage" is vague and isn't a reason for a car to be best. I think it's engineering excellence.

The W221 S is the first Mercedes-Benz in about a decade to go back to their much envied "over-engineering" method. Everything about it is executed with the highest attention to detail, be it steering feel or the quality of the metal on the seat controls. The interior is dazzlingly beautiful, and is filled to the brim with only leather/wood/chrome/aluminum. The exterior is controversial, but I love it. The car has a great presence and looks more elegant with each passing day. The engine is perhaps the best V8 in this class, though that's also objective. Super-smooth and quiet at low speeds, but you can make it growl.

As if you haven't noticed by my gushing, I love the car. There's no sedan I wouldn't rather have as of now.

Too bad I can't bring myself to get a sedan again!

We'll agree to disagree then. There is no question that these four cars are the top four smoothest riding cars sub-$300K, I think everyone can at least attest to that.

However, after extensively driving all four of these cars, I can confidently say that the LS was the most "floaty" out of all of them. Many of your Euro-crazed friends have used the same term, but with negative connotations. But why? Isn't "floaty" EXACTLY what you want a full-size luxury sedan to be? I fully understand the heavily-reinforced point that handling is always a nice thing to have, even though I do not agree with the LS being attacked for its lack of handling. If you want handling, then get the 7-Series, my feelings wont be hurt, but do not try and insult a Lexus owner because their car cannot grip a corner, that's not on that person's list of priorities as much as smoothness.

It's simple- I just think you're lying.

The S is nothing like the 7. The 7's calling card is handling.

On the other hand, the S-Class has supreme comfort and composure, but it also HAPPENS to have some handling. It's always been like this. They've always been super-smooth, athletic cars.

The last I remember reading the newspaper or watch the news, that American auto company is struggling. The big three almost went bankrupt? now Chrysler is being sold to whomever want it. Ford is struggling really bad, they have numbermous recall this past month.

Stop living the past, it not the 50s or 60s anymore. It is the year 2007 where Japanese brand is the most success brand in the world.

If I want to compare the Lexus LS600 hl to the Maybach, RR and the Bentley, there are nothing you can do about it. It is my opinion so "BACK OFF", got it? good......Just people are millionaire does mean they will buy a RR, Bentley or the Maybach. There are many younger millionaire or billionaire that would rather own a Audi A8, BMW 760i or the Lexus LS600 hl instead. Just like the Audi R8, some people would buy that instead of the Lambo Gallardo. It all about preference.

I do believe that the LS600 can be compared among the likes of the Phantom etc. In truth, doesn't the LS460L have more interior space than the Phantom?

I think what the Euro crew is getting hung up on is simply the status and reputation of all these cars. All Rolls-Royces and Bentleys are 100% hand-made, making them on an entirely different level than Lexus and Mercedes, even though the paint on the new LS is hand-sanded, and the steering wheel leather is hand-buffed a few million times.

Wow, a Lexus love fest.

I don't believe a single car in this class competes with the Maybach, the Phantom or the Flying Spur/Arnage.

Why?

It has nothing to do with technology or ride comfort or even performance. Want performance in your luxury sedan? Go buy an S65 AMG instead of that Maybach. There's no denying that the S65 is an amazing ride...

But the ultra-expensive other trio aforementioned offer something nothing in the sub-$100K class can match. Not just exclusivity. But there's so much more.

The customization of these cars is mind-blowing. "What type of trees would you like to be cut down for your Maybach, sir?" or "Is this the right type of piping to go along with the Saddle leather in your Continental Flying Spur, ma'am?" are questions the buyers of these cars hear all the time. And there's more than that. The opulence of the materials... it's beyond mere words. And easily well beyond any A8, 7 Series, S-Class or LS.

Then there's the presence. Each and every one of these inflate-o-price yacht/cars that rolls off the hand-operated assembly line grabs attention like no other four-door car. Being asked if you're a celebrity while driving one of them is probably routine. The Roller demands the most stares, with the Conti FS following closely. Maybach might not be as pretentious, but people know what it is.

And the ownership experience is impeccable. They might not be the most reliable cars on the planet, but if anything breaks, they'll fix it before you can say "I drive a Bentley." I can't imagine how curteous the dealers must be.

These cars are just above and beyond in every respect.

001, I am going to throw up.

The de-boosting system is the most immature thing on this website.

I thought the flame wars had pushed me over the edge...

BUT THIS.

I got de-boosted to -3, for WHAT?!

I didn't ONLY say the Maybach/Phatom/Continental were better than the LS460- I said they were better than any car in the sub-$100K class.

Why?

Did anyone who de-boosted me actually read my comment?

Why do I even try?...

The 460 can't hang with the big boys, so stop tryin'.

What's up with the engine cover?...I can't see the engine.

S-Class the most beautiful car in the world.

