The Lexus LS600hL might have 480hp??

If it indeed has 480hp plus AWD and hybrid, I bet 0-60 time will be in less than 5.0s.

actually the IS350 is faster...5.3 seconds. 0-60.

That video lied. She said "It will have the power of a V12 with the gas mileage of a V8". Well no duh, Shirlock, it has a V8. It's supposed to be gas mileage of a V6. Just thought I would make that clear.

Maybe different performances are tuned for different markets. In recent European press release, it said it will have FE equivalent to a v6(combined 25+mpg), but in last year New York debut, Lexus said it will have best-in-class V-8 fuel economy. Not bad, the current best-in-class v8 is the LS460 with 18mpg city/ 27 hwy.

More interested to see if it will be first Lexus hybrid powered by Li-ion battery.

I don't know about US mileage but in the UK the Audi A8 4.2 fsi has better MPG than the LS460.
And the Audi 4.2 TDI does 0-60 in 5.7 seconds (SWB) and gets 25 US MPG on the European combined cycle, and that has 322 hp. The 445 hp S8 does 0-60 in 4.9 seconds, so I think the 5.4 second estimate is a tad conservative, if it really does have 480 hp. The current LS460 does 0-60 in 5.5 seconds anyway, these numbers must be wrong.

lexus uses small horses :)
shetland ponies i think

girl sounds like a blonde with all the che and sme.

It's a nice car, but not the best car on the planet in the category.

That goes to the AMG S-Klasse.

THE END

"BMW considers turbos or superchargers to be low-tech shortcuts to power, horsepower solutions unfit for a flagship engine."

Plus an aged 5 sp auto.

beck i remember quotes like that from BMW
where did you get that quote?

now BMW comes out with the 335 and all is well with turbos

the 335i is not a flagship. it's a compact sport sedan/coupe.

The quote is from C&D: ^0^

"BMW considers turbos or superchargers to be low-tech shortcuts to power, horsepower solutions unfit for a flagship engine. Blowers, they say, add weight and complexity and reduce throttle response. Ask a BMW engineer if the V-12 might one day be turbocharged, and you'll get a scowl and a curt, "Nein!"

^smirk

My name says it all

Gogo5 is making EL34 look like Einstein.

what in the world does someone's sexuality have to do with cars? get a grip.

Lexus is lame, all you fanboys kill lexus even more. New rule: you shouldn't drive a Lexus if you can eat solid food. Go ahead and get an LS600hl and I'll romp on you in my C32. You'll be in a cloud of smoke confused asking yourself..."if he has a v6 and payed 20k for his car how come he smoked me so hard when I have a v12 and payed 120k?" the answer to that question is you're an idiot.
Do me a favor...imagine burning out in a Lexus LS and then imagine burning out in a BMW 7-series, which one seems like it'd be more at home? Yeah that's what I thought...burning out may have no real use except for wasting breaks and tire but if you think about it, it's damn fun...something lexus is not.

^ Good point.

Another ignorant jackass. You'll be in good company with the Lexus haters here.

Enjoy!

C32...wtf???...you talking about your mommy's car again? wah-wah!!!

No one who buys a lexus 600hl would even be slightly interested in racing with a crappy 20k car. your car would register on the lexus owner's radar about as much as a garbage truck does.

This vehicle is already successful There is over a years waiting list for purchase.
Also, why would anybody want to be "burning out" with $100,000 luxury cars?
You must be a dunce!

the year long waiting list is just PR garbage. find information that says how many deposits they have and they we'll talk.

fyi--mercedes sold nearly 3,000 S550s a MONTH last year at an average price of nearly $100,000. lexus is going to sell less than 2,000 of these A YEAR (1850 has been the number quoted here)

Yeah, because you know more than everyone else.

I know you might find it hard to believe, but some people who love cars actually love Lexus too. Wow!

lots of people love lexus...over 300.000 sold last year. but they buy them for comfort, luxury and reliability. different reasons than those for higher-end luxury cars.

Lexus LS460 sales are higher per month than S550 sales per month. Look at latest stats.

