Has the Nissan GT-R got Toyota running scared?

It was Ed Loh who first noticed: "Funny," he said. "Once the production GT-R arrived, the Lexus LF-A prototypes disappeared from the Nurburgring." He has a point. Corvette engineers have been at the Nordschliefe in the 620-horse ZR1 running what appear to be comfortable 7min 40sec laps (in other words, better times than former Formula 1 ace Jan Magnussen in full commando attack mode managed in the Z06). But the LF-As, 'Ring-side spy shots of which arrived here almost on a weekly basis over the past few months, seem to have gone AWOL.

Maybe it's just the way Toyota's testing is scheduled (according to our spies at the 'Ring, the LF-A has resurfaced and should be on track shortly). But I wonder. Has the GT-R got Toyota running scared?

Originally revealed at the 2005 Detroit Show as a concept, the LF-A (a prototype caught at the 'Ring last year is pictured) features carbon-fiber intensive construction, and an F1-inspired naturally aspirated V-10 with at least 500hp. (A hybrid V-8 -- the electric motors drove the front wheels -- was tested at one point, but our intel suggests Toyota has gone back to the original V-10 idea.) Toyota has pledged the LF-A will be the company's first genuine supercar. Expectations are high.

Like us, Toyota's engineers know the Nissan GT-R is merely mortal. More horsepower than advertised -- at least 507 horsepower, according to our own dyno testing -- plus low gearing, all-wheel drive and the trick DSG dual clutch transmission help it deliver a scorching 0-60 mph time of 3.2 seconds. They also know the GT-R's mad rush is fading by the time the car reaches the quarter mile.

You can bet those engineers are swarming all over GT-Rs right now, pulling cars to pieces, and analyzing every detail. They will have been watching the testing at the Nurburgring, too, quietly noting the lap times. And they will now be aware the lighter, meaner GT-R V-Spec has been unofficially clocked lapping the Nordschliefe in close to 7min 25sec.

Toyota's problem is this: The GT-R has set the performance bar incredibly high for the next Japanese supercar. And Toyota being Toyota, delivering a supercar that's second-best to a Nissan is unthinkable, especially if it's going to carry the Lexus badge. The LF-A has to be faster than the GT-R, in a straight line, and around the legendary Nordschliefe. Otherwise it risks being perceived a failure.
Read Article

qweasdzxc - 4/12/2008 4:32:44 PM

+13 Boost

Not just TOYOTA.

EVERYONE.

Porschinator - 4/14/2008 2:11:40 AM

-2 Boost

Greatest thing about the GT-R is the tranny. With crazy gearing it is no wonder it can do what it does. So hte tranny is very strong or hopefully so. Peeps that race know how important gearing is. But can cause major wear and tear. I wonder if the LF-A will be built and what tranny they do decide when going production, Prolly the 8 sp with very sporty gearing.

I am still amazed how Nissan actually UNDER stated the true power. I stated on here that there was no way a 3800lbs car can go that fast with 480BHP..I was right!!!

silver1 - 4/14/2008 11:52:40 AM

0 Boost

Please. It's acutally the other way around.

EL34 - 4/12/2008 4:33:38 PM

-14 Boost

Why would that be?

Lookit, the Nissan is not an attractive car, it may be fast, but it's already looks 20 years old :-\

qweasdzxc - 4/12/2008 4:41:20 PM

+13 Boost

I thought you were blind?

KZ258 - 4/12/2008 5:05:09 PM

-2 Boost

el go get a life

zairnaim - 4/12/2008 5:31:41 PM

+8 Boost

he already has a life... bugging you all who are dumb enough to take his posts seriously.

personally I find his posts entertaining:)

_43LE - 4/13/2008 12:22:34 AM

+6 Boost

My thoughts exactly, he gives me something to laugh at every day!

simmonsdp - 4/13/2008 6:36:33 AM

+1 Boost

Yeah I agree EL34 stirs the pot in a good way :-))

EL34 - 4/13/2008 12:06:31 PM

-3 Boost

kraut_master2, you're right the GTR looks aggressive and with 20 inch wheels.

Now we're done talking about the car.

Have a nice day and the GTR looks like a pile of $h!t :-)

JUGNU - 4/12/2008 5:28:41 PM

+7 Boost

not only Toyota but everyone is scared. Especially the ones who are in this field for long long time like Ferrari, Porsche...etc.