The LS, from a recent history standpoint, has always looked too bulky and bloated to me. The new model, despite being a sort of “land whale”, represents a significant step forward in that respect. It is better proportioned than the previous model, which was very obvious in its Japanese origins as far as its design is concerned.
I was very surprised when looking at one, at exactly how small it actually felt, even though the pictures made me believe it was much larger. Its interior was much like the one above. This interior is a significant step forward from the previous version as well, which I always felt as if the dash were going to attack me. This sense of a sense of the invasion of my personal space by the dash was also shared by the SC: these two are the only cars I have ever been in that felt that way.
I was also surprised that the dash is plastic, I expected leather and stitching, both of which were entirely absent except along the doors. The buttons are small and sort of precise feeling. The problem I found is the lack of practicality in the gadgets. The reclining seats are pretty much useless if you are even of average height. Nobody in my family, not even my mother [6’ tall without heels; she is a 100% Swedish woman (and former model BTW)] would come close to being able to use the reclining seats. The average height of the American man must be 6’ tall or so. It strikes me as more of a gimmick than anything.
This is not the only thing which suggests such; the self-parking system needs a space which is so immense you would be hard pressed to find one large enough. The space, as I recall, must be 23 feet long. That is a rather large space. Now, I am aware that it can also assist in parking in side-by-side parking, such as in a typical parking lot, but really there is not much that is provided by it in lieu of simple sonic proximity alarms so you don’t back into something.
The car in all seems so…parochial and uncharismatic in a way. I know they say that certain design aspects were based upon this or that. I really don’t care if the lights were based off of Baccarat: I wouldn’t even care if it was based off of Lalique: It actually is neither. I think that is ultimately the problem: the car primarily represents emulation of other things which are signs of luxury.

Few things:

Unless you were not in the "L" version, the LS is quite large (even the non-"L" version honestly).

I sense it was more of a personal problem that you felt the dashboard of a Lexus was going to attack you.

The average height of an American is not above 6 feet, and even so, the reclining seats are nothing short of what chauffeured clients expect. And if they actually are too tall, then tough, they just can't use the feature, but this doesn't mean the feature should be considered a "gimmick."

Of course the self-parking feature requires you to find a big enough parking space, no different from large cars that do not have self-parking.

Lastly, anyone who cannot see that the LS is indeed a luxurious automobile in its own right needs to take their biased blinders off.

It was the L. I remember thinking it looked a bit...dainty. Of course, that may not be a fair assuption teh A8 L bordered on it too..and the only car which I find definitly not is the Rolls Royce Phantom.

What makes the self-park gimicky is that the size of the space required depends upon whether a person it parking it or the machine is parking it. The parking system does not provide for 2-stage parallel parking, nor, if you look at the videos, does it turn the wheel fully to the opposite direction, to cut into the space more acutely; which would allow it to park in a smaller space. Perhaps with refinement this problem can be addressed.

Looking it up, you are right: the average American man is only 5'9". I am 6'2" [124 lbs: my mother's genetics thank god] and know that I am tall, but I didn't realize that the United States was country of midgets.

001, I like the LS, but about 75% of this article is heavily objective.

"It is quite a bit larger than the last LS and in real life it has a beautiful statuesque presence.

And that white pearl paint job!!!! No one does paint better! "

Some wouldn't agree.

"And more expensive looking than the competition. "

I repeat. This one is HUGELY objective, more than anything else you said. None of the cars in this class look cheap.

"But the practical side of me pipes right back and says…But the drive quality is VERY close to the S550, BMW 750 or Audi A8. Still not as driver oriented, but damn close. "

Drive quality is also objective. The question is what you want- comfort or performance? Or a split of both? You can't just say it's "VERY" close. Some might not agree!

"Plus, for the first time in its evolution, the design of this car is GORGEOUS.

Test drive one and watch the gawkers go crazy when you pull up beside them.

This is a car that looks SO much better than the photos when its driving down the road, you need to withhold judgment until you see it in person.

Not as good looking in my opinion as the new S550 sport (close) but better looking than the BMW 750 and Audi A8. "

I don't think it's "GORGEOUS." I think it's nice and somewhat elegant, but far from "gorgeous." Yes, I've seen it in person. Unlike some cars, it didn't blow me away when I saw it in person. Photos don't leave much to the imagination.

IMO it's nowhere near as nice-looking as the S550 OR A8. 7 is close. I'm not flaming here, but that was just a filthy comment.

"The decision between all these models has become harder than ever…they’re ALL great.

For the first time ever in my opinion, there is no runaway winner in this segment…it all boils down to which one YOU like best or how much you want to spend."

This is the only opinion I agree with. Ironically, it contradicts the rest of your article.

...er...don't you mean "subjective"

Hopefully he does, and when he realizes this mistake, he should also be able to note that his comment is equally "subjective."

Yes.

I have no idea why, but I get so confused between those two.

Anthony, give me one thing I said that was subjective.

It happens. The other day in one of my classes I mean to say "Ethics is the common set of rules for social interaction", but at the last moment thought of the word "discourse" So it came out:

"Ethics is the common set of rules for social intercourse."

Ha! I would be burning red!

If you cannot figure out that every one of your responses to 001's opinions were subjective then I suggest you go back to high school English.

You are spewing you OPINIONS about someone else's OPINIONS.

