What would you rather buy - the cheaper BMW M3 Sedan or the Lexus IS-F?

i concur.

could not agree more

could not agree more

I think question was meant to be a joke in all seriousness. I see the IS-Forgettable following in the footsteps of the Acura NSX.

I think the question was meant to be a joke in all seriousness. I see the IS-Forgettable following in the footsteps of the Acura NSX.

Neither honestly. I would rather get something else. If I had to pick, can't believe I am saying it, it's like picking the worse of two evils...I would have to get the M3.

'Neither honestly'

Honestly, your response is unnecessary. If you're not interested in either car, WHY DID YOU JOIN THE THREAD? Are you just that desperate to be heard (or read?)

I simply answered the question, no reason to get defensive...I don't like either, just like I don't like your comment. Sorry you don't like my answer.

the thing is, its a toyota, and who knows how long that'll take. lol

you are such a dramma queen. I didn't know homos are roaming here.

The M3 is the best bang for the buck and nothing is even close ... the article forgot the free full maint, which is another $ 3k of savings over 4 years. faster, more room, manual gearbox and soon to be debut of M-DKG ...

I was going to point out the same thing. The 4 Year Free Maintenance is a BIG savings.

The IS-F has a few things going for it too, though, the SMG like tranny is super smooth, the torque and the sound it makes when you hit 3500RPM.

I'd probably get the 335 Sedan and chip it :)

over 1.2MM people every year. great looking cars that are a blast to drive. reality.

"its the same car in different sizes. reality."

yeah, the X6, 3-series, 7-series, Z4, etc are really just the same car....except they share no body panels, are different vehicle types, and have an array of different powertrains.

you're a schmuck.

M3

You're off to a lousy start.

Rosko2 ?

Yet another sequel nobody was asking for.

I'd take the M3 without hesitation, since I think the IS-F looks like something a tuner created for Fast and Furious 4. But even as a BMW enthusiast it should be noted that those are base prices, and with similar equipment the M3 will be several thousand dollars more than the IS-F. There's about $10k in available options on the M3.

M3 sedan, no question about it. IS-F hasn't proven to be a time tested powerhouse like M models have in the past. I like the IS-F, but given the choice I'll take the M anyday of the week.

Another thread to start fights. Can't we just wait for the IS-F and M3 sedan to finally come out so we can read a comparo through MT or some other place then do our bickering.

People will buy BMWs cause they are BMWs, but that does not mean people will buy a Lexus cause they think it's the cheaper alternative. Different tastes apply.

the M3 is worth more either way.

ISF

1. the m3 costs more when you add basic options
2. the interior on the m3 is lame
3. i dont like driving manual in traffic
4. id prefer the "underdog"
5. lexus nav is much nicer
6. reliability
7. has more potential for mods
8. less expensive after warranty expires
9. resale value

"1. the m3 costs more when you add basic options
2. the interior on the m3 is lame
3. i dont like driving manual in traffic
4. id prefer the "underdog"
5. lexus nav is much nicer
6. reliability
7. has more potential for mods
8. less expensive after warranty expires
9. resale value"

1. Can't argue with that.

2. I certainly can argue with that. The M3's interior is very attractive, functional and inviting with the right color combo and options.

3. Then get the DSG, which is worlds better than any automatic transmission.

4. I don't care. Sometimes the underdog is better, sometimes it isn't; either way, you won't be getting anything subtle with the IS-F.

5. Who buys a performance sedan for its navigation system?

6. The M3 is a very reliable car... always has been.

7. Who says? Because it's Japanese?

8. But so much more expensive when the warranty is there, which is the duration of ownership.

9. M3 has fantastic resale... BMW's resale is top-notch overall.

Get the 135i coupe - a better car and save a ton o' dough...

To compare base price is definitely not fair to lexus if you are assuming the two base cars are similar. Undoubtedly lexus has a lot more standard features in their base that BMW will make you throw in as extras. That being said, would I rather pay 5k more for a comparable m3 over a base ISF...absolutely. I'd say im probably a lexus advocate more than bmw, but in a market where BMW has consistently been the benchmark to which all other attempts are compared, i'll stick with the leader until lexus has a few years and a reputation in this market as being legit.

It depends on how much room you need and if you're concerned about gas mileage. If room is not an issue and you can give up a few 10ths to 60 MPH I would spring for a Cayman S. However if the parameters are only between these 2 I would have to go for the M3. The reason is it's simply the more sporty hard edged car. In addition you can get it with a manual.

I'll take the ISF I don't like the looks of BMW's anymore and their too hard edged.I want to have the new kid on the block with better reliability and service loaner cars etc.The BMW dealer in our town is owned by Tom Benson and everybody hates him and their service sucks.

You mean the new kid on the block(IS-F) that overheats in every test? Better reliability..LOL...

What the hell is insumance money?Learn to spell boy before you debate me!BTW when you hit a wall in an ISF with all the advanced safety features it has I'll survive.

OK, first Yukihiko decides to use the M3 as benchmark in hitting the targets, but now Lexus says that they didn't make it to compete with neither M3, RS4, or C63.

Lexus needs to get their story straight on why they built this thing...

To show the world,BMW already knew,their's a new sherriff in town and the names LEXUS!!!! The new world order.Bow down to LEXUS!!!!!!!!!!

The IS-F because the M3 looks realy cheap and has no torque.

and yet the M3 has been quicker in every test but one. Average margin of victory where the M3 was quicker: 0.3 seconds 0-60. Margin in the one test where the IS-F was quicker: 0.1 second. And the DCT is supposed to drop 0.2 seconds off those already quicker than the IS-F times. Sucks losing to a car with "no torque" doesn't it?

you obviously don't know the meaning of red line at 8,400 rpm, do you Mr. STJ?

you obviously don't know the meaning of red line at 8,400 rpm, do you Mr. STJ?

CTS-V

Good point Drew...don't forget the C63
T

The CTS-V will have to be dealt with but its wedged between the M3 and M5. Still seems like a contender!

the M3 is worth MORE than the ISF. so choosing it for less is a no brainer.

handling: BMW
looks: BMW
ride: BMW
reputation: BMW
acceleration: either

Your right it shows you have no brain!!!!!

people like rosco, who think that bmws do all these "magical things" makes the brand look bad. it may be very simple minded but id hate to be associated with someone like him, and to be HONEST, the people that drive bmws and think that they are "wealthy" and think that they have "taste" is one of the main reasons that i dislike them (bmws). other factors include cheap looking interiors (i dont care about the "materials" used, they still LOOK cheap), and that buck-toothed grill. im sure they drive like magic..but now that lexus is getting into the sport segment, their handling will improve. anyones who thinks that lexus' handling sucks should go study a little about cars so that they can realize that Lexus is a luxury car brand...not a sports car. they use electronic steering for a soft ride and to save weight..they are not made to handle like sports cars..im suprized that all the lexus haters dont know that already !! arent you supposed to be enthusiasts?? its sad that rosco needs a car for "sex appeal" and to "get laid"..thats NEVER a reason to like a car, i think people should rely more on personality and good looks...i guess some people just have to make up for things that they lack

"the people that drive bmws and think that they are "wealthy" and think that they have "taste" is one of the main reasons that i dislike them (bmws)"

Don't be a hypocrite stash.

hypocrite? not at all. you make no sense

First you said this,

"the people that drive bmws and think that they are "wealthy" and think that they have "taste" is one of the main reasons that i dislike them (bmws)

but then you ended with,

"its sad that rosco needs a car for "sex appeal" and to "get laid"..thats NEVER a reason to like a car"

Rosco is basically loving BMW's for the wrong reasons and you are following him by hating BMW's for the wrong reasons as well.

does that make more sense now?

