Lexus GrowS of age

From the article: "Lexus still falls short of the best Europe has to offer "

That pretty much sums it up. Lexus still has long way to go in their desire to match the unbelievable quality found in cars like Mercedes and BMW. Keep trying Lexus...

Star. if you've read that, read also this part of article honey:

''Make no mistake, Lexus's GS 460 stands toe-to-toe with the best Europe has to offer today and trades blows confidently. Ultimately the appearance and tactility of the interior remains the only weakness, as the engineering remains second to none. For some this shortcoming is likely to be significant enough to put them off a potential purchase; for everyone else there is much joy and satisfaction to be gleaned from one of the most thoroughly engineered and executed executive saloons on the market.''

OK Star honey ? Now go and take a rest.

EL44 ... have you driven a Lexus GS460 vs a BMW 550 vs a Mercedes E550? If not you should and the gap is wide in comparison to both of those cars.

EL44,

after saying Lexus sucks they come back and add "is not that bad though". Can't you not see that all they are doing is trying to be polite?

bulldogz,

we think you are retarded. Try for a change to post something that is not a criticism to another poster.
Let's here your opinion about the different titles in all this threads as opposed to your rants against us, rants which give us the impression that you are mentally challenged. Just an advice from the members of Autospies.

here=hear

First, overall the GS is far more of a car than the 5 series and E class. I only wish, and don't know they didn't, that the new GS460 had the LS460's power since it shares the same engine.

In short, don't care what the German fans say, in reality and on the road the GS rules!!!

BMW4me4ever
Yes i've tried all of them and more than once and that because i love to try as much as possible different cars and and in my country we can go to a dealer and try the cars for free. To be honest with you, i found the BMW more agressive and involving to drive. Here i gave one point to it. But that's all. Overall i would take the LEXUS for my everyday life. Nevertheless i drive actualy an AUDI S4 cabriolet and i enjoy it alot.

"First, overall the GS is far more of a car than the 5 series and E class"


What in the world are you talking about? The GS is possibly Lexus weakest offering as it is neither very sporty or very comfortable and furthermore is short on interior space and trunk space too (especially in hybrid form). There's a reason this car generally finishes bottom in comparison tests.

Whoever thinks the GS leads the class needs a reality check; it's a great-looking car but it's neither very comfortable nor exceedingly sporty. The only one I would buy is the GS450h.

I was just as usual reading The Car Enthousitast site and it was in the first page. You can verify it. It's still there. I was not particulary searching a one about LEXUS.

EL44 "I was just as usual reading The Car Enthousitast"

Enthousitast??? Ha, ha, ha...I see. No wonder you are so confused.

.....YAWN.

AMEN!

bulldogz,

all you do is embarrass yourself.

damikco,

who said "bulldogz" is an adult. This "puppy" is still sniffing, looking for its brain in the nearby dumpsters. Ha, ha, ha...

I like the GS just cuz not too many have it. Lite modding (supercharger/exhaust) even on the previous 4.3V8 make them faster and still cheaper than a 550i. 550i is expensive, but love it for the stick. and 528 is priced like a GS350 - GS350 is much faster. but the lex. don't have stick.

The best looking Lexus by far in my opinion. Even better than my big ship LS.

i agreed, but not/nowhere better than flagship toyota, thats like saying E/CLS is better than S550, sorry no go

Sorry, but 'best looking lexus' still isnt saying much.

I said it's "best looking" not better

tattedtwice, the same goes with Mazda, and I know your a fanboy

Lexus is a poor man's Mercedes Benz.

My mom said so!

Wrong the the interior quality is much better thant fully load MB and BMW. The only german car wich is comparable is AUDI's interior.
By the way, we can find exactly the same buttons os a A or B class, in a S class.

so you believe EVERYTHING your mom says? even when she pops out STUPID OFFSPRING?

does she wear combat boots?

(wish i could remember some of the whole retinues of "your mama is so..." jokes!)

"By the way, we can find exactly the same buttons os a A or B class, in a S class"

FALSE.

It's amazing how far Lexus fanboys will go to discredit a brand. The Mercedes S-Class shares zero interior components with the A or B-Class.

On the other hand the Lexus LS shares the exact same seat button controls with the new Toyota Landcruiser. And unlike EL44, I've actually seen this with my own eyes.

