Did Toyota Stretch the Truth in the New Tundra Ads?

Did Toyota Stretch the Truth in the New Tundra Ads?
We came across this email to GM sales staff pointing out a few stretched truths in the latest Tundra ads.

Thought you might want to know this. Pass it along to your sales staff. It might help them to sell more vehicles. BTW.....attended the Minneapolis Auto Show kick off breakfast on March 8. Two of our Sandy trainers did a nice job explaining the Tundra ads. I would guess all of you have seen the stupid ad where the Tundra pulls a trailer up a steep grade (a 'see-saw'), and then barrels down hill and locks the brakes up just before the end of the ramp. Seen it? Yeah you have.

Couple things to keep in mind. The V.O. at the beginning of the spot says...."It's tough pushing 10,000 lbs up a steep grade". Myth: Toyota would like the audience to believe the trailer is 10,000 lbs. Fact: It's a 5,000 lb truck pulling a 5,000 lb trailer. A little slight of hand? You bet.

Then, on the way down the grade, the camera zooms in on the brakes as the vehicles comes to a screeching halt just prior to the end of ramp. Next time you see the ad....look for the 'mice type'. It indicates the trailer is equipped with electric brakes. Fact....the electric brakes stop the trailer -- not the truck. A little slight of hand? You bet.

Does Toyota have bigger brake pads? They need them....their truck is heavier. Stopping distance between our truck and theirs is virtually identical. And why does Toyota have a 6 speed transmission? To improve their fuel economy....which is still 2 mpg less than ours.

And don't forget....their big V8 has one axle ratio -- a 4.3. Suck fuel much? Our trucks offer several axle options to optimize towing and fuel economy. Bottom line: OUR TRUCK IS BETTER! Spread the word.......we can all make a difference.

Our question to you is, Are the new ads stretching the truth or simply a spin.



answeranswer - 3/21/2007 10:30:25 AM
+8 Boost
Damn. I was all set to to drive a new Tundra up a steep ramp then stop right before a cliff this weekend. Oh well.



EvoAudiEvoAudi - 3/21/2007 10:35:32 AM
+5 Boost
haha.....


1970toyotamarc1970toyotamarc - 3/21/2007 10:41:24 AM
-10 Boost
Sounds to me like GM running scared.


SilverAeroSilverAero - 3/21/2007 11:38:00 AM
+5 Boost
What, sounds like Toyota is scared enough to lie and misrepresent its trucks


Westside7thWestside7th - 3/21/2007 10:43:47 AM
+3 Boost
Toyota just uses their PR and ads to make them look good when they are just an average car company like all the rest.


S4cabriofoxoneS4cabriofoxone - 3/21/2007 11:21:52 AM
0 Boost
Well, you realize, bulldogz, that everything you just mentioned stems from the ads.


GS450hGS450h - 3/21/2007 11:34:18 AM
+5 Boost
S4cabriofoxone - all bulldogz has mentioned is from customer testimonials, myself included.


DallasMR2DallasMR2 - 3/21/2007 12:45:14 PM
+2 Boost
ME too! i regret the day that i purchased my MR2 Spyder. i got it off the truck with 4 miles on it. i'm on my fourth engine, second transmission, third radio and now my passenger wiper assembly (not blade) needs to be replaced..as does the convertible top. it's got just about 80k on it.

this is ridiculous. ...and don't even get me started on their customer service... i had to yell and scream to get a loan car after they had my car for a week and still didn't know what was wrong with it. and the toyota manual said if a car is in the shop for over 24hrs a loan car will be provided free of charge. this will be my LAST toyota.

...and for the record, the car i had prior was an accord that had 265k on it when i traded it in, and i'm sure it's still running somewhere today.


no1listensanywayno1listensanyway - 3/21/2007 11:05:19 AM
+3 Boost
The Titan never even took this much heat.