A common problem that I sense between most of you German "enthusiasts" is that everything you believe about German cars is fact, and everything else is "subjective." It's a tool that you use often. "Your opinion about Lexus is totally subjective, Lexus is NOT as good as the Germans" is a fundamental phrase that spews from your keyboard often.

I was. But everyone got a good laugh out of it...

No one does better paint???

Look at the Mercedes Designo colors.

Roll-Royce does better paint & colors.

Lamborghini too!

I meant on a standard production car...geeeesh!!!!!!!!!

001

It's hard to measure paint quality.

Try keying these cars and see what happens.

And you're stating this, as if every other blogger on this site doesn't do the same, be it a Lexus fan or an Audi fan or a BMW fan.

That's the fun of this site. You think I would ever argue like this in reality?

Otherwise, I don't feel so well about complimenting your post. You seem to be like every other self-titled "un-biased" Lexus fan. However, that's an early observation, and you don't know enough to judge me, either.

Do you believe I haven't owned any other company but Audi and only like Audi? I have owned... let's see, here's just a few:

Datsun 510

VW Rabbit

Saab 900 Turbo

Acura Vigor

Acura TL

Audi A6 2.7T quattro

Audi S4 Cabriolet / A3 2.0T DSG (current)

^This is a reply to Anthony, but, as usual, the "reply" button is acting up.

I make no bones about your "compliments." Take them back if you play those childish games. I read this site all the time, but refrain from posting, because most of you do not seem to be interested in what I have to say. Also because most of the time I just agree with (most of) Will's posts.

I do consider myself an "unbiased" fan, for I like all cars, not just one brand. My first car was a Chevrolet, so I need not consistently stick beside one brand. I think all brands have their strongpoints and weakpoints. As of now, I own a Lexus GS430, Mercedes E500, Audi TT, and a Chrysler 300C. Plus, I have owned many more cars in the past, just as you have.

However, I find it totally ridiculous that Lexus gets so much crap on this site. I have no problem with a rational criticism of the brand, but day-after-day attacks that you can almost count will turn into nothing more than an exchange of personal insults really bothers me about this site. Then a few of these clowns have the nerve to accuse this site and its owner of being payed off, yet they continue their trashy posts. That really gets me. I can say that most likely after tonight, I will never post as much as I have tonight. I was just bored tonight, and didn't see Will in sight, so decided to give this "defend Lexus" thing a try. :)

^^^To S4...

You don't seem to understand that I am not one of the "attackers" of Lexus. Their cars are fine. I wouldn't own one in the near future, but that doesn't mean I "hate" them.

Some of the German fans on this site needlessly bash them, yes.

I don't feel that I'm one of them.

There are a few that I find quite nice- the IS350, more than the rest. I also like the GS450h a lot, and the new LS is good, as it should be.

My wife has an RX330, and if I didn't think it was a good car, I wouldn't have bought it for her. She is a repeat customer- had an RX300 before. It's been a pleasure for road trips.

She wants a sedan for her next car, however. I live in the northern suburbs of Chicago, near the lake, where it is actually significantly cooler. In the winter months, of course, it snows heavily. I just wouldn't trust her with a RWD car, which is why I don't want her to consider the LS. Unless they make an LS460 AWD in the next year, of course.

You have owned more than me :)

I saw an LS the other day and my first thought was I don't really like the looks of the GS. The 7 series is instantly recognizable as is everything else in the class. You want to talk revolutionary then lets talk Jag XJ. Under 3700 lbs for a full size luxury sedan with a ride/handling mix few other than the S class can match. If Lexus had cars with soul then I would be willing to spend $80k on one. Go drive a CL600 or S600 and then drive the Lexus and tell me what you think.

Been there, done that, the LS is a fine car.

are you kidding me, the XJ is the biggest piece of shitake mushrooms. the looks are so outdated both interior and out. I dont care how light it is, that car is embarassing to drive.

Like hell it is. I drive one. I am treated excellently wherever I go in it: including Cherry Creek mall where they park it right in front on the circular drive and don't charge me for valet. In fact I am one of few "preferred valet customers".

That is to Lexuskindaguy....

Zaza,

Ah, say what you will and all you desire.

But realize:

Disreguard is the highest form of contempt.

zaza, I highly doubt you've driven the current model XJ.

I had held the same opinion of it... before I drove one.

It may not look much different from the last generation, but wow, is it a huge improvement.

It has a fantastic balance between ride comfort and agile handling. I hadn't realized that many people do not know this.

The interior, while not packed with gadgetry like the others, is sumptuous. It has the highest-quality materials and, as of now, the most logical interface. A necessary amount of buttons, with a touch-screen navigation system in the middle. It looks less busy than the LS's dash, and is executed very elegantly, as a Jaguar should be.

The legroom, especially on the L model, is abundant, and--get this--the XJ8 gets better mileage than the X-Type 3.0! It gets about 28mpg highway, if I remember.

The car is fantastic, and I personally like the way it looks. However, they've ruined it with this updated model. What do you think of the new one, cdoke?

For the record, I like the Jag XJ as well. The "old world charm" that is touted so much is very accurate. Specially the "Portfolio" editions.

