Toyota recall widens

Prius = Death trap! =) I doubt this will slow Prius sales. Too many people are dupped into the hybrid marketing ploy. I think the engineers were trying to save weight and perhaps saved a little too much and compromised the strength in the shaft. I guess Japan underestimated the strength of Americans....lol.

Another blow to the "Reliability Icon"...

The sky is falling! Oh no that is just just parts falling off the Prius.

Oh wait....they admitted it!

NHTSA did not force Toyota, you are correct, however Japan's equivalant to NHTSA did tell them to do so and so they complied to investigate it.... It just so happened the found out it included the American Prius so Toyota went ahead and announced it, NHSTA would have figured it out sooner or later had Japan not done so first. Toyota is still a good product, but this just shows that maybe Toyota is getting too big for its britches.... Maybe selling as many as the big three also entails the same kind of problems the big three face.... Maybe Toyota should chill out some and stop trying to so quickly expand.... My friend has a new Camry ('07 model) and the transmission is already screwing up!! Fewer than 5K miles on it. My friend bought a new Civic and its power window on the driver side has already crapped out.... I have a MINI Cooper and have not had one issue yet....But JD Power and Consumer Digest say my car has all kinds of issues.... Strange mine has not suffered, yet those best buys my friends bought sure have had them! Explain that one to me! As long as a car has a warranty and everything is covered and I get a loaner car I am fine....I would much rather have my fun to drive daily driver any day over those "reliable" other vehicles....

Well the bigger you get, the harder it is to maintain focus. Name a LARGE maker that doesn't have issues. There aren't any.

Honda keeps it in line relatively by making a simpler car mechanically. Toyotas are not quite as simple leaving themselves more open to failure. All things given the less complex the vehicle the less there is to go wrong. (Tell that to us German car aficionados.)

Toyota is starting to realize if you try to make a complex vehicle (read that as more sophisticated). Your QA levels must be exponentially higher to maintain the same level of reliability.

Let me give it to you this way. It is a well known manufacturing fact that the last millimeter of your tolerance will consume about 40% of your budget in manufacturing. The more parts, or tighter tolerances the higher the budget. Honda lowers the parts count and lowers their risk. Toyota is rising in parts count as focus towards the Europeans drives it. They are in the process of figuring out it isn’t as easy as it looks. They have announced major increases in budget for QA to get it back on track and this is only one example.

Raising the QA tolerances is expensive, lowering the parts count can hurt the sophistication level.

So

Where do you cut costs to make a fatter bottom end for your stockholders? Obviously not in the front end of a Toyota for sure.

Glad to see you back, we missed you. How was the Betty Ford Clinic? I hear the weekend packages ar really good.

The jury is still out on JD Powers I agree but the AutoPacific ones are out now and Lexus/Toyota is not in their corner anymore.

I bet they were bribed!

Big deal, at least Toyota admit their mistake and correct not Hide It like GM and Mitsubitsi did. What about two months ago when several of the New Cadillac SRX owner got injury during a normal drive on the Freeway when their Glass Roof came off or Flew off. What about last month when GM Recall About Half a Million vechicles of their own. Anyway it was due to a faulty part not Engineering problem. Yep..that what happen you Become the Biggest Auto Manufactured in the Worlds and Banking in the Green $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$People Hate you.

Lexus

I don't see anywhere that Toyota admitted the defect.

GM is recalling 30,000 2005-2006 covettes due to roof problem, mike flew off when driving.Plano_A4 Toyota admit it in sense that they recall their vechicle back before an accident. Like I says all long all auto manfactured has problem a little or alot. But the main thing is that they recall the vechicle and correct it.

I would rather drive a Toyota or other Japanese brand anyday than buying a New Cadillac SRX or Covettes or any GM brand in general. You know why? because their Roof Flew OFF the car when the Owner of the SRX drive down the Freeway. Don't belief do a search and find out. Two month ago, brand new Cadillac SRX owner was injury because during a drive through the Free Their Roof Flew OFF, what the Shit? and it happen to many of the SRX owner, I guess they should've got a Toyota or Honda instead. And today GM recall more than 30,000 Covette because their Roof Flew of too. Two months ago GM recall Half Million Vechicles, what with that bro?

Lexus

Hey, thanks for at least noticing that I do try to be objective some of the time. Just overlook my indulgence when it comes to picking on you guys on this issue. Too many of you Toyota/Lexus guys focus entirely on the reliability factor. So much so, they forget the own a pretty darn good car. So when something this big comes along is is a tempting target. I know you would be the first there when you hear of a recall of mine (trust me I know). I think I have got it out of my system for now. (maybe not)

The sad thing is I see Toyota falling victim to the same issues that plauges the big three. A bit sad and ironic. Toyota can literally rewrite the history book if they can keep the eye off of the bottom line and more on the product. I have issues with many of their products, but I always have said two things. Typically they are solid reliable cars, and they know their target audience. But they still are not my cup of tea. Maybe I am a glutten for punishment.