First you said this,

"the people that drive bmws and think that they are "wealthy" and think that they have "taste" is one of the main reasons that i dislike them (bmws)

but then you ended with,

"its sad that rosco needs a car for "sex appeal" and to "get laid"..thats NEVER a reason to like a car"

Rosco is basically loving BMW's for the wrong reasons and you are following him by hating BMW's for the wrong reasons as well.

does that make more sense now?

First you said this,

"the people that drive bmws and think that they are "wealthy" and think that they have "taste" is one of the main reasons that i dislike them (bmws)

but then you ended with,

"its sad that rosco needs a car for "sex appeal" and to "get laid"..thats NEVER a reason to like a car"

Rosco is basically loving BMW's for the wrong reasons and you are following him by hating BMW's for the wrong reasons as well.

does that make more sense now?

First you said this,

"the people that drive bmws and think that they are "wealthy" and think that they have "taste" is one of the main reasons that i dislike them (bmws)

but then you ended with,

"its sad that rosco needs a car for "sex appeal" and to "get laid"..thats NEVER a reason to like a car"

Rosco is basically loving BMW's for the wrong reasons and you are following him by hating BMW's for the wrong reasons as well.

does that make more sense now?

damn, i guess i have to be more patient with the submit comment tab.

Either is fine by me.

The only honest person in here.Its like having a blonde and a red head they both are fun to drive and handle great,it just depends what mood your in!

M3 after read many review seems to be the most engaging to drive, and oh yeah, MANUAL TRANSMISSION.

I'll take the IS-F because i don't like the styling of the M3 Sedan. And also IS-F's got way more torque, faster accerleration, top speed and standard features. And to me it's styling and interior is also better than the M3's. and don't forget the lightneing quick 8 speed gearshift of IS-F.

IS-F to me is a clear winner here.

JUGNU

so..hes a loser for stating his opinion?

Rosco, youre the REAL copycat..you havent even driven the isf and you have an opinion about them.

btw..i would prefer an automatic..and im someone who can actually afford these cars..can you?

so the m3 is faster in top speed? but..who cares right?? what a contradiction !!

youre the real loser rosco2..enjoy your 328i..lol

the is-f would probably get more fans if it came in manual transmission

M3=blown engine,check the failure rate an past M3's

The problem with early e46 M3's and the S54 engine stemmed from the connecting rod bottom-end bearing shells that were supplied to BMW by a third party that did not meet BMW's specifications. There was a recall to fix this issue and warranties were increased to six years.

We don't know how the S65 engine will perform reliability wise as its too early to tell.

Hey Kinger,I hear you,but if you bought one and your motor crapped out you would blame the Mfg.,not the supplier.I'm not saying the new BMW engine will fail,but you must look at past performance to determine future performance.

My M3's engine has never blown! And I redline in first gear all the time. The IS-F is going to be a good, maybe even great car but the M3 is the leader of this pack.

You can't beat the champion in a close title fight by being his equal. You have to knock him out. And the IS-F doesn't come close to knocking the M3 out!

past performance has noting to do with future performance. if you constantly looking at past performance, then you will let the world past you by because you are stuck thinking about the past... the world moves on and improves on past failures.

you think a crashed stock market is an indication of future results? I sure don't.

Thats a little advice for living as well...

I am actually not really a fan of either car. For me I would go pick up a C63. I love the engine its a beast. But if I really had to chose between the two listed. I would probably end up with the M3 sedan. Don't tell anyone cause I really don't like Bimmers much anymore.
T

vmam1013 By your comment,I redline my M3 in first gear all the time and my engine didn't blow,You know nothing about cars.Every part made has a certain percent failure rate.The key to reliability is to reduce that percentage as much as possible.Lexus does this better than BMW, fact.

IS-F

Better Styling
Better Interior
More standard features
Quality and relibilty
More Torque
Faster Acceleration
Greater Top Speed
More quick 8 Speed Gearshifts
Equal in handling

To me IS-F is the clear cut winner here as M3 don't have that many things in it's side apart from maybe the option of manual transmission.

JUGNU

Jungu & stash what are you talking about ...

1.Better styling for the IS-f? Yeah if you like body panels and stacked exhausts that make it look like a 16 year old pieced together. Styling is subjective. That is why there are 33 flavors of ice cream

2.Better interior - subjective. Do not slight the interior of the BMW, due to what your tastes are in looks. BMW designs their interiors around functionality and sport. They are not interested in a sports car to how soft the leather is or where the cup holders are. It is a sports car, not a luxury cruiser.

3. More standard features ... Lexus has more standard features but that is true of all Lexus's. BMW owners like to be different in regards to equipment from one car to the next. Why should I have to get navigation, in order to get bluetooth? I know where I am going. I personally, like being able to select the options I do and do not want. Especially, if I am spending this much money on a car.

4. Quality & Reliability -- how so? based on what? This is the first for Lexus in a performance car. My refrigerator is reliable and will last 20 years, but that doesnt make it exciting. If you know anything about BMW, then you will know how reliable the M3 has been. Car & driver has named the BMW 3-series in their top ten for 16 years in a row. Name one lexus that is even close.

5. More torque & better acceleration - yeah but at what RPM? How is the gearing set up? how well is the torque getting thru the drivetrain to the rear wheels? still doesnt mean it is faster. Car & driver has tested the new M3 0 to 60 in 4.1 seconds as have other magazines. The average has been 4.2. The IS-F has been clocked anywhere from 4.2 to 4.6 seconds with an average of 4.4seconds. The IS-F is slower.

6. Greater top speed - In the US the germans have an agreement to limit their cars to 155 mph. In europe that is not the case. The top speed on the M3 is greater. You would know this if you would actually do some research.

7. More quick 8 speed gearshifts - really? then what about the M-DKG by BMW? Lexus only offers a auto transmission. BMW offers 2-variants of a manual transmission. A " true sports car " should never be offered in a auto transmission. It is a race car for goodness sake. Last time I checked, no race cars use a auto transmission.

8. Equal in handling - how do you know? have they been tested side by side yet? Last time I checked the BMW M3 was compared to a RS4 and C63 and bested both of them.

9. how bout maint? does lexus pay for it? no
10. size -- the M3 is alot bigger inside. I am 6'2 and can't even pretend to sit behind anyone in the back seat of the Lexus. resale -- are you kidding me? The M3 has the best resale of any car in this market.

try and think next time before typing and slandering a different brand ... idiots

BMW4me4ever & 1995e34

Ditto

"The M3 may be a sports car but the IS-F is a luxury sports car. With the IS-F you get to have your cake and eat it too."

Are you trying to tell me that the M3 isn't luxurious?