I am a car enthusiast if Kia produced a car that I drove and like I would have no problem saying I like it. If you like clinical luxury buy a Lexus if you like grace,space and pace there is only one car for you! =)

And you my friend are obviously an idiot, I have seen them but not driven them. Which I will go and do next week. Also you have just shown what a really unknowledgeable car person you are. You fell for my grace, pace and space line. Can someone please enlighten him where that came from?

Anthony,

Don't be so quick to link 'revolutionary' with the technology found in the new LS.

First, an 8-Speed gearbox is in no way 'revolutionary', in the same way that adding a third headlight is not revolutionary.

Evolutionary? Of course!

And self-parking is somewhat of a moot point. It is also not 'new' technology, but has been experimented with by different companies/engineers for quite some time.

I feel the 'revolutionary' tag is over-used.

Also remember that the reason I may not particularly like the LS is because I am from a country with different values to that of the average American motorist. Therefore a car designed in part by American consumer groups and think-tanks has a high chance of not being appreciated by myself.

I would never claim that the engineering involved in created a compact transmission with a high number of ratios and linkages would be easy.

However, explain how the concept of an 8-speed transmission is revolutionary?

Clever engineering aside, the automatic transmission is not a new concept, and any re-configeration of the basic concept would be called progress, not revolution.

I like how easily you dismiss me someone with no knowledge of cars. Nice one.

No, I'm not from Sweden. But I am aware of the Americanized culture many Swedes enjoy.

+12345

Spot on.

Well its a nice car but the title is the only thing that started the flame war, you could have sed it in a better more appreciated way. This will only spoil lexus drivers, as for me, Im just happy with the germans better.

Yeh. the ls460l is a nice luxury car. but its just not my thing... i hate it's design. it just looks soo old fashion. although it has amazing leather and.. etc.

Photos have never done justice with the New LS.
In real life it's got a very strong prescence and personality.Far greater than 7 series and A8 and very close to S class.

JUGNU

I think you are crazy....where I live no one will give a Lexus, any kind for that matter a second look. But then again in the land of Bill Gates alot of people are very jaded on cars. Lexus does have revolutionary technology...its found in the GS450H and the LS600H. Now thats trick a Ravigneaux gearset with a step CVT. But an 8 speed gearbox...hell my XC90 has 6 gears, and entry level Mercedes have 7. The Ricardo DSG box in the Veyron now thats revolutionary!

Lexus gets free positive advertising by lending out long term test vehicles to the owner of this site. The subjective fluff in some of the stories on this site is embarrassing. I've been reading car publications for twenty plus years and this is the only one that comes off as an advertisement for some brands. I guess if I want objective fact based articles I should look elsewhere.

THey do it for ALL the magazines and it has been happening long before we existed.

So tell me HOW would we do a car test if we never got to use the car?

001

Yeah, but 001, first off, you say all the others do it (get the freebees and journo day camps) too, thats a cop out. This site was originally more of the lone wolf, the tell-it-like-it-is place I would go for the real info from the editors/contributors. I get the impression that is no longer the case. Second, how many other manufacturers give YOU long term 'daily' drivers for your reviews like your last two lexus? I must have missed the reviews from your LONG TERM tests of the BMW, Benz, Volvo, Audi, etc. not just the large journo retreats for a day...LONG TERM. This is NOT to say I disagree with all of your comments on this review or other Lexus review, I like the car! Its more of a heads up from a reader who doesnt want autospies to become like the rest as then whats the point, except for the flame wars.... I just see a difference in your reviews of late, not necessarily anti brand, but more of a giddy, over-the-top praise of Lexus alone without one real negative or 'heres what doesnt work'.

The only part in your article that comes close to a criticism is this regarding handling but then add "But the practical side of me pipes right back and says…But the drive quality is VERY close to the S550, BMW 750 or Audi A8. Still not as driver oriented, but damn close." and then you quickly add "And this car will actually work reliably during its relationship with me and never let me down like I know the others will." Come on..

This thread is pathetic. I stopped reading it not even halfway because most of the posts require you to click on the show comment option because some fanboy deboosts a perfectly fine post by an open minded member. Sure, there are some trolls here but for the most part, the majority of posts in here are open minded. Best examples? Matthew and S4Cabriofoxone. Why are they deboosted to -9 etc.?

Agent001, I strongly urge you to get rid of this silly boosting system. It's pathetic.

I have to agree the RL is the better car.

Back to the drawing board for the LS team.

Credibility and respect are lost not only when the website but the owner of the website writes (as a supposed auto enthusiast) an article with a title and statements within the article which are clearly subjective. This has nothing to do with the fact that yes, this Lexus is a fine automobile. By going so far as to say that you "know that the Audi/BMW/ Benz will let me down" is extremely presumptuous when you personally have not owned any of the cars.

come on.
i agree that the LS is a very nice, very well made luxury sedan.
but you can't be serious when you say the S-class isn't a great car....every automotive publication COMPARISON test disagrees with you. as do many people on this site.

if it were so great, lexus would be able to charge MORE for it not $25,000 less in base price than an S-class. pricing power says far more than your opinions.

also, nobody considering a rolls or bentley would consider an LS, S-class or 7-series. completetly different cars. rr and bentley are about STATUS and APPEARANCE more than anything else. factors that the LS has little of.

