Cadillac's 556 HP CTS-V Will Undercut BMW's M5 By $29K But Is That Enough To Steal Away Sales?

I commend Cadillac for putting out such a beast of a car. Pretty amazing that (number wise) it competes with the M5 and E63, yet costs $30k less. Hopefully it will help GM on its turnaround.

HOWEVER, despite its huge horsepower advantage, this car does nothing for me. For relatively the same amount of money, I would much rather have a M3 coupe (nicely optioned at approxiametly $65k). Although it has 100+ less horsepower, I think its engine is far more advanced and you can't beat that 8,400 redline.

Advanced engine and a high redline doesn't mean anything if your 'fast' car is slower, does it?

If you would have said you prefered styling or body style or driving dynamics I might agree w/ you but just because an engine is 'advanced' is plain silly.

91z, I haven't driven the CTS-V, so I couldn't make comparison based on driving dynamics (will be tough to beat the M3 I can imagine). As far as styling, I posted earlier this week that I find the CTS's styling awkward and kind of frumpy -- doesn't do it for me.

As for the "slower" argument, yes the M3 is slower (very few cars on road faster than the CTS-V). However, the times when you could actually exploit that difference are few and far.

Chevy is coming out with some of the best bargains in this side of the globe. The CTS-V will sell very well due to its price alone, not to mention its huge performance success.

But will it steal away sales from the M5? Sure, but not a significant number.
I would focus more on the C63 and the RS4/6, which in my opinion have more chances of losing sales to the V than the M, since they focus more on comfort and luxury which is what Cadillac has been known for throughout its history.
This is not to say that the Benz and the Audi aren't great performers, which they are, but the overall brand is not known for overall-performance like BMW.

Utahkid, the M3's engine revs to 8,400rpm. The CTS-V'S redlines at 6,200. Do you know how to drive stick? If so, you will know that this is a big and noticeable difference.

The CTS-V produces its power the old fashioned way -- huge engine (6.2L) and forced induction. The CTS-V only has 2 valves per cylinder, while the M3 has 4 per cylinder.

You may prefer the big block V8 power form over the small, high-revving V8. But appreciating and understanding the engineering of a car certainly isn't the "stupidiest" reason to buy a car.

Caddy did a great job with the vehicle and pricing. I would love to have one

HOWEVER I think you should stop saying HOWEVER in ever comment you post. Sounds condecending.

Prefer the Arden Jaguar XF, they tune it to 500+bhp.

http://www.arden.de/aade/fahrzeug_modell.php?sid=f9230313d34696f527163662d34696f5c65646f6d6f52716366213d34696f597e61607d6f636f52716366223d347e656271607f5d657e6626323638383d34696

BMW/Merc/Audi shouldn't be too worried. Sure there will be those who will buy the CTS-V over the Germans because of price & power, but let's face it. Most people who buy M5's and E63's are putting down that much money because the want the extreme performance AND they want that german hood emblem. I have a classic SL roadster, and just the feeling of having that massive 3-pointed star on a bright red body is great b/c people notice (aside from the finely designed and built beauty that it is).

Personally, I would choose the CTS-V over the competition because of power, performance, cost, maintenance, etc, etc etc. I really have never been too into the German monster sedans, mostly because they are so expensive. They are absolutely amazing, and of course I'd like one, but unless I hit it rich one day...

And, I gotta hand it to GM/Cadillac for the CTS. I am in love with that vehicle, and with this beastly monster of an powertrain/suspension...... well I wish I had a lot more money to my name.

I thought this car was more of a M3 competitor and the STSV was the M5 competitor.

Actually this is a common misconception.

There is no direct correlation between the Germans car sizes and Cadillac's vehicle sizes. The CTS falls somwhere between a 3 and a 5 series. Still If you were to base it on engine alone...then the comparison would go to the 5 series.

Yes, I hope they do that damikco, because neither the STS nor DTS are competitive. The STS-V is totally obsolete now.

Amazin moron

Back in the day, domestic cars only had outdated engines, but great straight line performance. Times changes things for sure. Look at the numbers, and not to mention, what a great looking cabin. For the price of admission to performance like this, I'm sure GM will have a number of takers don't worry.

