States Worry The Plug In Vehicles May Stress Power Grids

Plug-in hybrid electric vehicles are touted as a solution to the nation's dependence on foreign oil but there remains concern that the state's electricity grid could be strained if significant production of these vehicles hit the streets.

To address that issue, the Michigan Public Service Commission announced today that it is starting a pilot program to assess how much juice would be drained from the state's electricity grid from plug-in hybrid electric vehicles (PHEVs). The program will use actual vehicles when available to analyze the effects of these vehicles on utility and regional electric systems and is part of the MPSC's ongoing smart grid collaborative, which helps assess the state's electricity needs.

enthusiastx11 - 3/12/2008 11:19:41 AM

+5 Boost

this is HUGE deal. the power grid in the US is already strained (as exhibited by several HUGE blackouts in recent years). adding millions of chargeable cars to the market could severely strain our infrastructure.

of course, i'm sure the coal industry is thrilled since most plants are coal-fired. ah...fresh air.

Hantra - 3/12/2008 4:06:15 PM

+3 Boost

Ohh we can get USED to the blackouts. Even if we DON'T go plug-in on cars. In the next decade, China's energy demand will more than DOUBLE.

They are bringing on two new powerplants a WEEK.

How many powerplants is the US bringing on? And we already have brownouts in larger states. Combine that with an extra 50 million illegals who won't pay taxes, but need electricity, and we're screwed. Stock up on batteries and flashlights.

Meanwhile, the idiots on both sides in DC, who are supposed to be working for YOU, just want to punt the problem to the next election cycle. It's not sustainable.

1970toyotamarc - 3/12/2008 11:36:15 AM

+2 Boost

Most of the charging will take place overnight when power companies are scrambling to sell their power.

One of the reasons Toyota is not rushing into PHEVs is because they are studying issues such as this. That is why PHEV Priuses have been given to UC campuses for (2 year?) studies. There arent any easy answers.

enthusiastx11 - 3/12/2008 1:42:32 PM

-1 Boost

"Most of the charging will take place overnight"

actually, lots of people may want to charge at work for the commute home. and lots of batteries will run out midday.

separately, there's still all those COAL-FIRED plants.

S4cabriofoxone - 3/12/2008 10:10:21 PM

0 Boost

OBVIOUSLY, if these plug-in cars became popular, outlets would be installed in most parking lots.

toolatetorace - 3/12/2008 11:07:05 PM

0 Boost

Above comments all make sence ,but , why in the #$%^ can't China poke a few holes in the ground and find some of their own oil . With Russia as their nieghbor and an abundance of oil and gas ( more than what they need) there should be an ample ammount of it

ghosthunter - 3/13/2008 12:52:50 AM

+1 Boost

why in the #$%^ can't US poke a few holes in the ground and find some of their own?

SteedPub - 3/12/2008 12:05:41 PM

+4 Boost

This is no shocker to most people who think these things out beyond the emotic "OOoh, I am saving the world" nonsense of the hybrid and electric cars.

At the end of the day, electric plants will still generate pollution and waste that the electric or plug-in hybrids won't. It will just be located conveniently somewhere else so the owner can live in their oblivious little bubble of utopia.

hybridfarce - 3/12/2008 1:42:21 PM

+3 Boost

Correct. Moving a vehicle takes energy, and it’s the same amount of energy whether it comes from the oil refinery infrastructure+ICE system or the electric industry infrastructure+PHEV/BEV system. So using a PHEV or BEV just shifts the energy around to taxing the electric companies more.

The lure here is that the electric industry infrastructure+PHEV/BEV system is overall more efficient.

The hype is that 100 mpg claims for a plug-in hybrid are false as they only claim the ICE mpg with the benefit of the electric motor but WITHOUT including the energy consumption of the electric motor. Very bad marketing.

hybridfarce - 3/12/2008 2:15:27 PM

0 Boost

Intelligent response, k_m.