The interior is made of all of the highest-quality materials, but like BMW4me4ever said, it's not designed for its appearance... it's designed for durability, function and the best driving position.

"Based on JD Power's IQS and VDS studies. Considering Lexus' continuous commitment to quality and reliability, I wouldn't believe in anything less for the IS-F."

The BMW 5 Series is more reliable than the Lexus GS, so you can never rest on your laurels and be sure.

Either way, BMW does give you free maintenance, which BMW4me4ever also mentioned.

But why do you think M3 buyers are so loyal? They wouldn't keep going back for a truly unreliable car.

"That's funny I could sworn I read Car & Driver only getting 4.3 seconds going 0-60 mph for the M3 versus 4.2 seconds going 0-60 mph for the IS-F:"

Nice job, you have links.

However, that 4.2 sec time is the quickest currently recorded for the IS-F, but the 4.3 is not for the M3. It may not have been C/D, but the M3 has gotten 4.1 in at least one magazine, and the M-DKG will make it even quicker.

"The IS-F is capable of doing over 185 mph without the electronic governor"

You did a good job "forgetting" that the BMW M3 also has a top speed... and I can't find an article showing the unlimited M3's top speed.

"By your flawed logic then, a Porsche with Tiptronic isn't a "true sports car"?"

In fact, yes. Porschephiles look upon people who drive Tiptronic Porsches as posers.

However, the 997 is also offered with a manual, and its Tiptronic is soon to be replaced by DSG. The IS-F only has an automatic. That's the difference.

-------

Screw the RS4. I'm leaning back towards BMW, with the exception of the new RS6. Now it's RS6, M3, M5, in that order.

"Midsize Premium Car
Highest Ranked: Lexus GS 300/GS 430
Acura RL
Lexus ES 330

http://blogs.motortrend.com/6214130/car-news/buick-ties-lexus-in-jd-power-dependability-study/index.html"

MINE was from CR. The Audi A6 and BMW 5 Series were both recommended, while the Lexus GS was not.

"The real question is how much for maintenance once the free maintenance is over? I'm betting my house that it'll be a lot more than Lexus."

Like I said, the duration of the ownership is spent with a warranty. The people buying M3s and IS-Fs don't keep them very long--only until a newer, better, freshened version comes out. That is commonly seen in luxury car buyers in general. It's why leasing makes so much sense for some people, in addition to them not being able to afford to buy...

"Because they like the blue and white roundel??? The very same reason why people keep going back to GM despite most GM vehicles being POS. Blind allegiance to what they believe in."

Look, I know you're stubborn, but I had some hope that you were a pretty smart Lexus fan. Angry, yes, but idiotic? No.

Now, I'm not so sure. Do you truly think that? Did you have a bad experience with a BMW or something? Anyone in their right mind knows that the M3 is an incredible car, one that's worth going back to again, and again, and again. It has nothing to do with the badge on its hood, but the moving parts that represent that badge. BMW stands for performance for a REASON.

"Spare me your lame excuses. The bottome line is the same publisher tested both cars and concluded that the IS-F is faster than the M3."

Lame excuses?

Okay, well, let's assume the manual M3 and automatic IS-F are neck-and-neck in terms of acceleration. 0.1 sec in either direction makes no discernable difference.

And think about the Audi A3. Do you know why the 2.0T is just about as quick as the 3.2? DSG. It makes a very significant difference. We know the M3 is getting it very soon. It would only be fair to compare the automated transmissions of the M3 and IS-F, so M-DKG must be used here. M-DKG (DSG) is always quicker than its manual equivalent, and with seven forward gears instead of six, it has an even bigger advantage.

This all points to one logical conclusion--the M3 will be quicker than the IS-F, and just about as quick as the blistering 3.9 sec Mercedes-Benz C63 AMG.

"Maybe you should go tell Porsche headquarters that."

Porsche is very aware. However, there is a market for the "posers" I mentioned. Half the mid-life crisis guys who buy the 911 opt for the Tiptronic, because they simply can't live with a manual. Porsche is in it for the money, not just the product, like any company... although they focus more on the machines than most.

"The real difference is that the IS-F has the best of both worlds: manual paddle shifting for aggressive driving and full auto for rush hour driving. You can't do that in a car with manual transmission."

Pfft. That feature is on the new Hyundai

That feature is on the new Hyundai Veracruz. However, M-DKG sets itself apart with custom, driver-selectable shift modes; an M/Sport mode, the quickness of the transmission itself AND manual (Steptronic) control.

the 4.1 second 0-60 time for the M3 was Road and Track, not Car and Driver. Car and Driver is the ONLY magazine that got the IS-F to be quicker than the M3, and it was by 0.1 seconds. Every other test the M3 has been quicker by 0.1-0.5 seconds. And the DCT will shave 0.2 seconds off the M's times, widening the gap.

Oh, and Road and Track also got 0.91g's on the skidpad with the IS-F... and 0.98g's with the M3. The lowest test result for the M3 has been 0.94g's, which is better than the highest result for the IS-F.

The IS-F is a sporty luxury car. The M3 is a luxurious sports car. Pick your poison.

You're kidding.

Now you're just wasting time, trying to avoid admitting that YOU'RE WRONG.

It's OBVIOUS. There is no proof necessary.

A 3year old well I'm still more mature than you,and my auto knowledge spans 23 years in the business.Any time you want to debate me just bring it on.

how would you know?

BMW's look more and more like japanise cars,because that's who's spanking them every year.

" japanise cars"- nice work there autoho - 23 years in 'the business'...hmmm...Toyo/Lexus nut and you don't even know how to spell "Japanese"....


Where is your adult supervision?

M3

ISF

1. the m3 costs more when you add basic options
2. the interior on the m3 is lame
3. i dont like driving manual in traffic
4. id prefer the "underdog"
5. lexus nav is much nicer
6. reliability
7. has more potential for mods
8. less expensive after warranty expires
9. resale value

posted in wrong spot before

Stash .. what are you talking about? I think I need what you are smoking, cause you obviously have done no research on the cars.

1 . $ 64,350 is the cost of the M3 sedan with Navigation, upgrade leather, 19" wheels, upgrade sound, M drive, technology package, premium package & sunroof ... $ 60,855 is the price of the Lexus IS-F with the options .. BMW is $ 3,495 more than the Lexus ( except BMW pays for the maint for 4 years or 50,000 miles ). On a performance car like this, makes the 2 cars a wash.

2. not even going to watse the time on this one.

3. dont like driving manual in traffic - psst then get an everyday car. This is a race car which is street legal. Hence the word " race ". all true race inspired cars are manual transmissions by default.

4. prefer the underdog - lol ...

5. reliable - how so? has the new engine been tested over customers beating on it? The M3 has been proven to be one of the most reliable cars in history of performance cars ever.