Does it matter? No.

Does it make the LS a cheaper car? No.

Quit the moronic trash talking already.

The radio bottons, the steeringwheel bottons and door lock bottons are excatly the same in A and B class and as S classe in different color. And Bill try to saty polite and not insulting everybody who has not the same point of view as you.

I don't care what you guys say. A Mercedes S-Class is inferior to a Lexus LS. I have both so I'm not biased.

Toyota fan boys enough about this "LEXUS HAS THE BEST QUALITY". If you haven't been in one then don't talk and if you don't own one then you sure as hell can't say you know how the cars going to be 1,2,3,5 years down the road. I've had a couple S-class's before and I bought my LS not too long ago as well. Quality of the LS is expected if anyone was to pay that much for a Japanese car. The S-Class interior is expected to be made with high quality materials and it's nothing but top notch luxury.

Enough with the excuses everyone. It can only get so far before it is lame.

Ops. Error. I meant NOT inferior.

"The radio bottons, the steeringwheel bottons and door lock bottons are excatly the same in A and B class and as S classe in different color."

I assume you haven't noticed, but the S and CL have completely bespoke interiors from the rest of the Mercedes lineup. They are leaps and bounds ahead of their lesser brethren in terms of materials and design. I wouldn't be surprised if they didn't share a single button with the E-Class, let alone the A/B models.

i was in a sclass today. i have to admit the inside is very nice. i felt all the materials inside it seems more solid than lexus. lexus is put together well but ambiance you get inside a merc is second to none..

wow i never thought i'd say this.. i am drunk but its the truth serum right? i still love lexus tho eitherway.

bill: "On the other hand the Lexus LS shares the exact same seat button controls with the new Toyota Landcruiser. And unlike EL44, I've actually seen this with my own eyes."


and you intend THAT as a slam against the LS?

fyi, the toyota land cruiser STARTS at a higher base price than more than 1/2 the whole lexus lineup.

equally, and possibly of MORE importance, are the WORKING PARTS (vs. MERE TRIM) that you DON'T see, and affect the long term reliability. on this score, NO MANUFACTURER bests toyota/lexus.

got a call today from a friend who FINALLY is ready to write-off his NINETEEN-YEAR-OLD toyota truck. it still had a few more years of life, but due to a lax self repair job (he didn't re-secure the exhaust), some critical wiring and solenoids burnt up.

i know more than a few other toyota owners with 20-yr old daily drivers.

and the TOYOTA landcruiser/lexus LX570 is of course, the ultimate indestructible motor car.

EL34's mom is also his cousin

loool look at the fools who wrote the article, downplaying the GS's interior?? looool
Truly bunch of idiots. The usual thing they say, the Lexus buttons look like the Toyota.. Ummm, how about the S class buttons look just like the base model C class?

You fools, the quality of these buttons that you're talking about, they’re in the Toyota Auris is beyond that found in the C class and the same level as the S class.

But why do I bother to comment again, I've said it before and will again; Lexus is gaining the ground that once used to be owned by the German cars and that's causing all these articles to be written stupidly trying to find a glitch here or there.

I wonder if you've actually been inside a Lexus GS. Trust me, the interior quality is not that much better than a fully loaded Toyota Aurion. (Search that car up). Infact, their interiors are VERY similar. The quality is almost the same.

Not bashing Lexus or anything, but the quality of the buttons feels very cheap.

Wrong the the interior quality is much better thant fully load MB and BMW. The only german car wich is comparable is AUDI's interior.
By the way, we can find exactly the same buttons os a A or B class, in a S class.

lol! this argument reminds me of when people were saying the lexus ES models were "just" gussied up camrys.
a generation or two back, toyota designed and brought to market the ES FIRST, THEN decontented it and produced the camry. so rather than the ES being a gussied-up camry, the CAMRY was really AN ES in disguise!

little wonder that the Camry was america's best selling sedan for so long. the v6 models were lexuses in everything but name.

further, while toyota does offer inexpensive econoboxes, even prior to the Lexus branch, it was (and is to this day) a FULL LINE MFGR of everything from econoboxes, to commercial vehicles, to limosines. same as MB.

the TOYOTA Century V12 limo, in fact, actually leapfrogged the MB limos, having been designed to compare with ROLLS ROYCE. it is an uber exclusive model, for the Imperial Family, diplomats, and captains of industry.

unlike audi and vw, lexus has A BASIS for BEING PROUD of its TOYOTA connection and parentage.

