Second Chance: VW Phaeton to return to U.S.

lol . I dont know what else to say ... speechless

I am confidant VW will eventualy make a place for itself in the high-end auto market.

Tech ... They already have Audi, which is the luxury group. I want what VW is smoking, that must be some good sh#t.

VW is not totaly going after the (high end) the pha3ton(get it?) will be more like a better avalon

lexus .. they do not sell more Lexus LS cars than S-class or Audi. Before you state something about another manufacturer at least do a little research. You are so pathetic and that is right up there in the top ten of idiotic comments made on autospies

Troll

If I had to choose... Sorry, but I'd spend my hard earned dollars on a Phaeton before a LS. (even though i personally wouldnt buy either)

sorry Lexus fans you don't have to get into every thread and talk about the pos LS

The Phaeton was and is a great car. Even more luxurious that an A8. I love the electronic closing vents. I hope it comes back.

Yes, true. But unless you are tight with your $$$ you'll still settle for an A8. Because it's an Audi, not a VW. The only reason. Other than that, Phaeton is a great luxury car, for THE PRICE they sell it this car will eat alive any competition (as interior space, interior luxury, gadgets and technology). It's got more leg space than the A8, almost as the A8L.

It's not more luxurious than an A8 (I consider them equal), but they're both gorgeous on the inside.

But the Phaeton was the stupidest $50K+ sedan on the market, without a doubt.

It's like the Porsche Cayenne, when that came out. Except the Cayenne sold.

the vents were cool but not a better car then the much more high tech A8

the phaton needs to scale it down and come in the low $50 range nicely loaded

people ... THE Phaeton didnt sell before and it wont sell again. Did anyone find out what VW is smoking?

you might as well just throw your money out the window with this car,it has absolutly no resale value. VW does not have the image or credibility to go against the contenders in this market. And why is it that some lexus fan always finds a way to tell us about how lexus is the greatest car ever made, give it a rest this article has nothing to do with lexus.

LOL I agree with everything.

After a brief entertainment of the notion that I would consider getting one, I looked up 2005 prices online. These cars were $70K new (this was last year), and they had dropped $30,000 already.

I agree with you, e34. One of the reasons I love the S4 so much is because, in its streamlined, classic shape, it looks like a normal A4. I can say that without losing my dignity- to the untrained eye, it's an A4 3.0 Cabriolet. For the trained eye, too. Not many people can spot an S4 Cabriolet.

Until I blast them from a stoplight. THEN they hear the V8... and believe me, they know.

One word: Why?

Lexus Turd,

Do some research before you claim LS has sold more in the US than A8 and S-Classes combined WORLDWIDE. That's a huge statement.. A huge false and moronic statement by a moron who knows nothing about cars.

Do you think someone in German will seriously buy an LS over the Big III? You seriously think they won't buy one of the three? Three in which are more recognized and respected world wide, not only in the US. Get out into the real world and test drive some cars instead of hiding behind a computer monitor reading reviews. Reviews ain't SH%T when you have no real life experience with those cars. You trust the reviews as much as their marketing?

LS great technology and good for it's money. Don't underestimate the S-Class especially when your beloved LS uses ABS & SAT NAV, which first came into guess who? THE S-CLASS!

If anything Lexus is trying very hard to beat out its competition but in a world wide scale the majority will always recognize Audi, BMW, & Mercedes as luxury brands and for Lexus it's a confusion because not all know or care to know about it.

But before you Lexus fans come deboost me, I love the GS =)

-Agent63

Always? Remember, never use absolutes.

Well, I agree, mostly.

VW is a bit higher-end than the likes of Toyota/Honda/Ford and co., but not into the luxury segment.

If you've ever sat in a Phaeton, you know it's a much finer car than the Avalon. The Avalon is perfectly fine... but the Phaeton is a true ultra-luxury sedan. Not to the level of a Roller or Bentley, but at least a last-gen S-Class. Or an A8. It just had the wrong badge plastered on the grille.

If anything they should sell only the diesel and price it at 50k

amen

Right on!
E-class pricing, with S-class features.

Good for the people shopping for Audi A8. Last month A8 sold 262 units.