6. more potential for mods - yeah already looks the part of a 16 year old who slapped on body flare and exhaust tips. Is that what you mean for mods? psst .. this is a race car for the street. not a street car to race, big difference ... This is your basis of arguement for a Lexus IS-F ...lol

Resale value & lexx expesive after warranty runs out ? ??? how so? have you ever owned a performance lexus before, oh wait sorry they have Never built one. lmao

lexus admirer .. the problem with your arguements is that you base everything on 1 article. In 6 other tests, the IS-F was a lot slower and didnt handle as well. Also, the IS-F was not designed to be a luxury sports car. Kind of an oxymoron wouldnt you think. It was designed to compete with the M3, RS4, C63 in the sports car segment. driving, feel, response, braking, cornering is all that matters. Plushness of leather, nice cup holders, navigation system is an after thought. This is sports car territory. Right now the IS-F is a good first shot, but that is all it is.

Excuse me, Lexus_Admirer, but he posted SIX ACCELERATION TESTS. If you can't accept that those are nearly ALL of the tests in which the IS-F was timed, then you have no common sense.

Lexus Admirer, all those test results you're in love with from one source happen to be the best results the IS-F has gotten in any test. Let's see how they stack up:

0-60. M3 was 4.3 in that C&D test, 4.1 in Road and Track, and averages 4.2 everywhere else. The IS-F got 4.2 in C&D, but has been clocked as slow as 4.8 seconds (Edmunds, who wondered why you'd get the car over a 335i) with an average of 4.5 seconds.

handling. best result for the IS-F, 0.92g's, also by C&D. Best result by the M3, 0.98g's, R&T. Worst result by the M3, 0.94g's, higher than the IS's best.

Since both cars have governors I'm not sure why you're even bringing up top speed.

And since you love quoting that C&D article, understandable since the results are the best the IS-F has garnered anywhere, you are leaving out an important quote from that same article:

"The IS F is a somewhat reserved and immaculately built Lexus, but it isn’t an M3..."

lexus admirer ... you are so dilusional it isnt funny anymore.

The M3 has been tested 4x. 4.1 by road & track, 4.3 by car & driver, 4.5 seconds by edmunds .com & 4.4 seconds by Motor Trenmagazine .... 17.3 / 4 = 4.325 as an average

Lexus IS-F - 4.6 by Road & track, 4.2 by Car & driver, 4.4 by edmunds, 4.8 by Motortrend .... 18 / 4 = 4.5 seconds ... 4 articles looking at both cars on an individual basis. Even a child can see the M3 is quicker. This is without the quicker DKG that is due to arrive ...

face it the lexus IS-F is going to be a hard sell.

lexus admirer ... you are so dilusional it isnt funny anymore.

The M3 has been tested 4x. 4.1 by road & track, 4.3 by car & driver, 4.5 seconds by edmunds .com & 4.4 seconds by Motor Trenmagazine .... 17.3 / 4 = 4.325 as an average

Lexus IS-F - 4.6 by Road & track, 4.2 by Car & driver, 4.4 by edmunds, 4.8 by Motortrend .... 18 / 4 = 4.5 seconds ... 4 articles looking at both cars on an individual basis. Even a child can see the M3 is quicker. This is without the quicker DKG that is due to arrive ...

face it the lexus IS-F is going to be a hard sell.

hahaha. instead of coming up with a point list like mine to indicate the advantages of M3 over IS-F, u haters only know how to deboost.
No prob do as much as can. Who cares.
but it proves that IS-F is better than the M3 sedan in so many areas(nearly in all) compare to one or two in which M3 sedan is superior.

Overall Superior IS-F for me.

JUGNU

Here you have them:

BMW is faster, handles better, looks a million times better, resale price is going to be much better than any Lexus like usual and like any M3 is certainly going to be more reliable than the new comer IS-F. The tests already indicated clearly that the IS-F has big reliability problems under hard driving conditions. Lexus needs to understand that in order to compete with the big boys they need to build cars that can be driven hard without issues. I would stick to making cars with self-parking feature instead of stepping in an unknown territory(for a modest car brand like Lexus). Hopefully they will be able to recover from the embarrassment this car(the IS-F)is going to bring to them.

Jugnu, your list was POINTLESS.

BMW4ever "owned" you.

Case closed, go back to your finger painting.

Jugnu, there is no point in replying to you. For you to say that the IS-F looks better than the M3 indicates that you are retarded. The IS-F doesn't look better than ANYTHING.

Barbara Bush is prettier than the IS-F.

My friend who bought an E46 M3 told me this one time:

"M3=more girls"

So why not?

IS-F? Maybe more ricers in your rear view mirror? Who cares.

M3 sedan because:

-It probably handles better.
-I think it looks better.
-I love high revving engines, especially after owning an M5.
-Since they are both sedans, the M3 sedan has more rear leg room. The IS-F is TINY in the back.
-It will probably also be faster with the M-DKG.

neither!!!

This is a question posed to get a heated answer. Here is the deal. Across different class lines, socio-economic groups, people want an M3 even if they can't afford it. Which makes it an aspirational purchase. People will wait with baited breath for a new M3, worldwide. That is fact. This is the 4th generation M3. And the 1st generation Toyota/Lexus IS-F. They even chose a single letter for the new performance division. That is hilarious! Toyota wants to compete with the known benchmark. And to do that you have to do the engine work yourself, not Yamaha. Even though they are very good at what they do. The Toyota is a nice attempt, but it is not a real car but it costs real money. Lexus is not a real car company with no heritage, history. What are they going to use as a template, a Camry?

The M3 is made by people that stay up late at night working on a car that they are very proud to say they worked on. BMW AG has a permanent building at The Ring. Toyota does testing there and then goes back to Japan. You get what you pay for.

I am a car enthusiast so the only choice for me between the two is the M3. Lexus is yet to make a car that doesn't scream cheap built quality, poor performance and boring driving experience.

That's no problem Lexus will just sell their 5200 units to people with more grey matter than star gazer.

..you mean gray hair. LOL...

M3

STAR as long as they sell,and lexus out sells BMW every year,and the parent company outsells tiny BMW by 9 million cars a year worldwide.When are you going to get it?

Lexus doesn't outsell BMW in ANY year. BMW is the world's largest luxury brand.

JRob, let the lexus fanboys continue to believe that the world's automarket consists of only the US.

If I had to choose, the M3 Sedan. Both of these cars are awesome and I would love to have both.

@Star

What are you smoking have you ever compared the interior of the M3 to that of the IS-F. The M3 looks like it came from IKEA and you call the IS-F cheap.

How can you haters be so blind. And wha kind of reliability problems does the IS-F have? Last time i checked lexus came in higher than BMW in every reliability survey for the last 15 years.

Are you for real? The interior of the IS-F looks like is made from recycled soda cans while the BMW's looks like one of the finest, classiest interiors ever seen in sport sedan.

Reliability?...Not this Lexus. The IS-F tends to overheat the brakes, up to the point where they are actually on fire...LOL

Please get your fact straight before posting your article. The Lexus IS-F has been tested by Car and Driver belief, run the 0-60 in 4.2s.

and the BMW run 0 to 60 in 4.1s. Your point?

BMW run in 0-60 4.1s? where is your proof or reference I would like to see? The article posting where the Lexus IS-F did 0-60 in 4.2s is posted on this website. It also have the M3 time as well, it like 4.5s.

@Star

The only place where the M3 does 4.1 is in your dreams.

star,

I know it kind of like how the BMW 3 Series got Overheat when it was compare to the Infiniti G37 on the fourth laps or so. What a piece of crap, and how it borrow it taillights design from Hyundai.