The Toyota Century is a Japan-only model and looses its appeal very quickly outside of Japan. Why? Because nobody knows about it and what it is about. People know about Rolls Royce and Bentley and the heritage and history behind it and that makes them appealing to a certain crowd. No matter how good the Toyota Century is engineered, it cannot compete with a Rolls Royce or Bentley in terms of prestige. Prestige is derived from history and heritage and the Toyota Century, although in its ____th generation in Japan simply doesn't have the rich and traditional heritage that these two ultra-luxury British brands do.

"the TOYOTA Century V12 limo, in fact, actually leapfrogged the MB limos, having been designed to compare with ROLLS ROYCE. it is an uber exclusive model, for the Imperial Family, diplomats, and captains of industry."

It hasn't changed for a decade and its only served to the east asian region. RR is some of the oldest automakers and I'm pretty sure many are synonymus with the name. if you're not familiar, Hong Kong has the most populated RR phantoms in the world. peninsula hotel over there ordered 23 of them for their fleet. I don't see anything that makes the century more famous than the s-class or RR


"leapfrogged the MB limos"?

in what?

"unlike audi and vw, lexus has A BASIS for BEING PROUD of its TOYOTA connection and parentage."

thats because audi and vw work independently.

"...audi and vw work independently."

AND BOTH STILL fall short of TOYOTA reliability and longevity.

LEXUS is TWO or THREE classes above.

vws and fancy vws may have nice TRIM. even on switches maybe. but what good are those when they FAIL?

friend has a relatively new, new vw Bug. she had to endure many a -20 day with the window open, due to a crappy switch.

another friend has a 15-yr old toyota 4Runner. she THOT (and was told by a job hungry dealer) her window motor failed. turned out it was ONLY a frayed wire at fault.

the only couple i know that's owned AUDIs, NEVER keep them once the warranty expires.

ChicaneShooter, any reasonable person knows that "stories" like that are just stupid. I don't care what you've SEEN, that's not what I've experienced. The two Lexuses I've owned have been no better and no worse than the four Audis and one BMW that I have owned.

didn't CR recommend the jetta and rabbit as well as a certain number of audis? what about the v6 camry and v8 4wd tundra?

the bar is not very high for getting a CR "recommended" citation. the car ONLY has to get a reasonable score on their road tests, and NOT BE BELOW AVERAGE on reliability.

only a FEW v6 camrys had problems when they first got the 268 hp engine. v6 tundra 4x4s remain more reliable than ANY OTHER 4x4 truck, excepting only tacoma 4x4s. likely the otherwise rock solid toyota 4x4 drive train just needs beefing up to handle the HUGE POWER of the new 5.7 engine.

but that's ONLY 2 models of the dozens toyota offers.


how many benzs get a "CR recommended?" all of ZERO. NADA. ZIP. they do well enuff in the road tests, but can't hop over the LOW BAR due to shoddy reliability.

Why some of you hate so much LEXUS? Just because it tries to be among the bests? Don't forget that from 1989 this car is considered to be one the best buit cars in our world.

Nobody HATES Lexus. You want people to put Lexus on the same level with Mercedes or BMW and if they don't you see them as haters. That's wrong. You need to understand that nobody who knows cars can commit the atrocity of considering Lexus equal to a Mercedes or BMW. The differences in level of engineering and quality of materials are big, and all in the favor of the Germans. Like I said before Lexus makes decent cars but they are still far from what the European elite car makers bring on the market. This is not hate, is just common sense.

M53R

I think it's u who didn't tried or sit in the Lexus GS.
There is nothing Toyota Aurion about it. Toyota Aurion interior is 100% same as Camry(and it should be as it's sold as Camry in some countries like China and in our country, UAE it's the V6 Camry) and anyone with eyes can see Camry interior is not similar to GS. Not even to ES.
U r just too biased and hate Lexus. just making up stuff.

BTW i agree with Agent63, To me too GS is the most beautiful Lexus followed closely by LS and IS.

To me it's also the most beautiful in it's class except the all new Jaguar XF which i think is more stylish and sharp.