In first place is the mighty Mercedes-Benz S-Class.

The LS460 has a digital clock for K-Mart.

'from' Wal*Mart.

These European car fans are some of the most antagonistic people I have ever heard in my life. Like this site is only pro-Lexus. How many different articles did we get for the new BMW X5 when it came out? How many articles did we get for the new BMW 3-Series Coupe when it came out? How many S-Class articles did I have to suffer through when it was initially introduced? Stop crying foul. The guy wrote a positive review about a Lexus. Shut up and stop your whining. You do nothing but bully the Lexus fans on this site for having their own opinions, opinions which you do not share. It's always a European car fan that initiates personal attacks on people, have you noticed that? They're also the ones that almost always revert to incessant cursing. So hypocritical...If you truly believe this site is nothing but a "Lexus hangout" then what the hell are you doing in enemy territory?

Also, Anthony, you are a Godsend. It's a shame that you have attached yourself to me though, for now all these clowns will do nothing but deboost you every time they see your username...

hmmm.....
i think toyota could simply put a lexus badge on any toyota and lexus buyers would be silly enough to buy it. oops...that's what they already do with most of their cars.

lexus- why would you set your self up like that

-"Your Acura is a rebadged Honda with no luxury image behind it unlike Lexus."

What is a lexus then? Its a rebadged toyota! Its like a 400lb guy calling another 400lb guy a Fat Ass , it doesnt make any sense.

right....and because it's the best ever it's value-priced relative to all of its competitors.

This topic is getting stupid. Being in the car business I get to drive all kinds of cars all day long. I will be going to drive an LS460 next week. I have driven the A8/7 series/S550/XJR already. So I am going to save my judegement until then. How many of you truly have driven the competition. So many of you Lexus and Acura fanboys obviously have not driven the competition.

The XJ just has a class about it, its an understated luxury. Not the Noveau luxury you find in a Lexus but a kind of old world charm to it.

This topic HAS become ridiculous. Two words for the those with the fake accounts: Cognitive dissonance. God forbid rationality would rule as opposed to infantile intellectual mediocrity.

S4; the redesign of the XJ, is it were, sort of stripped the proportions of the vehicle and robbed it of some of its beauty. I've always felt the exterior front light, because it is larger, interacts in a sort of funny manner with the body of the car, which makes it look...unsubstantial in my opinion. I really like the interior in particular of the Vanden Plas and the SuperV8, which include a complete leather dash with exposed stitching above the soffet for the wood. I do wish there was some more substantial wood on the door panels though. It's still a very pretty car, but lacks some of the charm of the eariler model. As far as the refresh, with that atrocious cheap looking bumper thing, you know what I think about that.

I am excited about the upcomming redesign, but admit that I am a bit apprehensive about it.

What in the world makes you think for a second that writing such as you do will garner anything beyond contempt? Either your intent is to foster discontent here or you are perfectly beyond controlling yourself and your behavior. It seems people don't even give others a modicum amount of respect anymore.

I have told nothing but my experience with the vehicle. I bear no particular malice towards Lexus [I can and do bitch about almost every car in one way or another]. I have family members [my great aunt] who have one.

This thread has turned foul!

Lexus makes cars as well as any manufacturer, but they lack original designs.

I get testy about that!!!

The Lexus LS 460L/600 hl is great piece of machine and engineering. But the real masterpiece here is the Lexus LS600 Hl. Note that I'm the real "Lexus" here not the other Lexusmaniac who using the same Lexus name as me.

Lexus

I live in Orange County California I have seem many Lexus LS460/460L is very beautiful and stunning. It beauty just captivate you, you constantly staring at it beauty and grace. I once saw a S-class next to the new Lexus LS460, the Lexus LS460 definitely look much better. I have also saw the 7 Series and Lexus LS460 at the same time, winner again Lexus LS460. Both the BMW 7 Series and S-class look very beautiful on it own right. But out of the three, the Lexus LS460 is a much better looking car both inside and outside. You have to see it in person to truly appreciate the beauty and grace of the new Lexus LS.

But of course many of you German fanboys or German hotdog fanboys as I like to call it. Why because hotdog is invented in German. You're to afraid and insecure to admit that Lexus has created a true contender to the S-class and the 7 Series. Anyway when will BMW come out with the new 7 Series? that 7 Series is getting really boring.....if you know what I mean.

Probably by the end of this year, Lexus will make a true Maybach, RR and Bentley contender. Come on...Lexus please make a RR, Bentley and Maybach conpetitor.

Lexus, "the one and only"

Blah, blah, blah....

What you morons are not looking at is the title of this post. It say that it "may" spoil you.

Get it...may. Not will, going to, or anything else in between. You guys are so damn hot over getting in a pissing contest that you don't even think about what 001 was trying to tell you. And piss off about Lexus supporting the site and all.

You all have your panties in a knot because someone said one car is gasp...possibly better than the one that you get all hot and steamy over.

