Lexus, Please Stop the Madness!

Lexus, Please Stop the Madness!
If you research the upcoming Lexus IS-F to any degree the first thing you notice is lots of hype but hopelessly few details.

There are plenty of videos of smoking tires and power drifts. Impressive yes, but any 16 in a 66 Dodge Dart could do the same. If you press a little deeper you may find more videos of staged dyno runs where you hear the rumbling exhaust but no hardcore figures to chew on.

The Nissan GT-R by contrast debuts roughly at the same time but here we actually can see the fruits of our efforts and we are rewarded with not only videos, but horsepower stats and even Nuringburgring lap times. By contrast Lexus has probably logged a similar amount laps on the ring but we have no information at all to indicate where the car will stand next to its peers. Frustrating to say the least for any enthusiast especially a true fan

To give as an example, I actually stumbled on to a forum conversation on Club Lexus where the vacuum of information and its negative impact was discussed. In the thread at least one person discussed actually withdrawing his deposit on an IS-F simply because he did not know what he was going to get. His fear was the hype was just that, hype and he would be better served buying something else. A very real problem in public perception.

Is the IS-F going to be limited in production or not? The first figure rumored is a limited run of 5000 copies. Now due to the information vacuum some dealers are reportedly quoting a limit of 2500 units and are now pricing accordingly with additional premiums. A call to my local Lexus dealer again echoed a 2500 unit limit was expected for the 2008 model run.

What is the point of this exercise you might ask? Well, when dealing with the Germans you get a lot of information in advance, sometimes 2 years in advance, and more details enter the pipeline as the debut gets closer. The enthusiast not only has an idea of what is to come, but he can make rational decisions and judgments on just where his favorite model will stand next to its peers. The American’s are not quite as forth coming with the information up front but it tends to trickle out more often and eventually you get the same end result before the debut.

For some reason Lexus has decided this time to rely on intangible forms of information, such as tire smoking videos Do they raise awareness? Yes. But the also give nothing in the form of cold hard facts. Is this a disservice to the potential buyer, or part of a larger issue?

I’ll give two scenarios to discuss in closing:

Scenario 1: The IS-F will debut with class leading performance levels and the secrecy was merely to keep to competition in the dark and blindside them in a brilliant PR move. There will be a new “King of the Hill” and the “F” moniker will be on par with the legendary “M” from BMW. Pure brilliance!

Scenario 2: The IS-F will not place near the top in side by side comparisons and Lexus knows it. The secrecy was maintained to allow PR cover their tracks and possibly announce more powerful version in the distant future. In this scenario Lexus will use tried and the proven philosophy of “We may not get you there first, But we will get you there every time!” Perhaps relying on brand image and reputation to smooth over the potential performance failings. History has proven that the Lexus typical buyer is forgiving in this area and is willing to accept 80% of the performance for 70% of the price.

Will the IS-F be a marketing success? Yes! They will sell every one the can make and there will probably be a healthy gray market until supply meets the demand. But will it be a performance success? As long a Lexus remains tight lipped we won’t know until for at least another few months.
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RupertRupert - 9/26/2007 5:22:31 PM
+6 Boost
Remind me again how you're not a Lexus fan and actually like Audis?


IamEvilHomerIamEvilHomer - 9/26/2007 5:32:13 PM
+9 Boost
lexus is a marketing company not a car company

this is why they have hype
it works for some idiots as we can all see


Agent009Agent009 - 9/26/2007 3:53:18 PM
+5 Boost
And just what numbers are the going to hit? No one even has a clue outside of Lexus.


Agent009Agent009 - 9/26/2007 4:08:11 PM
0 Boost
No doubt it will be tested a lot!


answeranswer - 9/26/2007 4:30:05 PM
+1 Boost
The person responsible for the most IS-F stories here at autospies is... agent009!

I would say he doing more of the hype generating than anyone at Lexus.