"lots of people love lexus...over 300.000 sold last year. but they buy them for comfort, luxury and reliability. different reasons than those for higher-end luxury cars."
People buy high-end luxury cars exactly for comfort, luxury and reliability. They are not supposed to be sport sedans. Only badge whores would buy them for any other reason.

first of all, sales always spike massively when a car first comes out. the S550 launched last february and hit sales of 3500/month for the first several months. so you need to compare apples to apples.

second, a car that sells for $61000 should do far more volume than one that sells for 87000.

david:

"People buy high-end luxury cars exactly for comfort, luxury and reliability"
maserati? no
aston? no
rolls? comfort and luxury...yes. reliability....no.
bentley? definitely not for reliability
ferrari? no on all the above
lambo? no on all the above
mercedes? no
bmw? no

Lambo, Ferrari, Aston MArtin, etc. are expensive cars, but not considered Luxury vehicles known for comfort. Again sports or sporty cars are not bought buy people looking for these attributes.

You are the one who claimes the Mercedes S class outsells the LS in North America.

why compromise?
you can get great performance and luxury in one car: the S550.

david:
i have not claimed that the S outsells the LS.
in did, however, outsell the LS when you compare first months to first months.
and, as i've said before, a $61,000 car SHOULD do more volume than an $87,000 car.

more than likely just another badge whore david.

Wow! You referenced an LS to a Camry!

Good job. Now make the switch from pull-ups to big-boy pants, actually learn about cars and the companies that make them, and maybe you'll actually contribute to the discussion. Maybe.

That would be sweet! Real S600 competitor!

I had a short-lived fling with the LS600hL this week... on the flight to L.A., I was reading a Robb Report, because my wife wanted to see the houses in a special issue of it. Well, it so happened that it came with a seperate car issue... about "green" vehicles. LS600hL was in there, and I brought it up with my wife because it is an AWD LS. That it's a hybrid doesn't hurt.

However, when we got to L.A. and she got a glimpse of the numerous S550s there... she wouldn't budge from her anti-Lexus position. She has her heart set on an S550 4Matic, and whether or not I'll spend about $100,000 on a car remains to be seen. This will be the true test of our marriage!

Buy the Benz, you'll love it!

Except when its in for repairs and you're relegated to a rental car because your MB dealer doesn't have enough loaner vehicles available because everyone else's Merc is also in for repairs.

4matic come on if you are going there A8 is the way to go

We drove the A8. I'll always love the A8.

But it's hard to resist the S.

MercBasher, it's sensible of you to say those things, when the W221's reliability hasn't even been recorded yet.

I think we'd be pretty happy with it, even if the COMAND system had to get fixed twice a year.

10% better reliability. snore.

Mercedes reliability has been rated #1 worst brand by the people (Consumer Reports) whose full time job is to evaluate these matters. I think only the badge whores are the ones who will try to convince people it is not a big deal.

I can't understand why you have to comment on my every move.

Out to get me? Maybe. Jealous? Probably.

Of course, you have a right to doubt. It's only a website.

But, I will state again: I will be posting articles on the new cars I buy, WITH PICTURES.

It seems as if you single me out, and me only. There are others on the site who lay claim to high-end BMWs, Mercs, Lexii and the like.

This is a reply to mromar.

love consumer reports.
but the reality it that high-end cars are not bought in the same way as appliances.

high-end cars are bought for emotional reasons (styling, performance, etc) more than practical. again....mercedes, bmw, rolls, maserati, bentley, etc.

The Lexus LS600hL might have 480hp??

I thought it would have 600hp!

Where did you get that idea?

BTW, it doing 0-60 in less than 5.4 is no major accomplishment for a high-power sedan... I expect more like five flat.

ever-conservative mercedes states 4.5 for the S600 and 4.2 for the S65AMG. and they consistently underpromise.

This is a Lexus, not a Mercedes.

5.4s is BMW official 0-60 time claimed for 760Li 6.0 v12. 438hp 760Li weights close to 5,000lb, so rest assure 480hp LS600hL will beat this time by a big margin.