JUGNU

My family owns both vehicles. Just add a navi screen to a camry, change the position of the buttons, and you'll have a GS. I never said that's something bad, they do come from the same parent company.

lexus "you can't touch this" > MB,BMW,AUDI,JAG.

you used > (GREATER than) rather than => (referring to).

and you are ABSOLUTELY CORRECT!!! lol!

You should specify that you are referring to drivers in US. Most of the people in the rest of the world are driving manual transmission equipped cars.

How about both? That's what BMW does.

It's hard to have a discussion about Lexus when people are so irrational.

You are right, Lexus fans tend to act like that.

Actually, I meant that as a general comment to everyone.

What exactly do you want to hear 43LE? That Lexus cars are as good as a Mercedes or a BMW? Is that what sound "rational" to you? Well you are not going to hear that from a car enthusiast, at least not until Lexus actually starts BUILDING cars that are on par with a Mercedes or BMW.

but that's what you're reading on this review. Star Honey.

Read this part of the review again Star and stop to be such fanatic. Respect also other opinions:

''Make no mistake, Lexus's GS 460 stands toe-to-toe with the best Europe has to offer today and trades blows confidently. Ultimately the appearance and tactility of the interior remains the only weakness, as the engineering remains second to none. For some this shortcoming is likely to be significant enough to put them off a potential purchase; for everyone else there is much joy and satisfaction to be gleaned from one of the most thoroughly engineered and executed executive saloons on the market.''

I already explained to you what they mean by that. Not counting that like others mentioned previously, this review holds no weight since is taken from some obscure website. You Lexus fanbois must be so, so desperate...

talk about this boring car all you like, but who buys it speaks volumes...people in their 50s, far more women than men, suburbanites.

and FAR MORE in total number of purchases! in the u.s., AND increasingly in other markets (russia, china) as Lexi are sold there.

Lexus = the INTELLIGENT choice for those who want prestige, EXCLUSIVITY (no where as COMMON as mb, bmw) and RELIABILITY.

FYI--the E-class and 5-series outsell the GS several times over.

but the LS outsells both S-class and 7s.

people who buy FLAGSHIP sedans easily recognize THE BEST. the GS appeals to a smaller audience.

When you don't have the cash to buy a Mercedes you buy a Lexus and everyone on the road knows it :-/

spot on buddy.

The irony of that is, you've just bought yourself a better car :)

and we know your mom told it to you.

amazing that they have such similar cubic volume because the GS feels cramped. and if you're over 6 feet tall, forget about it...the headroom is terrible.

Huu76,

Can you read???

I said in "the rest of the world"(that's outside America and Canada)most of the people drive manual transmission equipped cars. What is that have to do with what BMW and all the other car makers sell in America? Are you so blinded by your hate against BMW that you cannot think clearly?
Most of the people in America and Canada are bad drivers and is only natural to see them going for automatic cars. You are doing nothing else than proving my point once again. Americans and obviously Canadians(judging after your posts) are clueless when it comes to cars. Thanks for playing.

PS I own three cars. Two have manual transmission and one is equipped with DSG. I am also probably the best driver you ever had the chance to be in dialog with. You can congratulate yourself for that.

Star honey! Have you done your homeworks?

huu: so in addition to all your other flaws, you're also homophobic? grow up kid. welcome to the 21st century.

bulldogz at star:

""...I am also probably the best driver you ever had the chance to be in dialog with. You can congratulate yourself for that."

"suuuuure, yet yet know nothing about tracking a car but now suddenly you are the best commuter driver??!!

hahaha!!! what a clown you are! look around to see how much of a joke you are here!"


having grown up with NON-sychro'd sticks, and having BY CHOICE bought automatics in most recent car purchases, i can say with authority the much ballyhooed "advantage" of sticks in non-existent compared with the latest autoboxes.

i DO still enjoy driving sticks.
i ALSO enjoy the flexibility of automatics.

most stick-only fanatics have NOWHERE as educated right feet (for forced shifting) as most auto pilots.

i've got more brains in my TOES than a lotta fanbois have in their balls AND their heads.

not only can i heel-and-toe, but when i shuck off my sandals, i can drive with just TWO TOES with automatics. (or with maximum control and comfort, the heel and toe of one foot.)

then, if/when i'm REALLY in a hurry (or in slick conditions), i can left foot brake and use both feet to outdrive stodgy stick stirrers.

even tho' i'm among the few who can do the 3-pedal, 2-feet heel-n-toe dance, i can potentially drive faster with an automatic. marginally.