Well, the 3 series is not a built for track car so they have an excuse. On the other hand Lexus claims that the IS-F is ready to take on an M3 and the car literally gets on fire when it runs on a track? LOL... What's that ball of fire?...Oh, is the latest Lexus creation..Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, LOL...

Lexus ...

Did you lexus goofs not get enough or do we need to continue this? Car & driver tested a new M3 at 4.1 seconds so did Road & track. Also, the IS-F has been shown to be tested 4.6 to 4.7 at the highest point ...

IS-F .. 4.6 seconds
http://cars.about.com/od/lexus/fr/08_lexus_isf.htm

http://magazine.windingroad.com/windingroad/200712web/?folio=74

IS-F ... 4.7 seconds motor trend.com

http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/sedans/112_0712_2008_lexus_is_f/

IS-F ... 4.8 seconds ... edmunds.com

http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/Drives/FullTests/articleId=123125

IS-F ... 4.4 seconds ... motortrend .com

http://www.roadandtrack.com/article.asp?section_id=3&article_id=6177

IS-F ... 4.6 seconds ... automobile magazine

http://www.automobilemag.com/reviews/lexus/0710_2008_lexus_is-f/index.html

What I want to know is how many of you idiots here does 0-60 races? How many of you guys think that it really matters that a difference of .1-.5 seconds for 0-60 really matters in real life?

all you idiots are so afixiated on numbers that you guys do not know what these cars are truly capable of, let alone what the point of these cars are...

Get a life people... (especially those of you who answered "yes" to "doing 0-60 races")

Star,

remember when the new BMW 3 Series got Overheated on the fourth laps on the track when it was being compare to the Infiniti G37?

And secondly the Lexus IS-F beat the BMW on all performance level. From 0-60, quarter mile run, and the skid as well.

No wonder everyone hate BMW driver because of people like you. At least Audi owner understand and appreciate the beauty and engineering of a Lexus car.

And don't star, Lexus, Audi, or MB, one of them will take the crown away from BMW sooner or later.

lexus ... who are you crapping? has there been a head to head comparison test between the M3 or the IS-F? NO. IF you read the articles I just posted in regards to the 0 to 60 times, they say that lexus has a competitor to the M3, just not quite there yet. Face it, the M3 is the benchmark. I know, I know you are in denial, but some day you will open your eyes.

Lexus ...

That is the only article that the IS-f has been under 4.4 seconds ... If you average all the times, then you will see the average is 4.55 seconds to 60 mph ... The IS-F is not quite in the same class as the M3, but it is a good try for the first time out. You should be happy as a Lexus customer

ONE.

http://www.s2ki.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=558164

But we're not talking about the M3. We're talking about how you're being absolutely irrational regarding the IS-F.

And, to my delight, DIRECTLY under the M3's 4.1 sec time in that link is the IS-F's time from the same magazine (Road & Track). Please see.

"So let me get this straight, the M3 has been tested by one article and got 4.1 seconds going from 0-60 mph and everyone is praising the M3. But when the IS-F gets tested by one article and gets 4.2 seconds, all of a sudden everyone quotes the slower times for the IS-F??? Can you say "double standard"?????"

WTF? No. I guess you really are an idiot. I'm sorry I ever thought otherwise.

You were trying to prove that the IS-F was faster due to ONE test in which it beat the M3 by 0.1 seconds (C/D). I simply posted another test proving that the M3 was quicker. The Lexus IS-F has never achieved a 4.1 sec 0-60 time, and from the magazine that got the 4.1 out of the M3, the IS-F got 4.4.

star,

is you using another username as idrive?

Lexus ... Automobile magazines review of the Lexus IS-F said this

"But is that enough to turn the IS-F into the kind of icon that the M3 has become? We don't think so. The small sport sedan category is less about track prowess than it is street cred. The M3 has that in spades. Like the C63 and the RS4, it shares precious little of its driveline, suspension, and chassis with the more pedestrian car that it's based on. And, unlike the IS-F's relatively prosaic engine, which seems to have gained nothing from Toyota's involvement in Formula 1 racing, the M3's 8400-rpm V-8 starts its life in the same factory that builds BMW's F1 engines.



The IS-F simply cannot compete with that kind of lineage, no matter how charming it might be that it's the product of an underground skunk works team. Yaguchi's team has fulfilled its mission-the IS-F is so good on the track that you'll still be smiling even when the brakes are on fire."

Car & Driver recent test of IS-F
"The roll call of thundering V-8 sedans is getting long, and comparisons with the M3, AMG C63, and Audi RS 4 are inevitable. Has Lexus once again snookered the Germans on quality and sticker price as it did in 1989? The direct head butts will come here soon. Meanwhile, we’ll go on the record this far: The IS F is a somewhat reserved and immaculately built Lexus, but it isn’t an M3 (and it isn’t boring, either)."

I'd go with the M3 because the IS-F is just FUGLY.
(M3 sedan ain't great but better)

M3... in any color. It looks fantastic in every color they offer.

I like the white it comes in.

I am not a BMW fan, don't like their 5 series, 6 sereis, or the 7 sereis. But when it comes to M3, it is an altogether different ballgame. Because ever since i have been a young guy, the M3 has been the coolest car around. I like Lexus a lot, and prefer the regualr IS to the regular 3 seires sedan (other than the turbo charged versions), but for M3, i am a devout fan and frankly to be able to buy a M3 for 54 grand (even though the price is higher than before) will be a dream come true. ISF is good for it's target buyers, but for me the M3 is what i love.

I am not a BMW fan, don't like their 5 series, 6 sereis, or the 7 sereis. But when it comes to M3, it is an altogether different ballgame. Because ever since i have been a young guy, the M3 has been the coolest car around. I like Lexus a lot, and prefer the regualr IS to the regular 3 seires sedan (other than the turbo charged versions), but for M3, i am a devout fan and frankly to be able to buy a M3 for 54 grand (even though the price is higher than before) will be a dream come true. ISF is good for it's target buyers, but for me the M3 is what i love.

I am not a BMW fan, don't like their 5 series, 6 sereis, or the 7 sereis. But when it comes to M3, it is an altogether different ballgame. Because ever since i have been a young guy, the M3 has been the coolest car around. I like Lexus a lot, and prefer the regualr IS to the regular 3 seires sedan (other than the turbo charged versions), but for M3, i am a devout fan and frankly to be able to buy a M3 for 54 grand (even though the price is higher than before) will be a dream come true. ISF is good for it's target buyers, but for me the M3 is what i love.

I am not a BMW fan, don't like their 5 series, 6 sereis, or the 7 sereis. But when it comes to M3, it is an altogether different ballgame. Because ever since i have been a young guy, the M3 has been the coolest car around. I like Lexus a lot, and prefer the regualr IS to the regular 3 seires sedan (other than the turbo charged versions), but for M3, i am a devout fan and frankly to be able to buy a M3 for 54 grand (even though the price is higher than before) will be a dream come true. ISF is good for it's target buyers, but for me the M3 is what i love.

