Mercedes-Benz develops C400 Biturbo to take on the BMW 335i

sounds like a beast - i think though, it's more of a M3 competitor, from what those performance figures say.

You can chip a 335 for 370 plus HP and 400 plus ft/lb of torque. There ya go. Or just buy an M3.

am I the only one that thinks this news doesn't make sense?

ok, a 335i competitor i understand...but 410hp? doubt it. 0-62 in 4s? doubt it. That means the c63 would have to have to get 520hp to set itself apart from the C400. The C63 would then blow away the E63 and the M5...nevermind the M3...this just doesn't make sense.

My german extends to the words "Auto Motor Unt Sport" and 99 luftballons.
Audi bringing a 3 litre 333 PS turbo-fsi. Mercedes a 4 litre biturbo with 408 hp, 4 seconds to 100 kmh.
Both use direct injection and turbos.

I am very proud of myself there. I have never learnt a word of German in my life, (I know the numbers 1-4) and I managed to (vaguely) translate that! Go me (and German's similarity to English, and the fact the numbers are the same!)

Turbocharged or supercharged? Seems like they usually only turbocharge that V12 they make...hp sounds about right. Not exactly sure what this car will compete against...I think it'll beat the 335i and S4 but not the M3 or RS4. IS-F?...lol

If it has 0-60mph in 4.0 seconds, it will beat every car you mentioned, at least in a straight line.

Like CW said, the AMG version would then be useless.

Even if this car breaks five seconds I'll be impressed- but FOUR is not happening.

wow...things are getting really interesting for guys like me who are getting into the market for cars like these!!!

They have bi-turbo technology so making a fast turbo car is not impossible. It will definitely conflict with the C63 but i'm sure it will be toned down a bit if the numbers get too high and start getting close to those of the C63. It will be a beast of a car and will definitely be fast. Remember it's not how many horses the engine makes. It's how the car puts it out. So it will be exciting to see how this development goes down.

-Agent63

How do we know if North America will get any of these new Benzes?

cough C200 cdi C180 kompressor cough

That was my question. MBUSA has to know better than to just throw so many different C-Class models at North Americans for the sake of keeping up with the Joneses. Ironically, the typical North American C-Class buyer looks to the C-Class for that same idea.

The new C is on my short list of contenders to replace my Audi A6 when its lease expires. Since I'll be buying instead of leasing, I'll keep the C on my shopping list only if the new 400 hp 4-Litre V6 engine is designed in a 60-degree configuration and not the inherently-out-of-balance 90-degree configuration.

Uhh, yeah! That's definitely not a 335i competitor!

And it will probably be about $65,000 in Mercedes fashion...

Sweet...:) that what I'm talking about. If this is true, than I betcha BMW, Lexus, MB and Audi is really nervous now. And this is not even the AMG version, if this has 408 hp already than the AMG has to have at 500 hp at least.

You listed "MB" in the cars that were "nervous."

It doesn't have more horsepower... unless you count 6 as a huge asset for the IS350.

FYI, it actually isn't as quick. 335i can reach 60mph in under five seconds. I've never seen anything better than 5.2 for the Lexus.

Like most Mercs it will be quick in a straight line but forget about cornering and braking. BMW nervous ?? You have to be kidding. An over priced out of balance merc v6 with a couple of turbos is hardly the things dreams are made of.

The new M3.

Now there is a dream car.

Although your tone is a bit insensitive, I agree fundamentally.

Please, the handling of Mercedes is underrated. It's like a cliche already. "BMW's handle, other cars don't", it's getting old.

What delivers driving pleasure? Good steering feel, good brake feel, solid feeling when cornering, and fast acceleration come to my mind. Generally, I think driving in the city during rush hour traffic is NOT the situation which would deliver driving pleasure, whether you're driving a Toyota Corolla or Ferrari F430. For most people, driving pleasure comes when driving at a brisk pace with or without turns to take advantage of the capabilities of a car.

If you're not on an deserted twisty road, or on a track, you simply cannot enjoy the advantages of the 3 series over any of its competitors (like the C-class or A4 or IS or G35, etc). Sure, you can engage in illegal high speed runs on the highway, or you can take a curvy on-ramp at higher than average speeds, but unless you're really close to the edge of cornering limit, a 3 series will not feel that much better than a W203 C-class or B6/B7 A4. Yes, a Porsche Boxter or S2000 does obviously feel much better taking that same on ramp at speed, but that's a completely different class of car.