Too many German fanboys on this site, that's all I'm going to say.

"Europeans can't afford automatics"

christ, what planet do you live on? western europe is one of the wealthiest regions on earth. got any data to back up your usual baseless comments?

"Why are the S-class, SL and 750i only available with automatics in the UK?"

because that's what buyers of those cars want.

why aren't any lexus vehicles (besides the wimpy IS250) even available with a stick? because that's what the non-enthusiasts who drive those cars want.

hmm...well I cant account for the rest of the world,but I currently live in the middle east and toyota and lexus are on top. I dont know why??? But they love em. I see more lexus ls in one day then I see a bimmer in a week. Plus there are lot of poor people so toyotas are everywhere. They buy these more than any other car. 2nd would be mercedes benz...followed by bmw and audi. So Star I wouldnt say the rest of the world if you havent actually been to the rest of the world. Ive travelled quite a bit and find your comments wrong. STAR = FANBOY!!!

ah, the middle east. that bastion of refinement and good taste. still laughing...

enthusiastx11,

LOL...loved your comments in this thread.

thank you. ;)

well the middle east is crap as far as taste goes...but they are super rich and I see lambos, ferraris, bugattis, bentleys blah blah blah all day lol. I was just pointing out that europe does not equal the whole world.

money has little to do with taste (or manners for that matter). in fact, in much of the world there seems to be an inverse relationship between the two.

This is probably the most positive review I've read for the GS. So when the reviewer states "it doesn't look or feel like the interior of a £50,000 car," really says something, & I couldn't agree more. You know a GS can push 70 grand here in Canada!

With the exception of the LS & SC, the interior of an Accord could seriously rival the majority of Lexus's models, though I will say Lexus has very nice leathers in their cars.

Yes well BMW is not even a Luxury car!

"We can afford to be wasteful if we want to, can Europe? We can afford more than one home, Europeans feel lucky to buy a townhouse. We can afford multiple cars, Europeans are satisfied will a little shiney badge."

seriously? we're far more wasteful of energy and therefore more dependent on foreign oil than europe, 40 million americans don't have insurance and can't afford to go to a doctor (free medical care in europe), we're obsesses with quantity rather than quality like the europeans, we live in excessively large homes than are mortgage to the hilt...etc, etc.

you're a fool of the highest order huu.

I see the Lexus Lunatics are out in full force. Everyone knows that Lexus still isn't there yet. What's the big deal?

The flip down control panel looks like something out of a 1980's chrysler LeBaron. I have seen this panel in person and it is just as cheesy as the one in the LeBaron. This just looks cheap and it feels cheap too.

"Middle East got crap taste"

can u please tell me where u both are from(xlr and enthusiast) so i can also say the same to your country and it's people. Stupid Recists.

JUGNU

It's not racist, and although it may be stereotypical, it's largely true. In the UAE, Saudi Arabia and surrounding countries, so many people have flashy luxury cars with big rims and ugly bodykits. Everyone is trying to be "unique," when the only way to really be unique there is to drive an inexpensive car.

and u yourslef said u see lots of Ferraris, Benleys, Lamborghinis...etc. That is hardly bad taste.

JUGNU

I currently reside in bahrain and take trips to qatar, kuwait, and the UAE. Only royalty here drive these uber exotic vehicles. I would say the emirates have pretty good tastes seeing as how they have the money to afford nice things. The vast population however dont have a clue from what ive seen. I see such hideous body kits and tasteless decor. Have you ever seen someone put gucci stickers all over there hummer h2 and have burberry/lv/channel crossed interior with 24 in spinners that glow? I think you see my point.

Lexus makes great cars and fulfills a market niche for Toyota buyers who want more luxury. Approximately 70% of sales are from the ES/RX line, which are based on Toyota models. Could care less. But why the constant need to compare to BMW,MB,etc. This is another market. Reminds me of poster a Crevier BMW, 70's 3.0Csi with each wheel about 6 inches off the ground coming around a uphill turn. Do not want to be a customer of a brand that wants to be the Ritz Carlton dealership. That the difference.