LA Times Writer 'HAMMERS' Design Of New Lexus HS250h Sedan

My God, he nailed it.

and you're a bigot.

who CARES what he thinks. it's a hybrid. it's a lexus. and it's priced close to their entry level models. people will buy it.

the ONLY question is whether the buyers will come in droves, or just a trickle.

In addition to many, many other car brands, I have been a long time fan of Lexus.

And yeah, I get excited by them from time to time.

Really wish people would understand that being a car enthusiast means you can appreciate all cars, not just the ones that have a prancing bull or horse on the hood.

I don't like how L-finesse is grafted onto the Prius squat platform. The interior is embarrassingly downscale. I'd rather much see an Lf-Ch sedan concept.

He's right. The thing looks like a gussed up Corolla, and that is a pretty lumpy canvas to begin with.

Toyota and Lexus both have gone to a really schlumpy, uninspired and frankly dumbed-down styling theme in the past 2-3 years. It's just like they take a car design and apply a photoshop filter to it, and it becomes the next new thing. No art, no soul, and seemingly no thought to it whatsoever.

This car is as embarrassing to Lexus as the Cimmaron has been to Cadillac.

Man, I truly love when arrogant prick writers think they can force thier opinion on everyone. (almost as bad as the autospies fanboy community)

Dude, if you don't like it, don't friggin' buy it. It really is that simple.

You should at least respect this thing for not being your personal "style" which means everyone won't be driving the same car as you.

Imagine how crappy that would be.

PS - The grille is simply a design theme Lexus first used on their first "L-Finesse" concept car which any jackass with a clue knows predates the Fusion by several years.

he's an automotive journalist. it's his JOB to review cars. he is sharing his OPINION. just so happens that many, many people agree with him.

very amusing.

True, though he is lacking in knowledge and not very skilled at his craft, it is his job.

But his comments speak more to the antiquated and asinine belief that a car is only a success if it has a great track time and makes your heart skip a beat when you look at it.

It's like saying your Blu Ray player is a crappy subwoffer. The HS was never designed to be what his "opinion" is suggesting. Thus he can't logically knock it for those qualities.

Seems like the author and most folks at autospies can't see how you can admire both a Ferrari and a Prius, albeit for different reasons.

Right, so everyone should stop talking becasue sharing a thoughtful opinion is 'forcing their opinion on everyone'. That is one of the more ridiculous and bitter little comments I've heard in awhile. In fact, it's an arrogant opinion that you shouldn't have the right to force on people, answer. [sarcasm]

If you don't like the comments of people then click to a new page. It is really that simple.

FORD INTERCEPTOR CONCEPT came out with that grill years ago, (and it looks a million times better on the original)

Wow, you people really don't know what or who you talking about. Dan Neil is one of the most respected automotive journalist of our time. He has been a contributing editor for; Autoweek, Car and Driver, The New York Times, and is currently on staff the LA Times.

Neil also won the Ken Purdy Award for Excellence in Automotive Journalism, from the International Motor Press Association, 2001. His work was selected for Houghton Mifflin's Best American Sports Writing, 2002. Oh and by the way Neil won the Pulitzer Prize for Criticism in 2004 In awarding Mr. Neil, the Pulitzer board praised his "one-of-a-kind reviews of automobiles, blending technical expertise with offbeat humor and astute cultural criticism".

Mr. Neil will probably drive more cars in a year than you will in a life time.

sounds like stalin is answer's hero. anyone who voices an opinion should be sent to the gulag.

Not at all.

Just like to remind the German-only-fanboy-crew that it's totally fine not to like Lexus, but to keep crapping on them for illogical reasons is silly.

So you don't like the design. Big f'n deal.

I've been coming to autospies.com since 2002 or so, and I've always been frustrated with the "Lexus sucks" being an acceptable mantra of the fanboy community here.