Not large enough to be significant, if Lexus's own 430hp number is correct.

The 760Li is quicker than that, BTW. BMW and Audi both ALWAYS underestimate 0-60 times. The A8L W12 is recorded as 5.1 or something on their website; I've seen as good as 4.8. 760Li is in the 5.0-5.2 area.

480hp not 430hp

430 not 480. you misspoke. lexus is probably the most credible source on this subject don't you think? they say 430.

wow baby wow!! Ok you guys really need to know by now, you need to stop comparing a none tuned car to the AMG or M or S8 or what ever of the Germen tuned sedans. The stock engine of the LS600 makes 480, just imagin if you tune this thing how much power will come out of it, THEN come and compare the AMG or others to it.

the S600 is not a "tuned" car. it's a standard line S-class. 4.5 second to 60.

Lets wait and see what the actual track figure is on the LS600hl.

buy why wait to pass judgement?

according to nearly every lexus fan on here, the LS600 will surpass the 760 and s600 in every way imaginable. and anyone who dares question these baseless, factless claims is just a 'badge whore.' right?

For 120K it should at least have 480hp.

for that money it should also LOOK different than a $61,000 car.

What justifies the $55,000 difference appearance wise between an S550 and S600?

The difference isn't appearance, it's substance.

The S550 is already stunning enough. All they needed to do was give it bigger exhausts to call it the 600... but the luxury difference, as well as the power difference, is more than noticeable.

1. a massively powerful twin turbo V12 that significantly surpasses the S550 (that's worth at least $10-15K)
2. nearly every option on the S550 is standard on the S600 so that accounts for more than $20k of the difference
3. exclusivity since there are far fewer S600s available. throw in $10k for that and you've made up the difference

You were claiming that the price difference between a base LS and LS600hL was not justified apperance wise, and now you are claiming the huge price difference between the S550 and S600 is justified by other attributes other than appearance.

it's not justified period.
looks wise the LS is nice but doesn't look distinctive in the $60K+ range. take that up to the $120k range and its looks are far too benign.

but i'm just a simple badge whore david!

The Lexus LS600hL is the DADDY of all luxury sedans?!

A friend of mine got one last week, I loved the digital clock in the LS460! It is so Camry-ish!!

Daddy my a$$, just a jumbo sized Camry. That's all.

Nice story.

Sure is a lot of fiction around here today.

I don't aspire to the most unreliable vehicles [that would be Mercedes] sold in the US, and I object to suggestions that everyone does.

yes famous people can be idiots

i don't think Oprah is a car nut
can you see some dude saying "I bought this car because Oprah owns one?"

Saying that is a brilliant comment really reflects poorly on yourself.

aston, maserati, bentley, rolls....all horribly unreliable. and nobody who buys them gives a crap.

but lexus has marginally better reliability than jaguar (ranked just below lexus in JD powers), BMW and mercedes and all of a sudden realiability is king.

get with the program, realiability is only a small part of the decisions (if at all) to buy a high end luxury car. it is, however, critically important in buying a value-priced luxury car like lexus.

Ok, so we're back to that old antiquated belief that in this day and age MB/BMW is still the "car you aspire to own".

I can tell you that this belief only applies to balding old denture-wearing old-fashioned, old-thinking fashion-challenged twerp till I'm blue in the face. But hey, why listen to me.

So I suggest to simply look at what vehicles are common on the road these dats. Really, it's actually that simple - just KEEP YOUR EYES OPEN.

I always did, and this is why I KNOW that MB is really nothing special - it's not like one rolls by and everyone stops whatever they are doing and admires it. Anywhere here in North America, a common shcmuck can afford a MB/BMW. You see these cars in used vehicle lots alongside Sentras and Fords and can be had for just about the same price. I'm not sure what it is like in Europe although I know they use these vehicles as taxis so I'm assuming the brand itself isn't necessarily something you'd "aspire to own".

So to these people I suggest hopping on a time machine and zap yourselves out of the past and into the present. I know it's not easy since like my dad, you people often talk about the good ol' days. Those days are gone. In a few years so will you but in the meantime get with the times a little bit.