I am not a BMW fan, don't like their 5 series, 6 sereis, or the 7 sereis. But when it comes to M3, it is an altogether different ballgame. Because ever since i have been a young guy, the M3 has been the coolest car around. I like Lexus a lot, and prefer the regualr IS to the regular 3 seires sedan (other than the turbo charged versions), but for M3, i am a devout fan and frankly to be able to buy a M3 for 54 grand (even though the price is higher than before) will be a dream come true. ISF is good for it's target buyers, but for me the M3 is what i love.

I am not a BMW fan, don't like their 5 series, 6 sereis, or the 7 sereis. But when it comes to M3, it is an altogether different ballgame. Because ever since i have been a young guy, the M3 has been the coolest car around. I like Lexus a lot, and prefer the regualr IS to the regular 3 seires sedan (other than the turbo charged versions), but for M3, i am a devout fan and frankly to be able to buy a M3 for 54 grand (even though the price is higher than before) will be a dream come true. ISF is good for it's target buyers, but for me the M3 is what i love.

I am not a BMW fan, don't like their 5 series, 6 sereis, or the 7 sereis. But when it comes to M3, it is an altogether different ballgame. Because ever since i have been a young guy, the M3 has been the coolest car around. I like Lexus a lot, and prefer the regualr IS to the regular 3 seires sedan (other than the turbo charged versions), but for M3, i am a devout fan and frankly to be able to buy a M3 for 54 grand (even though the price is higher than before) will be a dream come true. ISF is good for it's target buyers, but for me the M3 is what i love.

I am not a BMW fan, don't like their 5 series, 6 sereis, or the 7 sereis. But when it comes to M3, it is an altogether different ballgame. Because ever since i have been a young guy, the M3 has been the coolest car around. I like Lexus a lot, and prefer the regualr IS to the regular 3 seires sedan (other than the turbo charged versions), but for M3, i am a devout fan and frankly to be able to buy a M3 for 54 grand (even though the price is higher than before) will be a dream come true. ISF is good for it's target buyers, but for me the M3 is what i love.

I am not a BMW fan, don't like their 5 series, 6 sereis, or the 7 sereis. But when it comes to M3, it is an altogether different ballgame. Because ever since i have been a young guy, the M3 has been the coolest car around. I like Lexus a lot, and prefer the regualr IS to the regular 3 seires sedan (other than the turbo charged versions), but for M3, i am a devout fan and frankly to be able to buy a M3 for 54 grand (even though the price is higher than before) will be a dream come true. ISF is good for it's target buyers, but for me the M3 is what i love.

I am not a BMW fan, don't like their 5 series, 6 sereis, or the 7 sereis. But when it comes to M3, it is an altogether different ballgame. Because ever since i have been a young guy, the M3 has been the coolest car around. I like Lexus a lot, and prefer the regualr IS to the regular 3 seires sedan (other than the turbo charged versions), but for M3, i am a devout fan and frankly to be able to buy a M3 for 54 grand (even though the price is higher than before) will be a dream come true. ISF is good for it's target buyers, but for me the M3 is what i love.

I am not a BMW fan, don't like their 5 series, 6 sereis, or the 7 sereis. But when it comes to M3, it is an altogether different ballgame. Because ever since i have been a young guy, the M3 has been the coolest car around. I like Lexus a lot, and prefer the regualr IS to the regular 3 seires sedan (other than the turbo charged versions), but for M3, i am a devout fan and frankly to be able to buy a M3 for 54 grand (even though the price is higher than before) will be a dream come true. ISF is good for it's target buyers, but for me the M3 is what i love.

I am not a BMW fan, don't like their 5 series, 6 sereis, or the 7 sereis. But when it comes to M3, it is an altogether different ballgame. Because ever since i have been a young guy, the M3 has been the coolest car around. I like Lexus a lot, and prefer the regualr IS to the regular 3 seires sedan (other than the turbo charged versions), but for M3, i am a devout fan and frankly to be able to buy a M3 for 54 grand (even though the price is higher than before) will be a dream come true. ISF is good for it's target buyers, but for me the M3 is what i love.

I am not a BMW fan, don't like their 5 series, 6 sereis, or the 7 sereis. But when it comes to M3, it is an altogether different ballgame. Because ever since i have been a young guy, the M3 has been the coolest car around. I like Lexus a lot, and prefer the regualr IS to the regular 3 seires sedan (other than the turbo charged versions), but for M3, i am a devout fan and frankly to be able to buy a M3 for 54 grand (even though the price is higher than before) will be a dream come true. ISF is good for it's target buyers, but for me the M3 is what i love.

I am not a BMW fan, don't like their 5 series, 6 sereis, or the 7 sereis. But when it comes to M3, it is an altogether different ballgame. Because ever since i have been a young guy, the M3 has been the coolest car around. I like Lexus a lot, and prefer the regualr IS to the regular 3 seires sedan (other than the turbo charged versions), but for M3, i am a devout fan and frankly to be able to buy a M3 for 54 grand (even though the price is higher than before) will be a dream come true. ISF is good for it's target buyers, but for me the M3 is what i love.

I am not a BMW fan, don't like their 5 series, 6 sereis, or the 7 sereis. But when it comes to M3, it is an altogether different ballgame. Because ever since i have been a young guy, the M3 has been the coolest car around. I like Lexus a lot, and prefer the regualr IS to the regular 3 seires sedan (other than the turbo charged versions), but for M3, i am a devout fan and frankly to be able to buy a M3 for 54 grand (even though the price is higher than before) will be a dream come true. ISF is good for it's target buyers, but for me the M3 is what i love.

I am not a BMW fan, don't like their 5 series, 6 sereis, or the 7 sereis. But when it comes to M3, it is an altogether different ballgame. Because ever since i have been a young guy, the M3 has been the coolest car around. I like Lexus a lot, and prefer the regualr IS to the regular 3 seires sedan (other than the turbo charged versions), but for M3, i am a devout fan and frankly to be able to buy a M3 for 54 grand (even though the price is higher than before) will be a dream come true. ISF is good for it's target buyers, but for me the M3 is what i love.

I am not a BMW fan, don't like their 5 series, 6 sereis, or the 7 sereis. But when it comes to M3, it is an altogether different ballgame. Because ever since i have been a young guy, the M3 has been the coolest car around. I like Lexus a lot, and prefer the regualr IS to the regular 3 seires sedan (other than the turbo charged versions), but for M3, i am a devout fan and frankly to be able to buy a M3 for 54 grand (even though the price is higher than before) will be a dream come true. ISF is good for it's target buyers, but for me the M3 is what i love.

I am not a BMW fan, don't like their 5 series, 6 sereis, or the 7 sereis. But when it comes to M3, it is an altogether different ballgame. Because ever since i have been a young guy, the M3 has been the coolest car around. I like Lexus a lot, and prefer the regualr IS to the regular 3 seires sedan (other than the turbo charged versions), but for M3, i am a devout fan and frankly to be able to buy a M3 for 54 grand (even though the price is higher than before) will be a dream come true. ISF is good for it's target buyers, but for me the M3 is what i love.