Cadillac's are again cool, that is all I have to say. I grew up in a family with Cadillac's and for once I can say it is up to industry standards. The build quality is much improved in this second generation and should vitalize the Cadillac name brand for years to come. They need to work on the XLR and STS V-models since those are getting outdated and the quality on the XLR is sub-par in my opinion.

997, Cadillac has moved forward in leaps and bounds. However, I believe most, if not all, of this success has been based on the CTS.

While the Escalade was a huge hit, it is just a nicer Tahoe/Suburban. And full size SUV sales are anything but good right now. The rest of the line-up is pretty lackluster. The XLR, STS, and SRX are solid products, but sales have been below expectations. The DTS, with its FWD and 4AT, just needs to be retired already.

Cadillac, to be succesful in the future, needs to develop a strong line-up. They just can't rely on the CTS.

its all about lexury from lexus. uncomparible. nothing wrong with lexus being a primarily american company from the start up. it owns every other luxury brand in the united states. its 100 times more prestige than cadillac and 1 million times more prestige than mercedes and will be more prestige than rolls royce maybac and bently.

HSCenterconsole,

It's probably too late (GM should have done this for the 2008 MY), but the DTS should have had the 3.6L direct Inject motor with the 6 speed tranny. Dump the transverse northstar... just cant justify it with regards to HP, Torque, and fuel economy.

Love the CTS though... and I like the few changes GM did with the 2008 STS. However, the STS is long overdue for a makeover. GM needs a DOHC v8 thought... UV8 please....

Not to knock the OHV V8's which GM (and Chrysler) have shown are awesome engines... but in the Cadillac sedans...

XLR needs to be redone or removed too.

shut up jerk............lets see if GM cancels this BS plastic machine in a year. M5 has an Heritage and the CTS-V is still in its crawling stages please save that talk fore a GM Performance website or something. GM could never compete with the germans until they made this plastic body P.O.S that will probably break down if you push it over 3000 rpms

B7Fan, the CTS-V might still be in its crawling stages but it managed to destroy the M5 as easy as you manage to type your crap around here. BTW... In case you weren't aware, BMW doesn't have any car in its lineup to match the performance of the Vette, which has more heritage than most of the BMW brand.

yeah sure thats all GM has and thats all they will ever have .....oh my fault they make some killer trucks thats all they so dont feed me that corvette bullsh*t so idfthats the case BMW got the M3,M5,7,X5,535,a inline 6cylinder engine that GM was in talks with earlier this year to aquire the engine for their cars......oh your stupid a$$ didnt know that did you.....the only heritage GM has is the Corvette and thats it their cars are shit and will always be shit......dont put one car (vette) up against a company that has all types of awards.....name how many years in a row has GM won the International Engine of the year award BMW has 12 and GM has how many oh thats what I thought.

Your an idiot, have you ever driven anything other than a 10 year pickup?

Way to go, Caddy!

Cadillac is one of the few GM marques that no one is considering selling or discontinuing. The CTS and CTS-V are two examples of why this is the case.

It would be fun to see how this car compares to the M5, S6, E63 AMG, etc. The Caddy will have the advantage of lower price and higher horsepower, but will the handling, the interior, the ride quality, etc. match these pricier competitors?

P.S. - I didn't include the upcoming Porsche Panamera in the list of CTS-V competitors because I know neither how much the Panamera will cost nor when it will be put into production?

Oops - I made a typo. I meant "RS6", not "S6".

Sorry about that.

I'm pretty sure the Panamera will be six figures, even for the six-cylinder model. It won't compete with these cars, but more the Maserati Quattroporte, Audi S8, Mercedes S63 and Alpina B7. I don't think it will be up to the level of the Rapide and Estoque.

I'm sure it will steal away some sales, its an awesome ride. But like another poster said, most people who go after the Benz and BMW do it because they have the money to get it and they like to see that emblem on the steering wheel, and not necessarily because of its performance attributes. So for those buyers, the Caddy won't matter regardless of what it brings to the table.

Amazin...
take the blinkers off, NOW.

Yes, the M5 is in a class of it's own...it's seated below the S6. How come the M5 & S6 are always compared...because the C6 RS6 sedan won't even compete with it. The C6 RS6 will smoke it, as will the Caddy.

I absolutely hate you AmazinBimmer. You loose. You're poor.

"audiphile.. please dont utter the underpowered S6 in the same breath as the M5 or E63... idiot!!"