OK, you want to talk flagship sedans? Well, tell me what Lexus model prior to the LS600h do you think was Lexus' answer to S65 AMG and 760Li?

NONE.

So...since Lexus wasn't really even playing the game prior to the 600h, how on this green earth can you say that this new 600h will not have the same cachet as those others, when it hasn't been out for very long (is it even out yet?).

Also, all I was really trying to say to those who still think that the MB/BMW nameplate still garners the admiration it used to, is that THEY ARE DELUSIONAL. With their entry level offerings and the fact that every doofus and his dog and mother can now afford it, MB/BMW brand is about as special as bird shit on a statue.

Not to say that there are no longer brands that one can aspire to own (Bentley, Aston Martin, Ferrari/Lambo), all I'm saying is that it ain't MB and BMW anymore.

"So...since Lexus wasn't really even playing the game prior to the 600h, how on this green earth can you say that this new 600h will not have the same cachet as those others, when it hasn't been out for very long (is it even out yet?)."

Although I think the LS600hL was a fabulous idea, you just answered your own question.

"...since Lexus wasn't really even playing the game prior to the 600h..."

That's exactly why. To gain prestige/cachet or whatever the hell you want to call it, the car (in most cases) should be out for awhile, and bought by high-profile luxury clients. Look at the S600. Do you think the name "S600" is prestigious for no reason?

I didn't settle for a Lexus. I did research and found it provided the best value. I could have purchased a MB or BMW but didn't.

Dave
IS-350, soon to be exchanged for an IS-F

The main reason these cars are taxis in Europe is because they are CHEAP, as per fleet sales.

Who aspires to own a Mercedes anymore,except the badge whores? Merecdes is heavily discounting their cars to push sales, Example, at least a $10-$15,000
discount on R class models without even asking for one. This is a brand you aspire for? I have yet to hear of Ferrari, or Lambo dropping a dime off thier cars.

Uuhh, I hate to repeat what I just wrote but you do realize that the vehicles we are arguing about are the S65 AMG and 760Li, correct? So basically what you are saying is that these particular models have been around long enough to earn that reputation. Now tell me when were these particular vehicles released again?

The R-Class is the ONLY model they are discounting. You could say C-Class, but that's a bit unfair, because it's in its last model year.

I can't think of one aspiring executive, Hollywood writer, actor etc. who wouldn't dream of owning a Mercedes-Benz SL550.

I totally agree. I need no further comments.

Wow, those are people everybody should look up to.

david:

lexus NEVER discounts cars right?

also, try to say something constructive. enough with calling everyone who doesn't buy cars based on largely on reliability a badge whore. there are other reasons to buy a car.

you're right david, just a bunch of badge whores!

and those taxi drivers are just BADGE WHORES anyway.

I doubt many people can afford the LS600hL either.

Skoda just came first in the Top Gear Survey, Lexus was second.
Also, in the Auto Express satisfaction and reliability survey, the BMW 5 series came 5th. The RX came second, but no other Lexus' were ahead of it.
German engineering seems to be doing alright (Skoda is VW owned and based on VWs)

Rupert,
Where did u get that info from, just went to topgear.com. didn;t find any info bout any survey?
pass the link

http://www.topgear.com/content/carsurvey/2006/features/08/1.html
also
http://www.topgear.com/content/carsurvey/2006/features/08/2.html
the second link is the manufacturers table in full.
it took me ages to find it though, they have hidden the survey well, for some strange reason.
Also, the BMW X3 was the most reliable car
http://www.topgear.com/content/carsurvey/2006/features/04/1.html

according to lexus.com, the 600hL will have approximately 430 hp.

That's what I thought, too. This is just speculation.

OVER 430hp. ~400hp 5.0L v8 + 225+hp electric motor.

The number 480hp is completely reasonable depending on how it will be tunned.

supra...i'm gonna trust lexus.com.
they're really good marketers so i don't think they'd underestimate hp so badly.
i

When Lexus says "430hp," I hope you realize that they ARE including the electronic motors, just as they did on EVERY OTHER Lexus hybrid car. Why wouldn't they now?