Well off to the BMW section I have a small war going on there I need to tend to. Don't think you guys are the only ones out there I tangle up with.

I could have sworn it was you at the Betty Ford Clinic strapped to that gurney. I was there visiting your pal Ben. BTW if you visit there again try the soy flax smoothie. Not much to taste but boy the toxins get flushed out in a hurry.

My first ride in a vette was in the 80's we hit a bump going about 80 and the T-Top launched on my side and went into orbit. Nice to see somethings never change.. Ahh the memories...

Calm Down LJ, the only reason why I brought that up is because everyone here make a big deal about it. Like I say every auto company has problem, I brought up because I want to make my point. LJ, the funny about there is nothing can do about Bubba. I can write anything I want regarding my opinion on car or their company.

By the way LJ, at least I know when I drove my Lexus IS350 down the Freeway, my Roof is Not going Flew OFF my cAr. If you want to talk about crappy engineer that in the GM section bro, pathetic. I know alot BMW and MB fantic does not Like Toyota or Lexus but they and everyone know the fact that Toyota has better engineer than GM for sure.

Toyota boys never seem to amaze me. I can't believe you are even comparing this to any other recall. It's plain pathetic. I thought about this many times in the past especially since the greatest driver ever was killed because of a faulty steering shaft. All the driving skills of the world won't save you if you lose your steering.

I wouldn't expect this from a homemade go-kart, much less from the world's biggest auto manufacturer.

This is a VERY DANGEROUS and EMBARASSING recall. STOP trying to make an excuse for it. It's PATHETIC.

With Toyota having more and more recalls recently. I can only believe this sloppiness has migrated into the Lexus family. Expect recalls from Lexus in the near future. If my memory services me right, the Toyota Executives issued a statement about two month ago that stated Toyota/Lexus Corp. was very concerned about their current reliability due to their rapid expansion. Does any one remember this statement?

This is exactly what I predicted. If Lexus ever manages to expand to the level of MB with so many models and engines their reliability will be on par with a Yugo.

If you can't stand the heat get out of the kitchen. I can't wait for Lexus to match MB with 15-20 models worldwide and numerous engines. I'm afraid steering wheels won't be the only thing falling apart....LOL

Good luck with your DEATH TRAPS!!!

Sit down before you read the rest of this.

I agree with you on GM and Toyota.

GM cranks em out with no concern if the market is over saturated or if they all look the same. Why have the same SUV with 4 different badges?
If you share platforms from within PLEASE make them at least look different.

Toyota approach is a very solid and is exactly what you would like to see.. Text book perfect.


Imagine what Toyota would do if they aquired GM?

All of the sudden it would all go under one banner and all of the shared models would become one probably. reduce those redundant costs and since you have a fresh start wax the union. Then revamp the whole process and improve quality.

I really think GM has to take a dive to survive. How else can they get out of the legacy cost of health care? It burns me up the UAW thought the idea of paying of any healthcare was inconceivable. Over 95% of the workers in the US pay for some of these costs. To have GM pay for these costs 100% is a great idea, but as it shows is not practical and the costs too much.

Lets see:

I can go into debt getting through college, go to work as a professor or in a white-collar job bust my butt and make $80K and after 10 years and pay off all of my tuition loans. Then save for my retirement invest, reinvest, and reallocate for the next 20 years to shoot for retirement. All of the time paying my insurance premiums and associated co pays for decades.

OR

I can barely complete high sKool. Work for GM screwing in 4 bolts on a car seat on a line and make $80K a year after 5 yeas through UAW guaranteed raises. Pay zero healthcare costs, and get a full pension with zero healthcare cost to boot for the rest of my life. Oh yes If I ever get laid off I still get paid from the job bank, but hey I can play checkers at the Union Hall, until I get called back to work. Never miss a beat.

What a deal, they have. Makes you wish the rest of the world was like that.

I have to go by JD Power since this is the only rubbish you guys believe in. It's rubbish because they never mention severity of problems. On top of that they are biased. I read somewhere about a guy that had constant problems with his Lexus and JD Power called him and asked to give them full details and what was done to correct the problems.

If you want to look at Toyota and Lexus as a whole maybe you should combine their problems as well and get back to me.
Like I said when Lexus matches MB with # of models and engines then we can compare.

Your beloved company doesn't even know how to design a steering shaft. Maybe they should hire engineers from Yugo. At least their steering shafts never broke. I honestly can't think of anything worse to happen to a car while you're driving. Maybe an exploding car or the wheels flying off at 80mph. Let's see if the boneheads at Toyota can outdo themselves with the next big recall.

The only problem with your logic is that MBs are 100 times more complicated than an average Toyota. I had a Toyota Tacoma, so don't even try to dispute it. Manual seats, manual windows, not even a digital clock...I'm surprised they have any problems at all.

I went through 2 evaporators, a steering rack, a differential, tie rods, lower ball joints, and even the manual transmission started to give me problems before I sold it. All this under 60k miles. Those components were basically the whole truck.