1. Mercedes-Benz E63 AMG
2. Audi S6
3. BMW M5

http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/comparison_test/sedans/2007_audi_s6_vs_bmw_m5_m_b_e63_amg_comparison_test

1. Mercedes-Benz E63 AMG
2. Audi S6
3. BMW M5

http://www.automobilemag.com/reviews/sedans/0607_2007_supersedans/index.html

1. Audi S6
2. BMW M5
3. Mercedes-Benz E63 AMG

http://www.motortrend.com/photo_gallery/112_0702_luxury_sport_sedan_comparison_photo_gallery/index.html

You fail.

This may take 0.5% to 1% m5 sales or maybe none. because ok that car is $60,000 new the year after it will be $40,000 the year after that it will be $25-$30,000 these cars depreciate so fast non one is going to want it or they will trade it in and who knows how this CTS-V will hold up in a couple of years.....BMW has had years of experience doing this so I seriously doubt it will hold any weight next to the M5 sales.

is-f is where its at fools!. this cts is dumb founded and will end up in a ditch because of the poor quality in builds. watch out for the gs-f and lf-a to come out and whop everyones butts.

the e63, m5, rs6, xf-r, n cts-v has nothing on the gs, the best premium car in its segment and the most bang for buck value. mercedes is garbage, bmw is econobox, audi is crap, and jaguar is a poser brand.

the gs-f i tell you. will own!

sounds just like Michael Taylor ??

MichaelTaylor, welcome back.

Can't they just re-ban this tool?

Michael Taylor is back!

Why on earth would you buy the fourth best car in that class?

RS4, M3 & C63 all smoke the ISF in every way.

I have said it before and I will say it again.

The Lexus world domination raign of terror is OVER!

Get over it.

the gs-f was scrapped you idiot was reported on here months ago and the lf-a probably will never come out

Who cares if its faster & cheaper than M5? this car just look so plain.

Are you being sarcastic?

BMW buyers will stay loyal to the brand.
No BMW driver or German car driver would even look at a Cadillac.
The CTS is a small STS with more chrome.
And you're seriously comparing it to the historic M5?

Certainly better than a M5 BMW, but my money would be on a Jaguar XF-R in a few months time!

I too am anxiously awaiting the XF-R. The XF is a beautiful car, and a good performer with its two standard engines. This super-dupercharged engine should really lay down some rubber!

What is wrong with Tata?

It will look nice in black. And its not very degrading to look at like the M5.

First of all who has any articles stating the CTS-V has build issues? Give links below please! I understand that Cadi had issues in the past and that was mainly due to GM cost cutting becuase of the massive amount of $$ it had to pay for retirement benefits and health benefits.

Things have changed and CTS is the best Cadi to come out since its hay day. The bias is hilarious on here but I do agree that BMW M5 and BMW all together should not worry as yet since it takes several generation of worthy cars to make a serious dent.

The CTS-V is here to make a statement, basically to show the World that GM 'CAN' make Luxo autos to compete with the best for Germany. I personally think the CTS has a better interior that the 5 Series and a slight edge on the exterior looks. I also know a new redesigned 5 Series is on its way so I'm staying tuned in.

In this economy, its a no brainer.

I thought you owned BMW outright ?

One thing I will tell you, as others have, you are a clueless fanboy, your fanboy blinkers obliviate the facts in front of your nose, you are a broken record with a serious inferiority complex.

Get a life.

OK. I have an 07 S600 and 05 Corvette with Z51 pkg.
If I didnt already have the 600 then I would no doubt buy this Caddy. Just like when I bought the Corvette everyone I knew said YOUR buying a Vette?? Yes because It outperformed all the previous Porsches and Ferrari's I owned. When I drove off in the new Vette I really felt like I got a bargain. I have never had that feeling before. 3 years later I still love it and its only depreciated $15k. My 600 sadly is down about $60k in 3 years!!! GM maybe had their heads up their...for a long time but they are finally bringing it. Maybe too late??? I would buy this Caddy. I never thought I would say that.

Steve27t, I think you mean "blinders." Horses wear them over their eyes to limit their peripheral vision while pulling a carriage. "Blinkers" is a slang term for turn signals.

Actually the term "blinkers" is used for horses. Google it...