The fact that a few dozen die-hard German fans are arguing feverishly over this car speaks volumes to me.

what's even more embarrassing (for them), is that EVEN AMERICAN cars are more reliable than any euro brand, to say nothing of asian cars, INCLUDING HYUNDAI.

only the Lexus, Infiniti and Acura nameplates however, really pose a threat to the germy big3. hence their DESPARATE VEHEMENCE in dissing lexus, the leader of the asian Gang of Three.

Here's my few cents worth. I love nice cars. If I had my choice of cars I'd take the Bugatti or the Ferrari. Since I can't afford them I have the IS-350. I used to have a 1999 M3. I switched to Lexus because I felt that they provided a very nice driving experience for a lot less money. Not as good as BMW, but close enough...

I've ordered the IS-F because I think it will handle much better than the IS-350.

Now, regarding the LS600hL. I think it's a really great looking car and if I was in the market for a full size car, I'd be more than happy to drive it.

Yes, I'd love to have the BMW 760, but the LS600 would do me fine.

Here are some photos of the LS600hl I took at the Milwaukee Auto Show:

<a href="http://www.taxicabs.com/autoshow/milwaukee2007/Lexus/LS600HL/">LS600hl Photos</A>

http://www.taxicabs.com/autoshow/milwaukee2007/Lexus/LS600HL/

See, this is an example of a good lexus fan.
He bought his car because he made an evaluative choice between various models, not just because it was a Lexus.
May I ask, would you have bought the Lexus if it was the same price as the equivalent BMW? You give the impression that you were prepared to sacrifice driving experience for a lower price.
You're not screaming about how the IS is "the best at everything", which is good.
I wish the other Lexus fans were more like you, some are complete morons (LexusKing said the Yaris has 500hp).

The bottom line is that the LS600hL is a brilliant automobile, packed with comfort, luxury and technology. Why would somebody argue otherwise?
Except, of course, the badge whores.

I don't think anyone is arguing that the LS is a bad car, just some people here don't think it is the car for them.
However, some people seem to spend a lot of time dissing Euro brands.
Why can't we all get along?

only a fool would drive the S600, 760 or A8 W12. brand whores!

the LS600 is the best car ever made period.
it will surpass every car on the market in nearly every way.

anyone who doesn't get this is just a stupid badge whore!

What some people here are claiming is that the LS is not as good as a 7 series or
an S class, just because it is a Lexus (Japanese). This forms the basis of their arguments which, of course, I always have a good laugh at.

Who does that bar the insane?

reliability rules!

Honestly Lexus is a really god Luxury Manufacture. The Only thing that really gets me very angry and start hating Lexus is the fan boys like LexusKing. I would buy the LS600H if I didn't want a high performance car like the S600 and also if I want a hybrid. They are equally good cars they both have pros and cons. If I am a true car enthusiast with the money I would buyy both.

good**

Might as well might it 500 hp, since it close it anyway. If Lexus ever make this Lexus LS600hl with 500hp it shut up all the German fanboys for awhile at least.

Look like Lexus is going to over this segment as well with it 480+hp. Lexus rock! yeah.................

The S600 has 510hp. Just felt like letting that out.

It is really funny! to see all the German fanboys scambling and searching the internet to see if it true. They want to know if Lexus is going to actually put 480+ hp on the new Lexus LS600hl.

Why are they doing this? because they are scare. If this is true, than the Lexus LS is going to outperform their favorite German brand.

Lexus is truly genius at mareting and creating a commotion and buzz in the autoworld community. Got to love their marketing plan.

Imagine if they come out tommorrow and says they will produce a high end LS600hl with 600hp. Than all the German fanboys is really going to "shit" in their pant for sure. Eventually Lexus is going to put 600hp on one of their high performance Lexus. Just look at the Lexus LF-A, rumor to have 550hp.

Ha....ha....ha....he...he...he....

Lexus

Stop with the drugs.

Your posts are sensationalised and irrational.