Guess what? Get the F'n over it! You all make me sick with your bitching back and fourth. All 001 was trying to tell you that if even half of you have the balls and the means to have and need a car like this you should put this in your area of possibility. I guarantee half of you won't ever buy this are or come near it so you don't need to bitch about it.

But for those that might be...take a look at it. If it does nothing for you then fine. Buy your 7 Series or A8, or whatever!

Get a grip people!!!!

Mark, thanks for heads up.

I take back everything I've said about the LS!

I would like to apologize to the entire board.

May I inquire as to your age, my dear sir?

I'm in the industry and I think your assessment of the RL and its relationship to the TL are spot on.

1.LS600h DOES NOT COMPETE against the RR, bentley or maybach,....FACT

faster than an AMG with 612 hp?

you are terminally stupid.

Well then you need therapy.

And if you are going to keep on showing a sacked-out, modified LS, then let me present you with this:

http://www.rsportscars.com/foto/10/brabuss06_04.jpg

Hot!

Come to think of it, in fact, I think the Lexus LS600 hl is good enough for a "KING";) Heck! if I was "King" I would definitely would like to own one. Ah...it good to be king;)

The Lexus LS600 hl look way better than the RR, Maybach and the Bentley from every angle. Hey! this is my opinion so back of...German fanboys.

Lexus

German fanboys?

Bentley and Rolls-Royce are British, technically.

You think the LS looks better than this?

http://www.rsportscars.com/foto/08/flyingspur05_01.jpg

It's the 'daddy', even though it's also the cheapest?

Please don't confuse 'presence' with 'style'.

The Bentley has style, the LS has presence (or so you say). However any car riding on 22 inch wheels is going to have big presence, LS or not.

The Flying Spur has style because it started life as a sleek touring coupe.

The LS has presence because it is a enormous chrome-clad brick.

Take your pick.

I belief VW own the Bentley brand now, not British own anymore.

Mathew and all Lexus bashers why don't u all just believe LS is good and quite their with the German big 3.I know u all know it.

Honestly I really like MB S Class----An allrounder and a design above all,BMW 7 series----great ride/handling and sporty character and Audi A8----Very elegant looking and quality interiors.

These are my fav picks HONESTLYYYY

1)S Class and LS
2)A8 and 7 series
3)Jag XJ


JUGNU----->THE CARMAN

I have no use for this car, or any other cars in it's class. It is not a drivers car, enthusiasts car, race car, supercar whatever. It is a luxo cruiser.

But with all the above in mind why the hell can't it still be reviewed for what it is against cars which are in its class. Lexus is not BMW, and they are not Merc... although sometimes I think they wish they were.

This car has some amazing gadgets, probably an amazing ride, and drive-train. I would guess to say it goes from point a to point b with more ease and comfort than both the BMW and the Merc. Why is that so bad BMW/Merc fans? Why don't you see that the car of your choice is your choice because it fulfills your needs/desires better than the others. In order to make blanket statements suggesting there is some overall winner you have to assume your needs/desires are that of the masses. I am sure we can all get around our ego's to realize that that is not the case.

This culture of 1 winner must be driven by something. What it is I can't for the life of me figure out.

Josh

To Compare a Lexus to a Bentley or Rolls Royce shows how stupid some of you are. Lexus is comparable to Audi, Cadillac, Mercedes. The next level up from that is Maserati, and then on the Ferrari, Lambo, Bentley and Rolls. Its not my opinion its just the way it is. The lowest priced Bentley starts at over $150k therer is no way a company who doesn't even hold the true luxury crown is even comparable to those companies.

To Compare a Lexus to a Bentley or Rolls Royce shows how stupid some of you are. Lexus is comparable to Audi, Cadillac, Mercedes. The next level up from that is Maserati, and then on the Ferrari, Lambo, Bentley and Rolls. Its not my opinion its just the way it is. The lowest priced Bentley starts at over $150k there is no way a company who doesn't even hold the true luxury crown is even comparable to those companies.

To Compare a Lexus to a Bentley or Rolls Royce shows how stupid some of you are. Lexus is comparable to Audi, Cadillac, Mercedes. The next level up from that is Maserati, and then on the Ferrari, Lambo, Bentley and Rolls. Its not my opinion its just the way it is. The lowest priced Bentley starts at over $150k there is no way a company who doesn't even hold the true luxury crown is even comparable to those companies.

To Compare a Lexus to a Bentley or Rolls Royce shows how stupid some of you are. Lexus is comparable to Audi, Cadillac, Mercedes. The next level up from that is Maserati, and then on the Ferrari, Lambo, Bentley and Rolls. Its not my opinion its just the way it is. The lowest priced Bentley starts at over $150k there is no way a company who doesn't even hold the true luxury crown is even comparable to those companies.

Ah. Good things to those who wait. I think a certain poster, or posters as it were, has betrayed an interesting morsel of information.

“LS just looks different then all other cars in real life. it's bigger. much bigger. even bigger then the flying spur.”