Since I own both a caddy (04 escallade) and an M5 (2008) I will agree with the fact that M5 is in a class by itself, sorry e63 drivers you are faster but nowhere near as fun to drive. As for Caddy its going to take more then 0-60 to get buyers. Until GM gets its head out of its a$$ and realizes that people are not idiots, a mazda, honda and toyota interior will continue 10 heads above anything that comes out of your plastic factory.

I did the "buy american" thing and I can't get rid of the caddy without loosing my shirt, its cheap interior, lack of enjoyment while driving and the fact that it costs 5 gas stations per mile is just enough for me to call it quits on GM.

Another interesting observation is that I see allot of taxi's which used to be mostly Ford and Chevy now transition to Toyota camry...hmmm even the people who look for basic no thrills reliability are moving away from you. if that's not a wake up call for you then try visiting any GM dealership, they are willing to throw in a kidney to sell a car.

Wise up GM, you are a 'has been' and if you are not going to get your execs to go out to dealership lots and really open their eyes to what makes a car good you are simply going to stop existing.

Stop building muscle cars as they only appeal to the baby boomers and they are going away. Its about performance, good interiors and that 'not so soft' driving experience that you are so famous for (in the 50's when it was popular)

Too bad the Audi RS6 spanks the BMW M5 over and over again. It's like a broken record. Time after time after time the BMW M5 gets smacked by Audi's RS6 behemoth.

you keep telling yourself that... idiot...

keep denying the truth AmazinMoron. Your smokescren of lies is only that. It is your psychologically troubled mind playing games with you.

Now look at reality AmazinMoron.....

http://www.autobild.de/artikel/vier-sportliche-kombis_672261.html

Like I said all day, all day the M5 gets crushed by Audi's superior RS6.

maybe cz the RS6 has 100hp more, and the M5 is 3 years old, ever thought of that?

Speedoholic - the last generation rs6 vs. the last generation m5 had the same results.

Speedoholic, the E60 (5) platform is only a year older than the C6 (RS6) platform.

i would vote for that

awesome performance deal

My father's girlfriend has the CTS with the AWD and DI 3.6 and that car is no sluff performance wise. To package that look with this much horsepower and to keep the price in the "reasonable" range is fantastic. You can throw around all the comparisons you want but for those that want it, this CTS-V will bring many smiles to their miles.

Can I order it with a class 5 towing package?

Or a used AWD luxury sedan.

Three points:

#1. "The all-new 2009 Cadillac CTS-V will be priced from $59,995 (€44,700 with the current exchange rates) in the US market seriously undercutting the less powerful though quite possibly a bit more rewarding from a driver's point of view, 507HP BMW M5 which costs in the States $85,100 (€63,500)."

Wow. Did you really put all of that into one sentence with only one comma? The Internet has surely killed grammar in "professional" writing.

#2. I can't believe amazinbimmer actually posted several replies without directly bagging on American build quality or panel gaps. Have you actually driven a CTS now? Good job, keep on the path to enlightenment, Grasshopper.

#3. No one or two (or three?) generations of any car is going to unseat a global powerhouse brand like BMW and the M series with the majority of consumers. But, keeping the comparison between Cadillac and BMW, history shows that just becuase one is currently the standard of the world does not mean that one will always be.

Little by little, Caddy and others are chipping away at BMW, and my opinion is that BMW, as a brand, seems to have an untouchable aura about them, while others do their chipping.

Forget the "three years later" crap in the CTS-V vs. M5 argument. The new M5 took 3 years to remodel and outrun the first CTS-V (and the M3 is handily included wherever the M5 is mentioned...I know firsthand which was faster, and it has no M in its name). Timing cycles of product releases can't all occur the same year (thank god for us!).

The M or AMG or RS or ??? WERE the fastest sedans out there, now the CTS-V is, like it or not.

Still awaiting the 2-door version,
TYVM

Web magazine Winding Road, not exactly a fan of most American sedans, put out a glowing review of the new V. They thought, correctly, that the old model was crude, and more hot rod that performance luxury sedan. They had nothing but praise for the new model, and called it the best American sedan ever. They implied that it was not only a better value, but a straight up equal to anything from Europe or Japan. To say they were shocked is an understatement.

The M5 (e60) series cars on on their last year, its no surprise that other auto companies after 4 model years are offering a model to compete or beat the M5.
I think its cool that GM has stepped up to offer us a lux/preform, auto for way less money than Merc or BMW.
Why knock the Germans, they set the benchmark for all to chase?