My login name is a thinly-veiled joke meant to rile up poseurs like yourself.

djrickp - 3/12/2008 1:02:29 PM

-1 Boost

I don't need the electric grid. I've got Lance Armstrong on a ten speed generating my electricity (ala ESPN) :-)

tattedtwice - 3/12/2008 2:00:32 PM

+4 Boost

This is just like the food we put in our body; there's no solution that won't be harmful in some way, even if it's minute.

truckmen - 3/12/2008 2:18:04 PM

-1 Boost

There has been a solution for a long time! There is a guy in California that is off grid with an electric car with solar and wind to power his plug in car! I would like to see more goverment incentives to enable this!

XYZZ - 3/13/2008 7:03:25 AM

+2 Boost

excellent! in the long run, that is the ideal for as many people willing to minimize their carbon footprints, and can afford to do so. they DESERVE tax breaks and outright subsidies.

we have simply gotten TOO SPOILED for cheap energy, subsidized by other taxpayers and/or degradation of the environment.

btw, the guys who deboosted you (and will me too) are prob'ly more Flush Limbaugh's an Big Oily's unwitting shills.

Porschinator - 3/12/2008 3:31:05 PM

+2 Boost

This has been a forseen issue for awhile now. I hope car manuf. installs small gasoline/diesel engines into the electric vehicles as generators if pluggin in is not an option (ie lost on freeway, in middle of nowhere with low charge).

But electric and other alternatives must be built.

hybridfarce - 3/12/2008 4:26:09 PM

+2 Boost

Porschinator,

I think what you described is what the upcoming Chevy Volt is - a BEV with a "range extender" or on-board gas-powered generator for the batteries.

Porschinator - 3/12/2008 3:35:02 PM

+1 Boost

BTW - I see small displacement motors with turbos increase exponentially in the coming years.

SteedPub - 3/12/2008 3:49:46 PM

+5 Boost

Regardless of what energy our cars run on, all of it is irrelevant if we do not allow our energy producers to produce more capacity.

We NEED more oil production, more refineries, more electric power plants (off all kinds), and more infrastructure.

Interestingly, the same people that whine and cry that we need new alternatives and energy independence are the same ones aligned with the political forces getting in the way of it. A snake eating its own tail.

hybridfarce - 3/12/2008 4:23:12 PM

+1 Boost

You’re not talking about Senator Ted Kennedy and the Cape Cod windmill incident?

I don’t know what’s more difficult (without subsidies) – getting the car manufacturers to make cleaner energy/more efficient cars, or getting the power companies (coal/oil/nuclear) to increase capacity while being cleaner? Both industries have their friends in government…

answer - 3/12/2008 4:15:40 PM

+2 Boost

Aren't we kind of running out of ideas?

Gasoline - poor mileage, short supply greenhouse gasses, etc.

Diesel - pretty much like gasoline, better mileage sometimes

Hybrids - still using gasoline/diesel, toxic batteries

Electric - fossil fuels used to make electricity, burden on power grids

Hydrogen - fossil fuels used to produce hydrogen

Solar - still not mainstream feasible

Seems like everytime a new solution comes out, all the various reasons to poo-poo it come out the next day.

S4cabriofoxone - 3/12/2008 10:12:23 PM

0 Boost

Ride a bike?

XYZZ - 3/13/2008 8:31:08 AM

0 Boost

plug-in hybrid bikes!!!

SteedPub - 3/12/2008 9:20:30 PM

+3 Boost

The bottom line is that any and all energy sources have a down side. We as a society need to get over it and accept that fact.

Nuclear energy is great as well, but that has as many foes as oil.

There will be a point when all the alarmists and anti-capitalists are going to wake up one morning and complain that they cant get affordable food, clothes, and housing because their silly notions have driven the cost of enery - and thus gross national product - to unlivable levels.

Then they will again blame everyone but themselves.

IhavearedS2000 - 3/12/2008 10:36:55 PM

+1 Boost

What company is researching and implementing in small numbers natural gas, and soon, solar paneled stations for fuel cell vehicles...hint: starts with an H ends with an A