[sic] “than” not “then” is correct

Nobody who has ever been in the presence of the LS, the Flying Spur, and the Phantom, or who is in their right mind, would consider the LS the biggest of them. The LS is a toy compared to the Rolls Royce and anyone who has even seen on close up, much less driven one knows that. The Rolls is a behemoth, the likes of which are completely unique in the automatic world. It is massive even compared to the Bentley much less the LS. So I call B.S. on this assertion. As someone who is 6’2” tall: I remember standing next to the Phantom and thinking how amazing it was that it came up to my collar bone. So I have endeavored here to provide the actual statistics for the cars.

Rolls Royce Phantom:

Overall length (in) 229.7
Overall width (in) 78.3
Overall height (in) 64.3
Wheelbase (in) 140.6
Curb weight (lbs) 5501

Bentley Continental Flying Spur

Overall length (in) 208.9
Overall width (in) 75.4
Overall height (in) 58.2
Wheelbase (in) 120.7
Curb weight (lbs) 5456

2008 Lexus 460L

Overall length (in) 202.8
Overall width (in) 73.8
Overall height (in) 58.5 (AWD AS) usu. 58.1
Wheelbase (in) 121.7
Curb weight (lbs) 4330

One last thing:
“the presence of the classic V16 cars of the 1930's”
I hope nobody will try to convince me the LS is like Duesenberg for some abstract reason. The Duesenberg is the most luxurious car ever built. That is subject to argument I suppose, but what is not is that it was significantly more expensive than even Bentley and Rolls Royce. Modern equivalent you could pick up a Bentley for $300,000, a Duesenberg, even in the depression, would run around $1.2 million adjusted for inflation.

That should read 2007 not 2008

Sorry about the multiple posts my computer was not cooperating. Next you guys will be telling me the LS is the modern day Bugatti Royale. Comparing an LS to a Phantom is like me comparing a 350Z to an Enzo. Pull your heads out of the Lexus tail pipes!

especially the stacked pipes!!

The lexus is quite an impressive car for their geriatric customers.

i notice some people on here never ever seen this car "LS460L" in person, so thats why they say silly $%^& like that. not to flame u lexus people but compare to its rivals, the lexus is very sloppy lookin, more sloppy then my 745, some say it looks like this n that, when most see it IN REAL LIFE or even drive, its a big @#$ camry, but its damed sure handsome, funny thing, that the BLAND big toyota hybrid compete against the likes of big V12 boys, S600/S65,760,S8, LMAO, u can hated, fear it or clown it,but it does.....FACT

I think most posters here suffer from selective perception! google it and find out what it means! I do not think Lexus,BMW,MB,AUDI etc.. really cares that much obout your opinions, every CEO heading them wants to please their shareholders by making profits

So in order to try to understand you Lexus tail pipe suckers. I have done the unthinkable. My demo for the next 3 days is going to be a 4k mile 06 IS350. Initial impressions are a bit dissapointing. Doesn't seem that much faster than the 06 Camry V6 I was driving. And the ride is stiff and the handling is great. But thats at odds with the very quiet boring engine note. The G35 even though it can't hold a candle to the NVH is alot more fun to hear and drive.

Worst thread this year. I'm talking 2007, not 2006-2007.

Not the article... the article is okay.

But the war. This site. I can't rap my head around it.

It's insanity on a homepage.

And I'm not laughing any more.

The Lexus fans. Ahh, the Lexus fans. De-boosting any German car fan profusely, regardless of what they might have said in their post.

Claiming that the LS460 is in competition with the Rolls-Royce Phantom and Bentley Continental Flying Spur, and even Maybach 57/62.

Ridiculous.

And don't go thinking that I don't believe some of the German fans here are dumb@sses, too.

The LS460 is a great car, and it's targeted towards a specific audience. If I wanted a luxury sedan, especially one that I would be driven in, the LS460L would be on my short list.

There are also some of you provoking the Lexus fans, saying this is just a Toyota.

I'd be the first to say that it's so, so much more than that.

But that's irrelevant.

I'd like everyone in this blog to take a deep breath. Think about what horrific beasts we have become. Think about how every car in this class is great in its own way. And try to discuss this vehicle, and this review, in a civilized manner.

I realize that this effort is probably futile, and the most we can go without a flame war is about an hour.

Let me just point out what each car in this class is made for, for all the haters:

LS- luxury, comfort, luxury... did I mention luxury?

S-Class- luxury/sport mix, with a 60/40 on luxury; super-fine materials

A8- luxury/sport mix, with a 45/55 on sportiness

7 Series- sport, with just about 20% luxury thrown in for good measure

Every one of these cars is stylish for whomever owns it.

In other words, beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

And I believe that anyone in this forum would be happy to behold any one of these cars.

"formula1," nice quintuple post.

I am a performance enthusiast. I am not about pure luxury.

However, I stated that anyone who WAS looking for luxury in a sedan would love the LS460.

The Lexus fans will laugh you off the website for saying that the LS isn't as high-quality as the 7 or S-Class.

In a way, quality does equal reliability. It's one way to look at it, at least.