BigShow50BigShow50 - 3/21/2007 11:10:46 AM
+4 Boost
Since GM and the rest of the domestic brands have poured all their knowledge and money towards their truck segment, I would "EXPECT" that domestic brands would be the better truck at the end of the day. As for the rest of their domestic segment, you can say they are just as bad as the new Tundra. If that make you feel better. Forget false ads, how about just bad quality all around for domestic brands? Bottom line, Toyota does not expect to de-thrown the domestic truck segment right away, but someday they will...they are just having fun doin' whatever they want. Domestics are runnin' scared and are doing everything they can to slow Toyota down. Good luck to ya'!!!


austintysonaustintyson - 3/23/2007 3:29:28 AM
+2 Boost
Go look at the new GM trucks then go look at the new Toyota truck.. The GM trucks are nicer and from what I have seen are put together as if not better than the Toyota... GM did thier homework on these new trucks.. My Ford is put together just as good as the Toyota.. I bought my Ford because I got 11k off sticker.. I don't like Fords and was afraid looking at the Toyota would make me wish for better.. I got back in my truck after looking at the Toy and said Iwill keep my Ford.. I like it better..


kart1kart1 - 3/21/2007 11:19:39 AM
+4 Boost
WOW, looks like someone is scared. What about the power, is there a myth about the power too??? GM you should be focused on your biggest rival in the truck market - the Ford. How can they beat you every year, when you have the best truck??? I cant believe GM is scared of a Japanese truck which costs more than its truck.


S4cabriofoxoneS4cabriofoxone - 3/21/2007 11:24:29 AM
+1 Boost
I agree, but at least GM is doing (significantly) better than Ford. Ford is scrambling for money off of their premium brands, while their mainstream brands are starved and disheveled; GM is making huge strides with its main premium brand (Cadillac) and at the same time is pouring great new products into Chevrolet, Saturn, GMC and Pontiac.


no1listensanywayno1listensanyway - 3/21/2007 3:02:17 PM
0 Boost
Ford beats them because GM has both the Silverado and GMC Sierra. When combining those two sales numbers, it equals that of the F - 150.


komododavekomododave - 3/21/2007 11:30:25 AM
+4 Boost
haha...I have to keep laughing at all of you who think GM is running scared. The Tundra has lost not once, not twice, but THREE times in magazine comparisons to the new Silverado. The Tundra didn't even beat the Titan in the most recent one. The problem with that? The old Tundra did beat it. Nice try Toyota, but you still don't get a cigar. The only thing the new tundra has going is more power, and thats only with the top level engine. If you compare every other level engine with it's GM counterpart, the GM engine has more power. GM isn't running scared, but Toyota is running in circles.


1970toyotamarc1970toyotamarc - 3/21/2007 1:16:28 PM
+2 Boost
The Tundra beat the Titan and Silverado in the Edmunds comparo


chewychewy - 3/21/2007 11:58:08 AM
+3 Boost
Umm, 5,000 instead of 10,000 trailer is weak sauce. Electric brakes are not. All trailers should be braked. The Tundra has gotten better fuel economy than the equivalent Chevy 6.0 in all tests.


PlanBPlanB - 3/21/2007 12:20:38 PM
+2 Boost
Slight of hand on Toyotas part sure, but I don't think any real truck driver saw that commercial and thought it was the real deal. I like Tundra a lot, but I think Toyota made a terrible mistake by previewing this truck and its capabilities over a year in advance there by letting GM match the performance... and in some cases even surpass the the Tundra. Toyota showed their hand way too early imo.


SupraNeverBackSupraNeverBack - 3/21/2007 12:52:22 PM
+1 Boost
Matching the performance? At least from all the reviews, I don't see that.


SupraNeverBackSupraNeverBack - 3/21/2007 12:49:47 PM
-2 Boost
They are making fool of themselves.

The sea-saw is real deal and the trailer is 10,000lbs, verified by AMCI.

"And why does Toyota have a 6 speed transmission? To improve their fuel economy....which is still 2 mpg less than ours."

How about adding this to it, "But in real world tests, our trucks got worse FE."