I don't give a rat's ass what the author of this story has done or will do in the past. Complaining about something not being what it was never intended to be is completely silly.

Now, if the guy's intention was to write a purely comical piece that would be one thing. But even then the writer fell short of his goal.

As always, I just feel a need to be a voice of reason here. I apologize if that upsets your world view that people should only swoon over cars from Europe.

PS- I own both a Benz and a Lexus currently, so those wanting to kiss my ass may pucker up.....now.

— enthusiastx11:

> he's an automotive journalist. it's his JOB to review cars.
> he is sharing his OPINION.

The job of an automotive journalist is to perform an unbiased, scientific, repeatable test of a vehicle in question.

To do this, one needs to possess in depth automotive knowledge and fairly expensive measurement equipment.

Dan Neil has neither of these. So he's forced to lower himself to lame, frustrated and poor marketing effort to promote or depreciate given brand/model, depending on who's paying. You can see his lack of competence when he's copy/pasting the car brochure, unable to explain what technical terms actually mean.

In his other columns, he's performing CHEAPO journalism by trying to create a negative connotation with hybrids and present diesel as "efficient". Sadly, the poor, uneducated clown does not know that independent EPA tests proved Prius and Lexus RX450h are ~70% more efficient than equivalent diesel vehicles.


> just so happens that many, many people agree with him.

Apparently not those who have money and actually buy cars.


— answer:

> Complaining about something not being what it was never
> intended to be is completely silly.

If you start to feel the crushing power of XXI Century Asia, frustrated last stand blunt marketing is all what's left for you.


> As always, I just feel a need to be a voice of reason here.
> I apologize if that upsets your world view that people should
> only swoon over cars from Europe.

Cars from Europe? Cars from Europe went down the shitter long time ago.

Renualt? Consecutive losses over last years, no one knows them outside EU.
PSA Citroen/Peugeot? Same as above.
FIAT? Close to bankruptcy, heavily subsided by Italian socialists government
Volvo? On sale to China
Jaguar? Range Rover? Sold to Indians.
Rover? Bust.

Only Volkswagen AG really matters. BMW and MB as premium brands sell too little to sustain. That's where so many rumors about their joint-venture come out.

You folks amaze me, just because he dislike your favortie product he is a "the poor, uneducated clown". When you rip on Dan Neil it just shows how out of touch you are with automitive world. Dan has has some reviews that I could have slugged him in the face for, but I never have resulted in childish, fictious, temper tantrums.

Dan Neil received a B.A. degree in Creative Writing from East Carolina University and an M.A. degree in English Literature from North Carolina State University.

Everyone's favorite, George Bush, has an MBA from Harvard.

Ted Bundy had a Psychology degree.

A person's resume doesn't equate to being "good" at what they do.

— theoptimisticpessimist

> You folks amaze me, just because he dislike your
> favortie product

HS250h is anything but my favorite product.


> he is a "the poor, uneducated clown".

Read the article. Zero facts. Zero research. Zero tests. 40% brochure quoting. 60% hatred biased (=sponsored) opinion.

Everyone is entitled to her/his own opinion so why should the one from someone else be significantly relevant? These are facts and testing results that matter and they bring up anything new to our knowledge, enriching it.


> When you rip on Dan Neil it just shows how out of touch
> you are with automotive world.

See above. No professional reviewer would fart out such lame piece of editorial. Only low end marketers would.

Then I wasted my time reading another articles from this dope.

http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-ct-neil1-2009sep01,0,4467832.column
http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-neil18-2009sep18,0,820738.column

1. Mostly narrative brochure quoting. Zero technical insight, explanations of technical aspects of the problem.
2. He fails to clarify why there are no diesel hybrids. Cost is just one issue (there are at least two another just as significant).
3. He desperately tries to paint the Prius bad by comparing it to:
- a car that does not exist thus cannot be purchased (BMW concept)
- a diesel moped with roof (for some unknown reasons called "a car")
4. He lies to the American customer, by saying diesels are 25-40% more efficient than gassers.