I am not a BMW fan, don't like their 5 series, 6 sereis, or the 7 sereis. But when it comes to M3, it is an altogether different ballgame. Because ever since i have been a young guy, the M3 has been the coolest car around. I like Lexus a lot, and prefer the regualr IS to the regular 3 seires sedan (other than the turbo charged versions), but for M3, i am a devout fan and frankly to be able to buy a M3 for 54 grand (even though the price is higher than before) will be a dream come true. ISF is good for it's target buyers, but for me the M3 is what i love.

I am not a BMW fan, don't like their 5 series, 6 sereis, or the 7 sereis. But when it comes to M3, it is an altogether different ballgame. Because ever since i have been a young guy, the M3 has been the coolest car around. I like Lexus a lot, and prefer the regualr IS to the regular 3 seires sedan (other than the turbo charged versions), but for M3, i am a devout fan and frankly to be able to buy a M3 for 54 grand (even though the price is higher than before) will be a dream come true. ISF is good for it's target buyers, but for me the M3 is what i love.

I am not a BMW fan, don't like their 5 series, 6 sereis, or the 7 sereis. But when it comes to M3, it is an altogether different ballgame. Because ever since i have been a young guy, the M3 has been the coolest car around. I like Lexus a lot, and prefer the regualr IS to the regular 3 seires sedan (other than the turbo charged versions), but for M3, i am a devout fan and frankly to be able to buy a M3 for 54 grand (even though the price is higher than before) will be a dream come true. ISF is good for it's target buyers, but for me the M3 is what i love.

I am not a BMW fan, don't like their 5 series, 6 sereis, or the 7 sereis. But when it comes to M3, it is an altogether different ballgame. Because ever since i have been a young guy, the M3 has been the coolest car around. I like Lexus a lot, and prefer the regualr IS to the regular 3 seires sedan (other than the turbo charged versions), but for M3, i am a devout fan and frankly to be able to buy a M3 for 54 grand (even though the price is higher than before) will be a dream come true. ISF is good for it's target buyers, but for me the M3 is what i love.

I am not a BMW fan, don't like their 5 series, 6 sereis, or the 7 sereis. But when it comes to M3, it is an altogether different ballgame. Because ever since i have been a young guy, the M3 has been the coolest car around. I like Lexus a lot, and prefer the regualr IS to the regular 3 seires sedan (other than the turbo charged versions), but for M3, i am a devout fan and frankly to be able to buy a M3 for 54 grand (even though the price is higher than before) will be a dream come true. ISF is good for it's target buyers, but for me the M3 is what i love.

I am not a BMW fan, don't like their 5 series, 6 sereis, or the 7 sereis. But when it comes to M3, it is an altogether different ballgame. Because ever since i have been a young guy, the M3 has been the coolest car around. I like Lexus a lot, and prefer the regualr IS to the regular 3 seires sedan (other than the turbo charged versions), but for M3, i am a devout fan and frankly to be able to buy a M3 for 54 grand (even though the price is higher than before) will be a dream come true. ISF is good for it's target buyers, but for me the M3 is what i love.

I am not a BMW fan, don't like their 5 series, 6 sereis, or the 7 sereis. But when it comes to M3, it is an altogether different ballgame. Because ever since i have been a young guy, the M3 has been the coolest car around. I like Lexus a lot, and prefer the regualr IS to the regular 3 seires sedan (other than the turbo charged versions), but for M3, i am a devout fan and frankly to be able to buy a M3 for 54 grand (even though the price is higher than before) will be a dream come true. ISF is good for it's target buyers, but for me the M3 is what i love.

^^^WHOLLY SHIET!!! You seem to be VERY Excited!

I would imagine you'd have to be pretty involved with the gay porn community to hear information like that.

Who told you that your fudge packing buddy?

not trying bash the lexus, but pretty much the only time these cars will see the track is when the car magazines review them. i hope they prove me wrong, but i gotta see it.

Isn't that really the only time just about every make and model of car sees the track?

answer: just about every road course has track days reserved by bmwcca chapters.

But what percentage of BMW owners actually take their cars to the track?

M3 for me!!!!

Give a Boost!!!!

I feel like a broken record here, but why all the fuss over two cars that 99.9999% of autospies.com posters will never even drive let alone purchase?

Like what you like. Buy what you like.

Both of these cars kick ass. If you deny the greatness of either one I hope it is your ass that gets kicked.

farabira, I don't think you posted that enough.

LOL.

^answer, I agree. I PERSONALLY prefer the M3, but that doesn't mean I'm dissing the IS-F.

LexusAdmirer keeps leaving this quote out when he quotes that article:

"The IS F is a somewhat reserved and immaculately built Lexus, but it isn’t an M3..."

What I want to know is how many of you idiots here does 0-60 races? How many of you guys think that it really matters that a difference of .1-.5 seconds for 0-60 really matters in real life?

all you idiots are so afixiated on numbers that you guys do not know what these cars are truly capable of, let alone what the point of these cars are...

Get a life people... (especially those of you who answered "yes" to "doing 0-60 races")

"And the M3 isn't a Lexus, so what's your point???"

THE POINT IS, THE M3 IS THE BENCHMARK OF THIS CLASS. Lexus was NOT trying to make another "true Lexus" with the IS-F. They were trying to make an M3! AND THEY DIDN'T SUCCEED!

Tell me that after your M3 needs a new motor,and its in the shop for weeks with no loaner car.

For Land Rover,
Whenever I take my Sport in for service, I get to choose from Sport, LR3, or LR2.
And the best thing about them is that they were all awesome off-roaders.
Yes, I took them all for a rough ride.

The engine in the M3 will last easily 3 times more than the engine in a Lexus IS-F. Lexus is the one known for early engine and transmission failures, not BMW. I would worry especially when we are talking about a performance car. The M3 is obviously bullet proof but the poorly built IS-F is a different story...I can already picture the IS-Fs carried on flat beds due to premature transmission and engine failures. Lexus was never intended to be driven...

M3 all the way, I'd buy a mini before a is-crap

I would buy the BMW M3 because I don't play with Toys.

;-)

A toy is fun and cute the is- crap is ugly and boring.

I'm sure if you told the Lexus dealer that you were going to buy the M3 over the IS-f, they'd drop the price down that extra $1,425. I think I would go for the IS-F. That's because they'll be more rare. Plus, Yamaha developed the engine with Lexus and Yamaha has one of the best performance engines out there. It would be a tough choice, though.

I think I would go for the M3. That's because it looks better. Plus, BMW developed the engine with BMW and BMW has one of the best performance engines out there. It would be a tough choice, though.

LOL, sorry, I had to.

It's so easy to manipulate. In fact, the two are so close in everything that they're practically interchangeable. It really comes down to what you think of the looks, and the seat-of-the-pants feeling you get when you drive it.

Actually, I figured that I like the M3 Coupe better than the sedan. So if I had to choose between the M3 Sedan and the IS-F, then I would pick the IS-F. The tough choice, for me, would be between the M3 Coupe and the IS-F.

This thread was clearly created to start a small war.

But, to answer the OQ, if I were looking for a small performance sedan, I'd want the best one for the money. That would leave none other than the M3 sedan.

If I didn't LIKE to drive, straightline speed was my only concern, and I wanted to brag about having a ridiculous number of gear ratios....well, I'd have a tough time deciding between the is and c63..lol.