I wonder who buys such an overpriced VW.

People who buy Audis. Well.....it's true.

The buyers of these cars are people who buy a car and drive it a long time. Resale doesn't matter if you drive the car for 20 years.
Needless to say, these people are rare, and they buy cars even more rarely. Hence its a very small market. But in that market it may be the best luxury-car buy.

yay a really expensive VW... for guys who just want to always feel like a kid... when there 50+

VW should decide what it wants to do. Does it want to be a value car company or a high end premium car company, because being both doesn't work. A companyc can build both types of cars, but the expensive will not sell in all cases. Why? well people buying the cheaper versions will be happy to buy a car from a company whose car prices top $50k, yet people spending the $50k plus will not be too happy about the situation. So since VAG already has a premium car brand why not try to increase the sales of Audi, before they try to take sales away from Audi?

Yes, and Audi makes over half of VW AG's profits.

Why rid the company of profits with an overpriced VW when you can be making profits on a well-priced Audi?

kart: what a dumb comment. Better tell Toyota, so they can stop building the Avalon! That makes as much sense.
VW builds this car to retain the VW loyal folks who are moving upscale and may jump ship to Benz or BMW.
But that's not why it was created. I'll post that later for those who forgot.

The Volkswagon Phaeton before was a very well built car with lots of luxury. I've sat in it before and the fit and finish was top notch.
With that being said, are you kidding me? Why would Volkswagon even consider trying again? From a marketing point of view, the Phaeton is pointless. I don't see the point of trying to upmarket Volkswagon when they already have Audi. Lately, Volkswagon has not been good at all with reliability. This in turn has significantly hurt their resale values. It doesn't matter that the Phaeton is built well, it's resale value will be based on the Volkswagon name in general. What those executives at Volkswagon should really do is:
Instead of building the Phaeton, VW should spend all that money to dramatically improve the quality/reliability of the entire standard Volkswagon lineup. Once VW quality is top notch again, then there will be at least a chance(though still slim) people would consider a Phaeton.

Exactly, and that's why the new chairman pulled the new designs and sent them back to engineering.
http://www.autospies.com/news/Back-to-The-Drawing-Board-VW-Delays-Tiguan-Passat-Coupe-Golf-and-Scirocco-12581/
They have FINALLY figured out that they have to address the quality decline. Lets see what happens.

When it first came out, didn't VW Phaeton cost as much as An A8, S-class, 7 Series and the Lexus LS? than no one want it. Than VW took it off the U.S. market, now they bring it back with a V6. How how does it cost now does anyone know?

It costed more than the LS430 and marginally less than an A8 SWB, although the Phaeton did have the long wheelbase standard in the US, like the S-Class.

It's a pointless car. Over-engineered, but pointless.

In the photo of the interior where are the vents?

You can't see them unless they are open.
And there are more of them than any other car (even Maybach).
Its the world's first (and only?) "draft free" car.
I'm sure Lexus is still busy copying this feature .. on second thought, its too expensive for Toyota to build.
They'll copy the "hidden" part, but put in only a few to save $$$

NO THIS IS RETARDED THEY HAVE AUDI.

I love the Phaeton-- it's beautiful. BUT IT WILL NEVER SELL HERE. It's Ferdinand Piech's "expirement." And that's all it should be!

EL34, as if you didn't know this (I'm sure you do), the air vents have buttons under them that makes two of the wood panels flip behind the dash to reveal them. It's like the A8's navigation system.

The rumour is that the next gen Phaeton will not be an A8/S class/7 series/LS type vehicle. It will be quite different. Likely to come with a lower price than the old Phaeton. Regardless, it will still be a very fine vehicle.

Bias Chewy views: VW/ Audi can do no wrong.

In short: The car is indeed a great car, even compared to A8, LS and BMW 7, but it has one problem - the badge.

Therefor it has got to be the best second hand buy one can make.
Understated cars are always the best buys you can do when buying a second handed car.

I agree with you 100%!

Agreed. I want to buy one in a few years (once the price drops below $10k). I just completed importing an A6 2.7 twin-turbo 6-speed that I bought for 1/7th the new cost. So, watch for me in a Phaeton in 2012!