JUGNU

enthusiastx11 - 4/13/2008 12:41:21 AM

+2 Boost

yes, i'm sure ferrari and the other exotic makers are concerned that their owners will trade in their GORGEOUS, ferocious sounding, beautifully handling cars for a nissan.

and if you think they will, you have no understanding of the buyers of these kinds of cars.

still laughing...

montyz81 - 4/14/2008 8:28:47 AM

0 Boost

Look. The GT-R was never ment to be better then the Exotics. What it was meant to do is provide performance numbers close to exotics and supercars twice its price while maintaining it's heritage and connection with the GT-R's and GT-R owners of the past. This car has shaken up the world of Super Cars. That was the other part of the Plan for Nissan. In my book, job well done. 20 years from now nobody is going to remember the Lexus LFA like the remember the GTR. Nissan leads Toyota 1-0.

SenSpeed - 4/14/2008 7:54:34 PM

-1 Boost

not that they will trade their ferraris for a nissan, but that the nissan will dust them off the light and make them feel like a jackass.

macker83 - 4/12/2008 6:05:35 PM

+2 Boost

this is just a bullshit article! it has been written just to build hatred towards Toyota/Lexus! The LFA might not be as fast as the GTR but i will be allot more luxurious and user friendly and it will sell!

lexusrox123 - 4/12/2008 6:15:50 PM

+6 Boost

lets hope so! i bet they can get it done, but with a more luxurious interior (of course!)

its not just toylex thats scared!! porsche, bmw, ferarri, lambo ...

EL34 - 4/12/2008 8:15:23 PM

-2 Boost

I'm sure Go0bama is right!

lol

Bored - 4/13/2008 5:18:40 AM

-4 Boost

@ macker83,
WTF!? Have you been drinking GoObama and ToyotaPower's kool-aid (please note that they offer different flavors and ToyotaPower's version has been notably better)?
The GT-R and the LF-A (whenever it becomes available) are (and will be) fine vehicles. Only simple minded individuals like GoObama (who gets his intel from his Daddy) and "Dubbya" (which mentioning him is insult enough).

BozzorTheGreat - 4/12/2008 6:32:45 PM

+2 Boost

The problem is that whilst the LF-A will be a fine car within its parameters - a normally aspirated, large capacity V-10 in what will probably be a rleatively lightweight body doing the rear wheels - the ZR-1 and especially the GT-R have moved the game on. The ZR-1 will have around 1 litre advantage over the Lexus in capacity plus supercharging. And the GT-R, well, the increadibly advanced 4WD and DSG just put it so far ahead.

I feel sorry for Lexus, had this car come out 3 years ago it would have actually been a winner, but the new kids on the block have moved the game on.

noname00 - 4/12/2008 6:53:24 PM

+1 Boost

I don't like the looks of the GTR, I adore the looks of the race version, but the street one is just too tall, because of the pedestrian safety regulations. The Lexus LF-A (roadster) looks much better.

KZ258 - 4/12/2008 7:02:21 PM

+2 Boost

the GT-R has every auto maker scared or at least worried. not even the cops would ticket this monster ;)

EL34 - 4/12/2008 8:15:52 PM

+3 Boost

I'll agree with that.

KZ258 - 4/12/2008 8:16:01 PM

+1 Boost

lol!

american_made - 4/15/2008 4:54:51 PM

+1 Boost

Still a rice rocket, zing zing, have fun.....no thanks

car_dude - 4/12/2008 8:28:38 PM

+4 Boost

Its funny you mention porsche, lambos and ferraris, watch this video it was taken recently. The Nissan GT-R playing with the big boys around the california canyons.

http://www.speedandmotion.com/pages/videos/canyonrun032008.html

EL34 - 4/12/2008 10:01:20 PM

-6 Boost

Here's the difference between the Nissan and the Exotic Super Cars.

When they get done driving the Nissan driver goes home to his $1.2 million dollar home in Irvine and the Exotic drivers go home to their $5 to $20 million dollar beach front homes in Newport Beach/Coast, Corona Del Mar, Dana Point or Laguna Beach.

07G35J - 4/13/2008 2:43:20 AM

-1 Boost

Great video.

olscuul - 4/13/2008 6:30:15 PM

0 Boost

stipid video. was there one legal pass?

olscuul - 4/13/2008 6:31:14 PM

0 Boost

ok, stupid spelling. didn't see a legal pass in that video.

TauronB2G - 4/12/2008 10:14:42 PM

+1 Boost

Skip Lexus, NMW and everyone else. I want to know what Porsche is going to do. I have a feeling that the upcoming 928 will be a full fledged beast now with the Cayenne Turbo engine and Porsches new DSG...come on now!!!
T

farabira1 - 4/12/2008 10:59:06 PM

+1 Boost

The title should had been "Has the Nissan GTR got Toyota, Honda, Chevrolet, Porsche, BMW, Mercedes Benz, Audi, and all other companies running scared"

_43LE - 4/13/2008 12:23:33 AM

+7 Boost

Competition is a great thing.

enthusiastx11 - 4/13/2008 12:42:32 AM

-4 Boost

GTR is stunning achievement.

but, sadly, it just doesn't LOOK like a supercar. it's much too tarted up.