I, too, will keep buying German cars. But it doesn't mean I don't respect Lexus. Their cars are solid products, and the LS460 especially is sumptuous. The wood may not be as exotic as that of an A8 Exclusive or 7 Series Individual, but it's elegant, nonetheless.

Your comment was just ignorant. We don't need another like you.

Behold the truth and despair, your labor is for naught. Shame really.

Reading comprehension>formula1

You need to take a minute and read his post. I can tell from half of his posts that he is trying to give Lexus the benefit of the doubt. He knows they are reliable, knows they are luxo, and understands they are boats(not in a bad way). He respects that people might like to drive these cars, but he does not. You can like things that don't align with your tastes. This is called being an adult.

I welcome this kind of rational.

Josh

I SAID I WOULD NEVER OWN A LEXUS.

I RESPECT THEIR VEHICLES. THAT IS DIFFERENT FROM WANTING ONE.

Is it that hard to see?

I SAID I WOULD NEVER OWN A LEXUS.

I RESPECT THEIR VEHICLES. THAT IS DIFFERENT FROM WANTING ONE.

Is it that hard to see?

it easy to understand the vigor that german car lovers defend the cars they love with, they are great cars as well they should be, 6 million Jews died so they could be built so they had better be nice.....

and the lexus marketing machine, much like a modern day pearl harbor.......

it easy to understand the vigor that german car lovers defend the cars they love with, they are great cars as well they should be, 6 million Jews died so they could be built so they had better be nice.....

and the lexus/toyota marketing machine, much like a modern day pearl harbor.......

I am sorry but I don't see how anyone could pass over a 335 BMW and buy this IS350. Will someone enlighten me whats so special about a clinical, quiet car that trys to hard to be sporty?

some people just like NA...i mean its not hard to fix handling problems on the IS350 (or for that matter the quietness, which probably is better since making a loud car quiet is more work). you also have to realize that the 335i came a year after the IS350. its hard to remember, but a lot of 330i owners were pissed. so back then a 300+hp 3.5L NA engine with decent everything else looked pretty good. even now i would be hard pressed to find that extra 5k+ bucks for a 335i. but for those who can, twin turbo with procede =)

As we all are well aware 90% of Lexus owners are gay men in their late 60s. A recent study published by the CIOT also proves that on average Lexus owners have 30% smaller penis size then the drivers of Mercedes, BMW or Audi.

S4cabriofoxone: u forgot 1 thing, the LS460 have super-fine materials other then that, i think u got a point

You can't even get a full leather interior in the LS460. Its interior doesn't hold candle to the A8 or S550. And the 335i isn't $5k more than the Lexus..its at least $5k more car but its not that much more. Its actually pretty peppy for what it is but I am jaded when it comes to power. The 335i also has a more richer feeling interior in the cashmere/black with the wood.

Lexus makes a nice car no question but in our family people who own them always have this look when me or my brother-in-law who have E CLASS and S Class go to a family function. They say things like, my Lexus does everything your Benz does like we really care? I guess it is the zip code thing, i don't live in your area but the 40 mile drive to my house is a better value then yours?

What the hell. Let's just push for 300 comments.

Germany sucks, Lexus rules.

Round 10 begin!

Here's #293! Only seven more!

Let's see if we can make 500. 001, stop the presses-- make sure this article stays on the main page!

A Lexus fanboy and a BMW fanboy walk into a bar...

formula1, we honestly don't need this.

I used to be like you... until I regained my sanity.

I don't enjoy flaming.

from a poster in another forum:

"My dads got a new S-class and its had 11 days on the bench in the first 6 months. Be sure to ask the AN MB guy about their service biz..they run about 80/20 warranty/service, then go the local Lex store, they run the opposite. MB spends about $18 every time Lex spends $1 on warranty work..MB also was the clear leader in Lemon buy backs by a hefty margin last year...Having said that the MB does "drive" better every day of the week..Different strokes. But Toyota sells more hybrids in a year here than MB sells cars, so that's nice."

he said later, the comment about hybrids was just to point out the relative APPEAL to americans of "sporty, prestigious" MB, vs. "bland, appliance-like" toyotas/lexi.

and that MB has some 40 models vs. lexus' 20, but still gets outsold by lexus. (to say nothing of toyota)

(considering mb and toyota, like gm, are all FULL LINE manufacturers of everything from econoboxes to buses and other commercial vehicles to luxury cars, and that unlike toyotas, lexi are only sold in limited markets, the global comparison of TOYOTA to MB as full line companies is not inappropriate.)

not to mention, even the CHEAPEST TOYOTA is more reliable and trouble free than ANY mb, even the most expensive. (only refering here to reliability, not lux content or vehicle dynamics.)

it is NO insult to any vehicle to be "a rebadged toyota." even when they aren't.

if any OBJECTIVE, UNBIASED person is NOT impressed by the ls600l, they might look again when/if toyota decides to slip in the engine from the toyota century into it. (only a matter of time).

the toyota Century has been their answer (primarily just in the japan domestic market) to rolls royce. the 1st generation was produced for 30 years. the current 2nd generation only came out in 1997. it remains conservative as a car of that class ought to be.

but DOES have a v12 with all the current vvt-i tech.