IamEvilHomerIamEvilHomer - 9/26/2007 5:36:10 PM
+1 Boost
yes it will be tested and lexus will supply over tuned cars to the press like they always do when the real cars will be slower




r15mohdr15mohd - 9/26/2007 4:05:09 PM
+4 Boost
for a very long time now, Lexus has said the numbers wouldn't be released until or after the tokyo auto show. now like i said in many other posts, if you can't deal with that then find something else to spend your time on. they made the decision to release the numebrs in their hometown, which is by far understandable.

whether you agree with their time-frame, is by far irrelevant to Lexus. they choose their marketing, releases, etc. we as a consumer have to be patient and wait for it.

its very simple...the supermarket antics of "the customer is right" doesnt apply in this scenario!



M53RM53R - 9/26/2007 4:07:35 PM
+4 Boost
I think they are just trying to excite everyone about the car, and this is working so far, people are going crazy! This will also bring people over to the dealership to ask about the IS-F.

Its obvious the car is extremely over hyped, since no 1 has any figures but some people are already placing bets on it... Its all Lexus marketing, and who knows, it may be a class leader... We will find out soon.


Agent009Agent009 - 9/26/2007 4:10:29 PM
+3 Boost
It is exciting everyone to say the least.

But it is frustrating to those that want hard cold facts. If you were a skeptic then you automatically assume (maybe incorrectly) that they are hiding something due to the lack of information.


Auto_expertAuto_expert - 9/26/2007 5:33:55 PM
+2 Boost
Who cares if it has 400hp or 500hp? It's STILL a Lexus.


IamEvilHomerIamEvilHomer - 9/26/2007 5:38:04 PM
+3 Boost
yes lexus is the number one chick brand for luxury so we understand it goes well with your purse


Auto_expertAuto_expert - 9/26/2007 5:45:40 PM
+5 Boost
Ha ha. If you're a Lexus toady you can take, "It's STILL a Lexus," to be a good thing. On the other hand, if love TRUE driving perfection and place little value on auto parallel parking features and such, you can take it to mean another thing.


M35MTM35MT - 9/26/2007 4:17:49 PM
-3 Boost
Agent009, they are keeping it a secret for this very reason...to generate more hype, or should I say, hysteria.

One thing is for sure, it better look better in person than in the photos.

I didnt catch the final numbers on the GTR in the other threads - what are they??


LexusLexus - 9/26/2007 4:23:52 PM
+2 Boost
I am a hardcore Lexus fan and yes I getting bore of this hype and stuff. Give us the number and statistic already Lexus.

It not like they are going to lose face for not dethrone the Audi RS4 and M3, it their first try. No one expect your first trial to knock out the king right away.


answeranswer - 9/26/2007 4:28:09 PM
+3 Boost
Funny that the person that posts every single mention of IS-F articles is the same person now bitching about not having concrete details.

Relax. They will come. Lexus does not owe you anything.

If nothing else, these PR pieces are providing the fodder you use to create autospies stories with the sole purpose of starting a flame war.


EnvyofyouRS5EnvyofyouRS5 - 9/26/2007 4:29:42 PM
+1 Boost
Lexus can not pull a Lamborghini Reventon on the public...

I am with 009, there will be endless tests, but i hope Autospies has one. I see it now, RS4 vs. M3. VS. IS-F. Once again the 4 rings has no problem in bringing the others back to the drawing board. :)


david989david989 - 9/26/2007 5:06:00 PM
-8 Boost
Excuse me? The LS600h has set a new standard in the upper class of luxury sedans. The LS600h competes with Bentley, Rolls Royce and Maybach (except that Lexus has more heritage and history than Maybach which was founded in 2001 I think) and it kills them in performance, especially emissions and fuel economy. In the hands of a good driver like myself for example I guarantee you that I can win a 0-60 race with an LS600h against say a Maybach 67S.


IamEvilHomerIamEvilHomer - 9/26/2007 5:34:19 PM
+4 Boost
david with that dumb logic i think the Subaru little crapy sports car is a much better car then the 600 right?

faster, better emissions, longer history, better fuel economy.


AutoEngAutoEng - 9/26/2007 5:37:56 PM
+13 Boost
Just in case you were actually serious about your post there, David, let me put up a couple of corrections to enlighten you.