DieselRules - 4/13/2008 2:39:57 AM

+1 Boost

Go Nissan!
In the late 60's the 510 was the car to beat.
510's with the roadster's twin-carb, 2-litre engine and 5-speed were blowing Vettes into the weeds!
In the 70's the Z-cars took over.
The Nissan V-6 has probably been on Ward's "Best-10" list longer than any other engine.
They lost their way in the 1980's and had to eventually be rescued by Renault (who have a huge winning history in both F1 and Rally ... remember the 1973 Monte Carlo: Renault places 1, 2, 3, 5, 6, and 10th place with an engine hitting 11,000 RPM)

Now Nissan have their Mojo back, and they're kickin' butt!
Hopefully this will force Toyota (and others) to come out with an even BETTER product than they originally targetted.

The bar is raised.
Let the games begin. :)

07G35J - 4/13/2008 2:44:11 AM

+1 Boost

"Now Nissan have their Mojo back, and they're kickin' butt!"

YEAH, BABY, YEAH!!!!

07G35J - 4/13/2008 2:40:04 AM

+1 Boost

Godzilla is BACK!!!!! Be afraid, be very afraid...

Designer1 - 4/13/2008 2:40:38 AM

+4 Boost

Truly, if Lexus wants its LF-A to succeed it better have more power than 500hps, and great performance, the GT-R is kicking everyone’s ass with its power, performance, looks, and price; where the LF-A will be over $100k (which is crazy), so they better make it right and much more right than the IS-F.

MunichRob - 4/13/2008 5:45:23 AM

-1 Boost

The Nissan GT-R has everyone running scared...Especially Porsche!

abcd - 4/13/2008 10:10:01 AM

+2 Boost

"More horsepower than advertised -- at least 507 horsepower, according to our own dyno testing"

I`m not pretty sure about that:

http://www.autoblog.com/2008/03/13/nissan-gt-r-meets-the-dyno-997-porsche-turbo-and-e92-bmw-m3/

as you can see when they used other dyno they have different results but when porsche 911 and gtr were test in that same time on that same dyno they obtained very similar results so i doubt gtr has 507 horsepower .

BigShow50 - 4/13/2008 2:02:14 PM

+1 Boost

There is no rush for Toyota to come out with the LF-A. It's real simple for them "Know your rival, then go for the kill" Toyota may be conservativ, but patience and persistence plays a huge roll for them. Nissan is doing everything in their power to aggressively come out with an ultimate icon for the company. What does that mean in the long run? Only time will tell...As for Toyota, why should everybody talk so soon? Is the performance Lexus LF-A has been testing can be just a decoy of mediocre performance? They know about Nissan well before any of us even laid eyes for the 1st time on the Skyline GT-R. Today's GT-R is a twin turbo V6...LF-A is naturally aspirated engine. V10 always has room to be tuned even without a turbo or supercharger. But Lexus can go with a twin turbo V8...Japananese engineering is sky's the limit. Remember Toyota's goal with the LF-A is to exceed beyond the 220 mph....can't wait for that. Don't think Toyota is scared it just got them more pumped up. It's the rest of the automotive corporate world, where their jaws dropped with looks of deer in the headlights, goes back to the drawing board for the next 3-5 year at least to figure out this new performance game. As for Nissan and Toyota. This will be a great rabbit and the turtle story...the questions remains who is the rabbit? And the who is the turtle? This will be a great battle!!!
p.s. Let's not forget about the up an coming Toyota Supra, for all we know it maybe all Toyota needs to give the GT-R a good run for it's money!!!

mpls - 4/13/2008 5:31:26 PM

0 Boost

I agree with your comments. The next Supra I thunk will be great too.. The old one was simply stunning and not even Mercedes or BMW has anything like that in that time..

mpls - 4/13/2008 9:08:31 PM

+1 Boost

JC..
BMW was basically producing saloon cars, their Z3 and Z4 came out after Mazda starts a new wave of small sports cars like the MX-5.. I agree they do not compete on price but seriously, BMW were producing quite dull cars when Toyota had the Celica, Supra, Trueno.. BMW and mercedes were all about luxury saloon and not sports cars.. It is only later that they releaised they survving on dull saloon cars could not be sustained so they moved into areas of producing more sporty versions of their saloon and coupes..