Do you notice where magazines test their cars to decide which car "performs" the best? They either do it on a track to measure objective performance numbers, or they take it to the open road with minimal or no traffic so they can see what happens when they tackle turns at speed. Only then can you gauge how the steering feels, whether the brakes have good modulation, and whether the shifter feels good or not. When they do it in urban traffic (where most people drive), the C-class historically always gets better compliments about smoothness, comfort and quietness.

Bottom line: I think you have to drive faster than usual to really notice the differences between the 3 series/C-class/A4, and that means typical urban driving won't do it.

A big reason the 3 series is so successful is because it is "hip" and "popular" with the younger crowd. BMW has done an excellent job of marketing itself towards this segment by selling a sporty image. Many people would consider Mercedes to be an "older" person's car. Sure, the 3 series cars are actually very capable, but I guarantee you that most 3 series buyers decide on the car because of style and image, rather than the fact that the it handles better or has better steering feel than the competition.

The fact that the 3 series has always won most comparison tests in car magazines only adds to the advertising of the car. And remember, most car magazines rate cars based on PERFORMANCE.

Unless MB is happy being with the C-class being 2nd rate in terms of sales compared to the 3 series, I think Mercedes SHOULD try to take on BMW in this compact segment. And that means putting an emphasis on performance or driving experience for these small cars. With the W204, they're marketing the Avant Garde (or Sport) models to be the sporty representativ

C400 Hmmmmm.I know MB's 3.5 V6 is not quite there with BMW's,Lexus's and Inifiti's SIXES. Good move.
I remember there was a C32 AMG some years ago. Why doesn’t MB revive that instead? It will make
More sense and will give customers more options to choose between 3-5 of normal Cs and 2 AMG Cs.

JUGNU

Because the C32 sounded like a vacuum cleaner and got whipped by the S4.

Mercedes handling is under-rated. You shouldn't trust the review guys that much. You need to go drive one and then make the final call. It may not be as sporty since Mercedes is all about luxury, but they aren't that bad. It's all show with no go that's for sure. It's a good mixture for the consumers who want a sporty edge but still maintaining the luxury.

BMW's have more sporty than luxury. It's the opposite of what Mercedes is doing but still doing a superb job in what their mindset is.

I'm a huge Merc fan but I love the 328i/335i coupes. They look very sleak and Mercedes has no competitor to that. The CLK is actually in a different pricing bracket but the C-Class is no turtle either. It's just not as athletic as it's counterpart.

All in all very respectable cars. Great engineering regardless of who's better. I think we can all agree to that.

-Agent63

Ops I meant "It's not all show and no go"

LOL, that was a bad mess-up.

LOL it was . that is true haha

The power numbers seem a bit high... but it would be nice if they came out with this instead of the C350...it would prob have around 330-350 hp and 340-360 tq... like the old C55

BM 335i=3,0 merc =4,0 Audi=4,2 Litres , BMW M3 3,2 merc amg from 4,3 up to 5,5 so far Audi 2,7 biturbo up to 4,2 litres.why does audi and merc need to oversize it's motors to compete with BMW

The "Oversize" argument is silly every time it comes up. I used to remember when BMW fans had the "BMW doesnt need a turbo" argument. I say "remember" because they dont say that anymore... The fact of the matter is that it doesnt matter how power is created as long as it is created efficiently, reliably and suitably. I always point to the LS7 engine as an example. 7 liters of push rod make more power in a lighter engine with better fuel mileage than the 997 turbo motor. Go figure....

BMW 328i/528i: 3.0L

Audi A3/A4/TT: 2.0T

2.0T>230hp 3.0L

BMW 4.8L- highest output? 360hp.

Audi 4.2L- highest output? 420hp N/A, 450hp w/ turbos.

4.2L>4.8L

BMW M3 4.0L 400hp

Audi RS4 4.2L 420hp

Look who's trying to keep up now?

I love BMW and want the new M3, but your comment ticks me off.

Yes, Merc has huge engines, but that's part of their charm. 5.5L and 6.2L are awesome.

"Cash money", is all I can say about this ride.

Believe me I am not happy about the turbos except in their diesels,when i race in my game i prefer n/a cars.i have driven a subaru STI ,fun as it was i prefered the 98' M3 3,2.

BMW's 4,8L is tuned for torque not outright power

As new as those mercs engines are,i would still rather have a classic mustang or chevy V8, those have charm.Merc & Audi bring out their bigger motors first to try & out perform Bmw ,then BMW bring out a new motor.

6,2L is built by AMG not merc,others were reworked merc engines.