1) There is no such vehicle as a Maybach 67S. There are however Maybach 57, 62, 57S and 62S.

2) Maybach-Motorenbau GmbH was founded in 1909 (nearly a century prior to your claim of 2001) and had built a name for itself with opulent vehicles all through the 1920's and 1930's not only before Lexus came into the picture around 6 decades later, but before Toyota as well which was founded in 1934.

3) While I will agree with you that the LS600h will likely provide better fuel economy than a Maybach 62s, you must understand that the Maybach 62S Type 12 engine produces 612hp(vs combined 438hp hybrid drive) and torque 740ft/lbs of torque (vs theoretical hybrid combined torque of 600ft/lbs). The Maybach is also significantly heavier at 6130lbs (vs 5220lbs Lexus).

4) despite the weight disadvantage the 0-60 time of the Maybach is in the high4/low5 sec range compared to a high5/low6sec range for the Lexus.

Don't get me wrong, the Lexus is not a terrible car. It is a very innovative design but, one thing's for sure, it's no Maybach. And for 1/4 of the money, it shouldn't be. :)


chewychewy - 9/26/2007 7:34:16 PM
+4 Boost
Yep, if you don't show the hp figures for almost a year that probably means that you have nothing special to hide.


gsh23gsh23 - 9/26/2007 8:50:24 PM
+1 Boost
slow down guys, how does keeping tight lipped and saying nothing generate hype and PR? there have been no official lexus ads, movies, or "leaks" to generate hype.

the attention to the isf is purely inquisitive by enthusiasts both for and against who are dying to know the specs.

has it occurred to you that this is how the japanese business runs? no specs on the gtr despite preorders in japan. nothing from acura. outside of cars, no one knew anything about the ps3 or wii before being released.


S4cabriofoxoneS4cabriofoxone - 9/27/2007 12:24:37 AM
+3 Boost
"there have been no official lexus ads, movies, or "leaks" to generate hype."

I would consider the car's auto show run last year to be hype.

And how about that recent advertisement with the strange blue smoke, proclaiming, "EVERYTHING YOU THOUGHT WE WEREN'T"?

And maybe that track day for the Lexus owners from the "Club Lexus" website...

Or all of the movies released online...


nse70nse70 - 9/26/2007 9:32:55 PM
+4 Boost
The IS-F is dead in light of the Nissan GT-R and Mitsubishi Evolution X debuts.


enthusiastx11enthusiastx11 - 9/26/2007 9:42:20 PM
+3 Boost
scenario 2 undoubtedly.




EL34EL34 - 9/26/2007 10:14:28 PM
+6 Boost
What's the matter with Lexus are they afraid the new IS-F is a slacka$$?


xj13xj13 - 9/27/2007 12:07:35 AM
+4 Boost
This boring car is a cheap M3 copy, who cares what the numbers are?


theonemikaheltheonemikahel - 9/27/2007 1:23:17 PM
+2 Boost
Would the M3 be less of a car if and it does have less horsepower than the other competitor ( c63 and the RS4 )... It's a package not just hp. But all these car have a different goal(in the same market) and approche. Is there one bad car.... Just different need, different buyer and will see who's who when they compare them side by side on the Nurburgring, the real comparasion.


XYZZXYZZ - 9/29/2007 3:25:28 AM
+1 Boost
haha!

all the whiners are just playing into the hand of the lexus PR people.

it's like in H'wood: there is no such thing as bad publicity. ALL publicity gets your name in the limelight. so even bad publicity is good!

the PR guys are playing you all like a fiddle!



XYZZXYZZ - 10/3/2007 10:03:01 PM
+1 Boost

i can think of at least one (of many) good reasons:

toyota/lexus RELIABILITY!

i just paid over $2000 to ransom from the shop my fun/performance machine, for an unexpected repair. i had gotten SO SPOILED for virtually NO COSTS other than regular maintenance on my toyotas, i won't consider ANY other brands than toyota or lexus anymore.

(this performance machine is a honda, btw. which is ONLY no. 2 after toyota/lexus on reliability.)




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