"don't forget....their big V8 has one axle ratio -- a 4.3. Suck fuel much? Our trucks offer several axle options to optimize towing and fuel economy. Bottom line: OUR TRUCK IS BETTER!"

Isn't this a joke to find excuses for their 4sp?

Why did they just say,"Our truck has to use multiple axle ratio because of its pathetic 4sp. Even so, they still can not match Tundra single ratio 4.3 because its 6sp transmission has 2 more gears than our trucks. Bottom line: our truck sucks."



Threepoint1415926Threepoint1415926 - 3/21/2007 1:12:33 PM
-2 Boost
Can you show where AMCI (a marketing company mind you) "verified" that the trailer was 10,000 lbs?

I agree with you on the transmission. More forward gear options partly eliminates the need to choose different rear ends. That doesn't excuse not having other rear ends as available options. Dodge Ram is an example of having both worlds.


SupraNeverBackSupraNeverBack - 3/21/2007 1:49:31 PM
-1 Boost
If still don't believe it, you can sue Toyota. ^0^

"Toyota is taking the heat in stride. Spokesman Chad Harp pointed out that the company's boasts in the commercial, including the Tundra pulling a 10,000-pound trailer, are backed by scientific testing. The GM e-mail said the trailer was only 5,000 pounds."

http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070317/AUTO01/703170369/1148


Threepoint1415926Threepoint1415926 - 3/21/2007 7:28:02 PM
+1 Boost
They never asserted that a 10K lb trailer was actually used, just that "scientific testing" showed it possible. Most marketing is just hocus-pocus... What got me is that you cited a marketing company as as source for fact. I dont doubt that the Tundra can pull 10K lbs but I also dont doubt that the commercial is a bit overzealous in its capabilities. Reminds me of the Audi commercial a while back when an A6 made it up a ski ramp... Anything is possible if you have the right equipment.


chewychewy - 3/21/2007 9:42:54 PM
+1 Boost
The A6 had winter studded tires. Something that people use in winter.


Threepoint1415926Threepoint1415926 - 3/22/2007 1:06:08 AM
+1 Boost
Thank you for proving my point... Did you see the studded tires they used? Not like any I've ever seen. And certainly not something that would be legal to drive around on. The tires they used are NOTHING like the studded tires you or me would put on the car. Hence, with the right equipment....


AlexTxAlexTx - 3/21/2007 2:57:18 PM
+2 Boost
Also the new Tundra got a 4 star in frontal crash versus 5 Stars for the domestic trucks!!


golfer38golfer38 - 3/21/2007 3:55:18 PM
+1 Boost
The questions is, "was the truth stretched?", not which vehicle is better?

Here we read an email that states that it was a combined weight of 10,000lbs, and then supranever claims that it was backed up by scientific testing.

I'm not a truck guy so when I see the ad, I assume that the vehicle is really towing and stopping 5 tons. So I do think they're definitely stretching the truth with the braking aspect, and if it truly is a 5000lb trailer, then they are stretching the truth there as well.


XYZZXYZZ - 3/22/2007 6:48:10 AM
-1 Boost

"And why does Toyota have a 6 speed transmission? To improve their fuel economy...."


AND why does gm only offer 4-speed trannies? even ford offers 5-speeds. why does gm still have pushrod engines? ford at least has sohc.


"And don't forget....their big V8 has one axle ratio -- a 4.3. Suck fuel much?"


not when this short gearing allows you to get to top gear SOONER. and provides GOBS MORE TORQUE in ALL gears.
and with SIX speeds vs. a measly 4, the top two gears are OVERDRIVE. yeilding OVERALL taller gearing than with the limited 4-sp and "taller" final gearing.

the combo gives greater FLEXIBILITY over ALL speed ranges.


"Our trucks offer several axle options to optimize towing and fuel economy."

yeah, if you can SWAP ALL those different choices on the ONE truck you can drive at a time! LOL!

there HAS TO BE more offerings when stuck with just a 4-speed.