Energy impact score (expressed as barrels of crude for 15k miles)
- VW Jetta TDI diesel: 11,6 barrels
- Honda Civic 1.8: 11,8 barrels (only 1,7% less efficient, not 25-40%)

- Mercedes ML 320 BlueTEC diesel: 18,8 barrels
- Lexus RX350 ordinary gasser: 17,1 barrels

In this case, the diesel is LESS efficient than ordinary gasoline equivalent, with the hybrid version playing in another league.

Saying what Neil said in the quoted articles is a simple thing: a SCAM.


> Dan Neil received a B.A. degree in Creative Writing
> from East Carolina University and an M.A. degree in
> English Literature from North Carolina State University.

So he has every qualification not to understand what's under the bonnet and why. That's why he desperately ties to "research" the "soul" and "character" of a car. These are undefined terms that are subject of speculation. He feels safe by sticking to such things as any sort of shit can be written and will be accepted.

You don't let humanist people to design and build cars so why oh why should you let them review and test them? It will result in shit, like seen in the exemplary article above.

downtoearth:

"The job of an automotive journalist is to perform an unbiased, scientific, repeatable test of a vehicle in question."

REALLY? cars are about passion, design, feel, experience. none of those are scientifically explained....especially design.

and this HS, my friend, is no example of good design.

downtoearth and answer are the rational people here.

the knee-jerk hybrid/toyota/lexus haters are not.

regardless of credentials, any writer can now and then slip and LET HIS BIASES DISTORT a rational analysis. (aside from the possibility of being on the take from advertisers/competing brands.) case in point: robert cumberford of Automobile magazine.

when the LS600 first came out, he did a persnickety 'design analysis' of its styling. later he did a review article on the same car. i expected another slam, but to his credit, he did a relatively objective piece.

either 1) he could not ignore the inherent excellent and innovative engineering, or 2) the editor bosses would not allow him to vent personal biases again.

spot on.

my favorite line...."just stop the boring." lol

Congratulations you're wrong again!

From the Toyota Press Room

"The HS 250h is based on the European Toyota Avensis platform and uses a 2.4-liter four-cylinder gasoline engine compared to the Prius, which is on another design platform and uses a 1.8-liter engine. The hybrid transmission, motor generators and electronic control systems are also different."

http://pressroom.toyota.com/pr/tms/our-point-of-view.aspx?t=15601

congrats! you've contradicted yourself again!

"Without the HS, hybrid sales would've gone down." exactly.

Damn.

Sounds like you feel a need to show everyone how "manly" you are.

See I like cars for what they do for me, not for impressing people who will only see me for a split second on the road.

That's why I have found enjoyment in all the cars I've owned. Whether it was my 1997 SC400, 1993 BMW 850csi, or my problem-prone X-Type R (to name a few), they have all made ME happy.

"Just make the boring stop"

Classic!! Where are the lexus fans now?

I don't know why anyone is expecting an entry-level Lexus hybrid to be as beautiful as an Aston Martin in the first place. Oh wait, because everyone here is STUPID! (Yes I sound childish, just like all of you.)

I am sick of Dan Neil and his arrogant opinions. Who cares what he thinks?

I thought that we were talking about the design of the Lexus HS250h? Why bring up the LF-A?

you're referring, i presume, to the person who felt a NEED to mention his porsche? because no one OWNS two or even ONE LF-A yet.

i have driven my brother's (admittedly much used ) porsche. except for the stling and SOUND of the engine, i was not impressed at all.

this will sound like heresy (especially on THIS site), but i actually enjoyed my other brother's camry MORE. at least that car did NOT STRAND me now and then with a fussy engine.

yet more enjoyable was the rwd nissan 2.4 i owned then.

...styling...

I live in LA and that is the most sense the LA Times has made in years.

They really f'ed up this design