Why would we be scared?

We are not actually the car companies.

We like their cars, but we're not "scare" when someone comes out with something faster.

Just to end any confusion, THE LS600HL WILL HAVE 430HP.

Oh and, no, I have not been searching the Web for press on the LS600hL.

I honestly don't care.

430hp, 480hp or 600hp, it will be a great car.

we're not "scrambling." simply correcting your mistaken conclusions.

correction, it marketing etc....

This Lexus LS600hl is going to be a collectible item for sure. The regular Lexus LS460 already had a 1 year wait list, imagine, how long you have to wait for this one. Lexus has done it again with this masterpiece.


Sure beat anything the German offer for sure, better looking than that old fart outdated 7 Series. Better looking/safer than the S-class, and more exciting than the Audi A8 for sure.

Hey! the BMW 7 Series, Audi A8 and MB S-class are great cars but It just not my taste. Ranking between the four that I would choose, 1)Lexus LS600hl, 2) Audi A8, 3) MB S-class and 4) BMW 7 Series.

If it's not your taste then why would you make a claim that the LS will beat anything from Germany? :-) Your comment has nothing to do with your taste. You just don't want to receive heat from us European fans and get deboosted as usual.

I respect the LS but I don't particularly like it as much as it's German counterparts. I never hated on it. I only disagree majorly when people claim it's an ultra luxury saloon when it's not. It needs to surpass the credibility in a world wide scale which means winning the hearts of all the Audi, BMW, & Mercedes lovers. That will be heard. Simply because of heritage .

Unlike Lexus, Mercedes needs no heavy marketing. The name has been established. Lexus is fairly new compared to it's rivals therefore that heavy exposure is required to embed the L logo as a car of quality and luxury just as good as the Euros. I admit they've done an awesome job in capturing the US Market. But the rest of the world is a tough market. I'm positive that the world will eventually learn to respect the brand but the claims that some fans make really give the L brand a poser image.

The LS will be a great car with functionality. However passion and soul is what it lacks. It's a technological marvel but the spirit of driving a Lexus isn't quite there. It's good at what it's designed for but the feel you get when you drive one differs completely from it's competition.

This is my opinion, not a claim, so don't be hating on me. I say it is so because when I drive a Lexus I feel good about myself and that i'm driving a well built car. But when I drive a German it gives me a different feeling. One that I even can't describe.

"Hey! the BMW 7 Series, Audi A8 and MB S-class are great cars but It just not my taste. "

EXACTLY!!!

SOME PEOPLE WILL DISAGREE WITH YOU!

THE LS JUST MIGHT NOT BE MY TASTE!

Maybe I'd consider the S-Class better-looking! It's possible!

Or maybe I'd think the A8 was a more exciting car! Some people do!

OPEN UP, LEXUS!

Oh and, where did you see that the LS has a one year waiting list?

As far as I know, you can pick one up from the dealership, or custom-order it if you want. Custom-order delivers in two to three months; we did it with the RX330.

Again, LS600hL has a wait list of over a year.

"The LS will be a great car with functionality. However passion and soul is what it lacks"

Again, there's that magical "passion and soul" argument that the badge whores love to use when describing what the difference is between a German brand and a Lexus. Truely laughable

you are so right david!

Remember, Lexus will always maintain a Luxury brand status by
never going downmarket with their vehicles, unlike some others we can name
(1 series, B class) etc. The badge whores will go wild once the 1 series hits
North American shores.

they don't need to go downmarket.
they're already there with 65% of their cars: RX and ES.

damn those badge whores!

i can't believe that 2.3 million people worldwide are stupid enough to buy a BMW or mercedes each year.

if only they were as smart as the 400,000 people around the world who buy a lexus each year.

badge whores!!

can't wait to get the next hot issue of consumer reports so i can decide what kind of car to get next!

The ads which appeared on TV today (4/2) say that the LS 600h L will have 438 hp, which is equivalent to the 438 hp put out by the V12 in the 760Li.

curious...did they mention torque or acceleration times?

so much for the 480hp claimed in this headline.