car_dude - 4/14/2008 3:11:57 AM

+2 Boost

Its funny you guys are mentioning the supra and BMW in the same sentence, here a comparo done in Germany by one of their car programs. In the video they're comparing the supra and the new M3. Even the supra is respected in Germany and thats saying something.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=H_c9YVDKFKc

montyz81 - 4/14/2008 9:46:59 AM

+1 Boost

I stated this above, now I'll state it hear for all to see. The GT-R was never ment to be better then the Exotics. What it was meant to do is provide performance numbers close to exotics and supercars twice its price while maintaining it's heritage and connection with the GT-Rs and GT-R owners of the past. This car has shaken up the world of Super Cars. That was the other part of the plan for Nissan. In my book, job well done. 20 years from now nobody will remember the Lexus LFA like they remember the GTR. Nissan leads Toyota 1-0.

abcd - 4/15/2008 11:31:26 AM

+3 Boost

TurboSpyder:
"Nissan doesn’t have the racing history and prestige that Porsche and Ferrari have."

skyline gt-r also have racing heritage mostly in group A series - touring car racing :
http://gtrusa.blogspot.com/2007/12/nissan-skyline-gt-r-history-1989-1998.html
some citation:
"November 1990 – 1990 Group A series Champion
November 1991 – 1991 Group A series Champion
November 1992 – 1992 Group A series Champion
November 1993 – 1993 Group A series Champion"
in group A it was unbeateable.
http://www.nagtroc.org/wiki/8th_Generation_Skyline:_R32_(1989~93)
citation:
"However, the GT-R's success sounded the death knell of Group A Touring Car racing; with the formula being scrapped soon after."

this reminds me mazda Le Mans won in 1991 with rotary engine . after that FIA banned rotary engines:
http://www.tenerife-training.net/Tenerife-News-Cycling-Blog/2007/10/inspirational-people/the-1991-le-mans-mazda-team-and-the-legendary-rotary-renown-787b/
citation:
"So successful was Mazda’s entry in the 1991 race that the rules for subsequent races were changed to ban the rotary engine from competing in subsequent Le Mans endurance races."

in many touring car races skyline gt-r was forced to carry a weight penalty becouse it was too fast for other cars e.g. australia-bathurst:
http://www.gt-r.ch/press/nissan_skyline_gt-r.pdf
citation:
"Its success in motor racing was
formidable, particularly in the annual race at the Mount Panorama circuit in Bathurst,
Australia, where the champion three years running was a GT-R (despite receiving additional
weight penalties in years two and three due to its unbeatable performance)"

also Clarkson about skyline gt-r:
http://pl.youtube.com/watch?v=7hPa2KEB4Sg
1:28 - about racing with ferrari
TurboSpyder:
"Also, I think Nissan was wise in how they engineered the GT-R’s performance envelope to produce the best lap times on a circuit like the Nurburgring"
it`s nissan gt-r "tradition" to beat nurburgring times:
-R32 set the record time of 8:20
-r33 less than 8 minutes:
http://pl.youtube.com/watch?v=vuZulCKFby4 - 4:10

abcd - 4/15/2008 11:31:55 AM

+2 Boost

abcd - 4/15/2008 11:33:02 AM

+2 Boost

sorry for twice

ThierryHenry14 - 4/14/2008 10:07:22 AM

+3 Boost

I'm all for German Supercars, but those who denies the GT-R is just stupid. I've never doubted this car, and I know that as a true car fan, its great for the market. As a true German car fan, I know not many people will cross shop the GT-R and a 997 Turbo, let alone a 997 GT2. But to deny the GT-R a place in supercar territory is just pure bias talk.

I still will never get a GT-R, but I damn sure respect it. Can't wait to take on one on the tracks!!!

ThierryHenry14 - 4/14/2008 1:22:59 PM

-1 Boost

or you could take Nissan's words for it that it tops out at 193 m/h...

abcd - 4/15/2008 11:39:51 AM

+2 Boost

TurboSpyder:
"I also specified the hp and torque values at 2500, 3500, 4500, 5500 and 6700 rpm for the motor by reading the values from the dyno graph on Motor Trend’s web site and multiplying them by 1.18 to correspond to the 506.6hp/430.6hp factor that MT associates with a 15% drive train loss...The result is that my software estimates the GT-R should do 0 to 60 mph in 3.1 s and the ¼ mile in 11.2s at 125 mph. These times are somewhat better than what MT got here"
you have better times probably becouse gt-r don`t have 507 hp:
http://www.autoblog.com/2008/03/13/nissan-gt-r-meets-the-dyno-997-porsche-turbo-and-e92-bmw-m3/

as you can see - different dyno different results but it has that same power as 911 turbo

henbmw - 4/14/2008 1:44:37 PM

-1 Boost

I think its got everyone running scared

answer - 4/14/2008 6:50:11 PM

+3 Boost

I don't think Lexus is scared of the GTR (as awesome as the GT-R is). It just seems like Lexus can't make a final decision on the their own car.

The LF-A is taking way too damn long for a production model to come to fruition.

I love Lexus, but with each time the LF-A appears at an auto show as a "concept" I get more and more bored.