"Bottom line: OUR TRUCK IS BETTER!"

at making COMPROMISES for limited offerings with OLD engines and trannies.



austintysonaustintyson - 3/23/2007 3:36:36 AM
+2 Boost
GM does offer a 6 speed trans in its trucks.. right now it is only in a few.. next yr Chevy gets theirs. And from what I am seeing it looks like the Toyota is running a timing belt not a chain.. who wants to spend that kind of cash at 90k to get it replaced.. who wants to be towing anything at 89k with a timing belt...


WeAreMadWeAreMad - 3/22/2007 10:38:34 AM
+1 Boost
both trucks are impressive imho. since this is about ads, what gives w/ gm/chevy ad on inspiration coming from an anvil w/ a towing-hitch tongue and ball? looks more like some hobby job.


mattldmmattldm - 3/22/2007 3:25:28 PM
+2 Boost
Ok, so you mean to tell me that GM has never stretched the truth in any of their marketing!? Come on.

Every manufacturer of every product tries to make theirs sound better than the competition, and they ALL stretch the truth from time to time.


austintysonaustintyson - 3/23/2007 3:39:02 AM
+1 Boost
what GM meant is Toyota has to have bigger brakes. Why because the truck out wieghs the GM trucks and from waht I have seen it stops after teh GM trucks.


ellivesellives - 3/22/2007 9:55:52 PM
0 Boost
Bottom line is any AMERICAN buying a Toyota is un-AMERICAN. Toyota is VERY good at media management. They twist the truth very carefully so they will never be caught in an out-and-out lie. Unfortunately most Americans are so ignorant they buy the BS they hear in all those Toyota ads. I hope they enjoy flipping burgers for a living - or at least their kids do.


dano100dano100 - 3/23/2007 12:45:03 AM
+1 Boost
Ellives is a narrow minded bigot. I work for PPG Industries which supplies glass to the Big 3 and Toyota, Honda, Hyundai, etc. Toyota has plants here in the states, employing thousands of people at high wages, pumping billions of dollars into the American economy. GM, on the other hand requires every supplier (like PPG) to put up hundreds of thousands of dollars just for the privilege to bid on a car set of glass, then if we are awarded the car set we have to reduce the price we charge them for the glass by 15% EACH year of the contract (4-5 years). By the last year we are practically giving the glass away. This isn't the American way, it's extortion! Toyota, Honda and others are very good customers and do not require up front money. They pay you the same in year 4 as in year 1 of their contract with you for your product and require no up front money from you to have a shot at their buisness. Because GM, Ford and Chrysler have gotten themselves into financial difficulties they are beating up their suppliers to the point of bankrupting them. If I loose my job after 35 years it will be because of GM and not Toyota, a company that does buisness the "American" way, not the way of a company with extortion as their mode of buisness.
By the way, I haven't owned a GM car since 1973 when the new Corvette I bought needed a new rear end, transmission, air conditioner and a complete paint job in less than 18 months. I have owned 2 Tundras in the past and the only problem I ever had was on my 2000 Tundra, which needed new rotors @ 20K miles. My 2004 Double Cab was impeccable. My new 4Runner has been trouble free also.


XYZZXYZZ - 3/23/2007 1:00:24 AM
+1 Boost
huu,
you are right about the axle ratios. choose one, and LIVE with it forever. (can be changed, but at a COST.)

when i first saw the comparative specs of the tundra vs new chevy, i was surprised at how "short" the ratio on the former was. but then the figures for the tranny ratios showed both 5th AND 6th were overdrive. (less than 1.00:1)

net effect: in top gear, the tundra is always running at MORE mph/ 1000 rpm. less fuel burned, less engine wear and tear.

yet in the lower gears, there is MORE POWER transmitted to rear wheels. bottom line: more POWER AND more economy. from greater flexibility. (not to mention superior, MODERN, toyota engineering.)