"Most ultimate drivers wouldn't even be able to tell an M3 from a 323i except for the exhaust and gills, assuming they notice anything other than the propellor (the front intakes have nearly the same pattern as the normal 3)."

Who cares? All the better to sneak up on someone with.

However, I think you're wrong on that point. The M3 is iconic. Most everyone knows what it is.

"Well, if you can't afford an IS-F (roll eyes). How's that taste?"

If you're going to play that game, then put options on both and watch the M3 pass the IS-F in price in about five seconds.

Now I feel like I got ripped off, because I paid $65K for a mere S4...

No, not really. The CLS also has four seats, and it hasn't been much of a problem. Those cars are about style.

Definetely the M3 sedan. You can never go wrong with the legend. Plus if I was to look for a competitor of the M3 it would not be the IS-F, lol

Oh, and huu, you have to be one of the biggest idiots on this site. Thank you for your shortsighted insights applied to some of the greatest car the world has ever seen.

By now some of you know i like Toy/Lex & BM's, but I have something for 4 doors and a stick, so it'll have to be the M3. To look different, ofcourse the IS-F. Then again, I already have a manual car without any driving aids(TCS/VSC), even though the power is going to the wrong wheels(stickshiftV6camry!!). Guess i'll have to go with the IS-F.

At this point in time, there's no competition. The M3 is an outstanding vehicle. The IS-F, while most people, including myself, haven't driven it, is Lexus' first attempt in this realm. The M3 is a masterpiece of BMW engineering in all categories. The fact that it's cheaper not only highlights Lexus' moronic pricing, but makes it a no-brainer for even Lexus lovers. Just because the IS-F has the same 0-60 and 2 more HP (because of an entire extra litre in the engine) doesn't make it an equal playing field.

I

would

pick

the

BMW

lexus is tries too hard. But the GS is hot!!!!!!!!

Wow..that was alot of "discussing" up there..

Im too tired to argue specifics but :

I dont necessarily love the isf's styling. i wish it would have looked more like the 350..but i do like its "muscular look"..i didnt like it in blue but in red, black, or granite, its looks nice and i like it better than the m3. I dont see the big deal about the exhaust tips not being connected to the pipe. it may not have a function but it has the SAME function as the chrome tips on almost every car. I prefer the interior of any lexus over any bmw and i agree with whoever thinks that a bmw is more of a sports car. thats the major difference between these two. they are very close in performance numbers..its more about preference than anything. Lexus has a little more "luxury" and bmw has a little more "sport", in my opinion. I do believe that the reliability will be higher for the isf but only time will tell, it IS their first real sports sedan. As for modifications, I believe the 5.0 liter could handle more than the high revving 4.0 L bmw engine, and i do plan to add some power, if possible. As for the manual transmission, i wouldnt buy one unless it were like a porsche or an awd car. too much traffic here..and obviously, that wouldnt make a difference since bmw offers a great automatic also. finally, i definitely give bmw credit for making great cars like the *m5*, m3 and 335i but they just dont appeal to me..and fools like rosco is why im really arguing anyways..i really enjoy reading everyones opinion and learning different things..im just going to have to ignore his comments from now on..

A Choice between a Toyota and a BMW? BMW wins everytime IMO.

I misunderstood your post. Sorry.

VW? If we were talking about Audi then you may have a case, but BMW doesn't have anything to do with VW. LOL! Nice try. Just becuase both are made in the same country doesn't make them the same brand. You guys are funny.

I misunderstood your post. Sorry.

Toyota should be compared against VW, not BMW.

BMW fan boys need to bow down to Lexus.If their was no Lexus,BMW would still be ripping you off and the M3 would be 80k.The only reason BMW has lowered their prices the last few years,because direct pressuer from Lexus.

BMW has a LOWER Base Price, but they LOVE to give people a book of options !! By the time you load it up, I'm sure it is going to be alot more than the Lexus !!

I'll take the Lexus anytime !!

I am sorry guys, i did not know that my blog was posted so many times, my computer was not loading when i pressed "submit comment" and so i kept on pressing the function and i guess that is why i ended up with so many posts. Frankly really sorry, yeah i desrved all the deboosting. But i'll say it again definitely the M3 sedan.

BMW Hands down. Would not think twice

one thing that bothers me is that the 5.0 engine only produces 2 more horsepower than the 4.0 motor.
they could have saved the buyers 15k by dropping in a supercharged ohv domestic crate motor.
Har! Har! Har!

oh goodness. 235th comment!



I'd like the m3 since its bad ass in a coupe, w/ stick, and its pearly white paint I saw @ the auto show.

oh goodness. 235th comment!



I'd like the m3 since its bad ass in a coupe, w/ stick, and its pearly white paint I saw @ the auto show.

oh goodness. 235th comment!



I'd like the m3 since its bad ass in a coupe, w/ stick, and its pearly white paint I saw @ the auto show.

Actually, that's the 237th.

A nice black IS-F with those specs is very tempting.

The BMW.

just look how ugly the IS-F looks in that picture.

easily the M3, then I would add the black line tail lights to make it look more aggressive.

I'd Choose the M3 without thinking of it for a second...i mean lexus have been into technology n all that for like 3 - 4 years...i bet they bearly spend money or research.....Theyre still new...its there first SuperCar!!!...BMW already have the M5 and the engine's perfect on the M3 Coupe soo the M3 sedan is more reliable n everything...

I'd Choose the M3 without thinking of it for a second...i mean lexus have been into technology n all that for like 3 - 4 years...i bet they bearly spend money or research.....Theyre still new...its there first SuperCar!!!...BMW already have the M5 and the engine's perfect on the M3 Coupe soo the M3 sedan is more reliable n everything...Lexus needs time..

I'd Choose the M3 without thinking of it for a second...i mean lexus have been into technology n all that for like 3 - 4 years...i bet they bearly spend money or research.....Theyre still new...its there first SuperCar!!!...BMW already have the M5 and the engine's perfect on the M3 Coupe soo the M3 sedan is more reliable n everything...Its like BMW's been there for ages...Lexus cant come n take all that trust n respect in a year or two....

I'd Choose the M3 without thinking of it for a second...i mean lexus have been into technology n all that for like 3 - 4 years...i bet they bearly spend money or research.....Theyre still new...its there first SuperCar!!!...BMW already have the M5 and the engine's perfect on the M3 Coupe soo the M3 sedan is more reliable n everything...Its like BMW's been there for ages...Lexus cant come n take all that trust n respect in a year or two....

I'd Choose the M3 without thinking of it for a second...i mean lexus have been into technology n all that for like 3 - 4 years...i bet they bearly spend money or research.....Theyre still new...its there first SuperCar!!!...BMW already have the M5 and the engine's perfect on the M3 Coupe soo the M3 sedan is more reliable n everything...Its like BMW's been there for ages...Lexus cant come n take all that trust n respect in a year or two....

I'd prefer the Lexus.

1) It looks Asian because it *is*.
2) Nicer interior.
3) Way fewer defects than BMW.
4) On the street, driven by normal people, the performance is pretty similar.

Note that I am *not* saying the BMW is a crappy car. It's just not the car I'd choose today. I'm still happy with my 3 older BMWs, though, and keeping them.