The Phaeton is one of those rare cars that doesn't sell well at all, but is a truly good car.

I don't think a 2nd go-round in the U.S. will prove any different than the first though.

Living in car-crazy Southern California I see way more Lambos than Phaetons. It might as well be an exotic car itself.

I agree.

The Phaeton carries a certain aura... regardless of the badge, it looks super-expensive. It's a beauty, but in a tempting, understated way.

The interior is sumptuous, and the power was smooth and refined.

In a way, it was a bit like a Lexus, except with AWD. IMO it was also better-looking than the LS430.

The car deserved to succeed. If VW hadn't focused so much on profitability and more on sales, they would've priced the car closer ot $50K. Had this been the case, the car probably would've ended up profitable due to more sales, anyway.

Yeah well then they will rob sales from the Passat, as the Passat tops around $40k in the US.

That is why this car is pointless.

Yea why bring the Phaeton again, when the A8 is clearly the same car, with the better name. If you even asked someone pointless on cars and did not know that V Dub owns Audi, the person would pick Audi as their classy driver 9 times out of 10, that 1 is for people who consider driving a Beetle classy.

meant clueless, not pointless...probably was thinking how pointless it is bringing the Phaeton back.

HISTORY: Why VW built the Phaeton to start with.
A long time ago in a far away land, car makers had clearly defined turf: Benz was Luxury, BMW was Performance, and VW was "the People's car". Then Benz did something. Possibly because VW bought Audi and grew it into a Luxury competitor, but why doesn't matter. Its what they did that matters.
Benz introduced the A-Class. A Benz "People's car".
It was an attempt at direct competition for VW's bread-and-butter!
VW's Chairman, Piech, took it as a personal slap in the face.
And his response, cost-be-damned, was to take the largest automotive engineering team in Europe and point the big guns at MB with a Luxury car that "out-luxuries" an S-Class.
The A-Class was not a great success. Benz learned that building a small-car well (at a proportionately small cost) is a huge challenge. The new B-Class (for sale in Canada for 2 years, but apparently not in the US) is a better offering. However, its a Golf/A3-sized offering at the price of an optioned-up Passat.

Meanwhile, VW will continue to rub their noses in it with the Phaeton. Does it need to sell well or make a profit? No. That's logic. The Phaeton had nothing to do with Logic ... its a Halo car, and its current purpose is to sell more Jettas. In fact, the was a quote from the last Chairman of
VW.

If you think of the Phaeton as a marketing excercise (that pays for itself, curiously) then it makes a lot of sense.
And remember that the engineering development for the drivetrain and suspension was already paid for with the A8.

And don't forget that the Phaeton marketing team includes Pope Bendict XVI! He has a factory tricked-out black Phaeton with a 450 HP W-12 engine.
(link to photo: http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/News/articleId=117233#3 )
Before becoming Pope, he drove a VW Golf.

I betcha, at least this Phaeton is more realiable than anything GM made. Don't belief me, "The King of 2006 Recall" has GM rank the "WORST" in reliability. They recall almost 90% vechicle they made and sold last year.

It is interesting to note that very few that have posted appear to have ever driven, much less own a Phaeton. I have a 2005 V8. The lease ends in about a year. It has been a fantastic car. It is NOT the same in any way as an A8. It shares more components with the Bentley Continental GT. The Phaeton has a much more compliant ride than the A8. To suggest that it competes with an Avalon or Passat is just ignorant. This is a incredbly engineered car. It is not as fast and it does not handle as well as some of the other sedans, but it has an incredible,planted and solid ride. It has been relatively trouble free for me. I went from a 2001 996 Coupe and wanted something comfortable and of high quality. I drove the S class, A8, 7 series and I leased this beauty that had an MSRP of 78k for 1500 down and $730 a month. It was a steal, but I woudl have paid more. VW did a terrible job of marketing the car, and for those that are hung up on the badge, it is not for them. For the educated car enthusiast, don't knock this rock solid machine until you have driven it. I will miss it and I get far more comments about it from people ( all positive) than any other vehicle I have ever had. It's not for everyone, but this car is not to be compared to an A6, E Class etc. It is way beyond those mid-sized average cars. Just my experience...