austintysonaustintyson - 3/23/2007 3:46:15 AM
+1 Boost
not really because if they were superior their truck wouldn't be so damn ugly. have you seen those doors on the Reg cab.. oh my .. in 7 yrs they will be saging like at 78 Camaros.. or worst...Oh wait thats Toyota styliing... Just glad to see the the design staff Gm fired found jobs at Toyota.... Buy Toyota and give away your money to Japan.. its might be made here but the profits go back to Japan. So for those who just love Toyota remember once they take our money what is left for us.. nothing..


dano100dano100 - 3/23/2007 10:36:47 AM
+1 Boost
And what is GM doing with their profits from their plants in Mexico, China and Canada? Oh yea, they are supporting soup kitchens for their employees that got terminated when they closed their plants here in the U.S.
Is there any news of GM, Ford and Chrysler building new plants?????? NO, they are shutting them down. It is the transplants that are providing Americans new jobs. Although the profits they make go back to Japan, they bring much of it right back here.


mwaitkusmwaitkus - 3/24/2007 9:36:15 AM
+1 Boost
dano100...DO YOUR HOMEWORK!!! TAXPAYERS ARE HELPING THE IMPORTS...EVERY STATE THAT HAS AN "IMPORT" PLANT HAS SUBSIDIZED THE PLANTS WITH MILLIONS OF TAX DOLLARS IN TAX INCENTIVES, INFRSTRUCTURE COSTS AND EMPLOYEE TRAIING PROGRAMS. WHEN THE GM PLANT IN ARLINGTON TEXAS WANTED TO MODERNIZE AND EXPAND...THE GOVERNMENT OFFICIALS SAID NO TO THEIR REQUEST FOR SOME TAX BREAKS...YET "GAVE" TOYOTA OVER $314 MILLION DOLLARS !! THE SAME THING IN DETROIT WHEN FORD BUILT THEIR TRUCK PLANT AT THE "ROUGE/ DEARBORN" FOR F-SERIES TRUCKS...ZERO DOLLARS...THEN THE STATE AND LOCAL OFFERED TOYOTA OVER $274 MILLION TO BUILD AN ENGINE PLANT IN SOUTHWESTERN MICHIGAN..."AWAY FROM THE COSTLY UNIONIZED AREAS AROUND DETROIT. IS THIS FAIR AND EQUITABLE ? WHEN THE DOMESTIC MANUFACTURERS ARE GONE...THEN WHAT ? OVER $.57 PER DOLLAR THAT TOYOTA MAKES GOES BACK TO JAPAN AND ITS JAPANESE SUPPLIER PARTNERS.


YakamotoYakamoto - 3/23/2007 6:18:08 PM
+1 Boost
****BREAKING NEWS****

----...those commrecials demonstrating the ruggedness of the Tacomas are stretches of the truth, also. When Consumer Reports conducted tests in controlled environments to recreate the impact the trucks sustained as Toyota claims in their ads, the Tacomas failed in all areas of safety. Further testing with crash dummies revealed that injuries to passengers would be fatal making the impacts, as per Toyota's claims, fatal in all cases. How dare Toyota to make such outragious.----

...damn, i guess i won't be taking my brand new X-Runner with 5.7L & TRD/Jackson Racing supercharger on 24" Scion rims out half piping in the Sahara this winter.


YakamotoYakamoto - 3/23/2007 6:22:25 PM
+1 Boost
in other words...

none of this will TOUCH the sales of this truck. EVERYBODY and their momma-nem (yeah "momma-nem") got one, ALREADY!!!


truckmentruckmen - 3/26/2007 5:06:59 AM
+1 Boost
Chey comes with an optional 4-1 axle ratio! I prefer the lower ratio so I can put a larger tire on without the expense of changing it myself for a few thousand. I would pick the Chey any day! The toy does have the most power though, the only thing it has going for it though. Chevy should adopt a 6 speed for improved mielage too! How about an off road package! And I mean on them all! Something more than stickers and shocks! Something like the dodge powerwagon but reliable with a solid axle or if they are stuck on the crappy IFS at least increase the wheel travel from 8inches to 14inches min! Get it together! give us a real truck! They are all crapy 4x4 trucks but great trailer queens! And I am a truckman!
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