You ever heard of a brake bypass system and EMERGENCY BRAKES (2 backup systems).
It doesn't take much for any hydraulic system to fail. A leaky seal will do the job. Why do you think every car has E brakes?

Toyota engineers better start working on an Emergency steering system with cables, just in case the STEEL SHAFT brakes in half. What a bunch of IDIOTS.

If they were at least trying something new like steer-by-wire I could understand. But a conventional steering shaft that has been in existence for over a century.
They should receive a BONEHEAD RECALL OF THE CENTURY AWARD for that one.

I'm not even going to discuss this further with you because it will never end. When Lexus has the same number of models as MB we can talk.

As for the recall, I don't think Toyota is stupid enough to ignore a ticking bomb. Sooner or later people will start dying and they will be forced to make the recall. Stop trying to sugar coat it. There is no excuse for this bonehead recall.

I wouldn't point fingers at Chrysler and their oil leaks. Ever heard of the Toyota V6 engine recall. They had to replace entire engines.

I know exactly what you were talking about on the E.
It was a revolutionary new brake system that had not one but two backup systems. The recall involved a small metal bracket a ground wire and new software.

None of this can be compared to a steering shaft braking in half at highway speed. It's a good thing Prius owners drive like snails. Who knows how many people would have been dead already?

I can see you have no idea what you are talking about. You just come here a defend anything Toyota. Even a big screw up like this. Maybe we should recall all cars. Do you even know how easy it is for any car to lose brakes? I had two complete brake failures in a Pontiac when I was a teenager.

I would rather have a brake failure with good E brakes than steering failure at highway speed.

You would have to be an idiot not to see the difference.

Google Toyota V6 recall. You might be surprised at all the problems they had with blown head gaskets, engine failures, etc. My friend is a Toyota tech. During the recall he was changing 2-3 engines per day.

According to your logic only performance cars should be on the road. Do you even know the difference in braking distance when you drive a large SUV or truck and a normal car? It's a lot more than 10ft.

I guarantee that an E class with the bypass system will have a much shorter stopping distance than 90% of the cars on the road. Otherwise the bypass system wouldn't even exist, it would just have E brakes.

You're not defending?

You and your friends keep bringing up recalls from other manufactures to cover up this DISASTER from Toyota. Read the post from the beginning.

The whole point I was trying to make with the brakes is that the bypass system will brake better than the majority of vehicles on the road. It's basically like having conventional brakes without the booster. Unless you have the strength of a 5 year old kid you should not have problems stopping.

If you do a search on Toyota V6 problems and head gasket recalls there is a ton of information. The 89-98 Toyota V6 engines are very problematic. There are people that changed head gasket 4-5 times and still have problems.

http://www.yotarepair.com/breakingnews.html

http://www.toyota-4runner.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=381

"I have a '95 Tacoma with a V6. The head gaket blew and I need a new engine. Even though there was a recall on those gaskets, my dealer
does not want to pay for it. They say the damage was caused because the cooling system was not maintained properly. Has anyone else had a
problem like this and did Toyota pay for it?
Also, they seem to have lost the head gasket in question. Any mechanic out there know if I have a case against them on that?
Thanks"

Where exactly did I defend the brake problem? I simply said it shouldn't be compared to this DISASTEROUS RECALL. You're the one that brought it up because you couldn't stand negative comments about the Toyota recall.

I know it's hard for you, but you need to face reality. A small bracket and software update on a brake system is nothing compared to a steering shaft braking in half and leaving the driver with ZERO steering.

Which part of YOU DON'T LOSE BRAKES EVEN IF THERE IS AN ELECTRICAL FAULT DON'T YOU UNDERSTAND?

Do you even understand how the brake bypass system works?

As far as I know no auto manufacturer has a backup system for mechanical steering. Why? Because nobody other then Toyota is stupid enough to make a steering shaft that can brake in half.

On the other hand every auto manufacturer has E brakes. Think about what you're defending before you open up your mouth again. With each post you sound more and more like JT.

What's your point?

It's exactly what I've been saying. The bakes are still there they just require more force from the driver, since the system doesn't use a brake booster.
On top of the bypass system the car has E brakes as well, so you can apply both if there is a malfunction.

What exactly are you going to do when you steering shaft brakes?

Do you know how the great Senna died?

In that case maybe we should just get rid of E brakes on all cars? You are a genius. You should go work for Toyota.

THE GREATEST DRIVER IN THE WORLD HAD BRAKES, BUT HE DIDN'T HAVE ANY STEERING. Guess what? He died. If it were the other way around he would still be racing today.

The worst part about this whole thing is that MB's problem can't even be compared to this crap from Toyota. THE BRAKES DO NOT FAIL. It's similar to shutting of your engine and trying to stop. It requires more force, but they do work and I'm pretty sure they work better in the bypass mode than most cars in normal mode.

But if it makes you feel better keep bringing up other recalls. It won't change a thing.

Toyota set the bar really high with this recall. It will be hard to outdo. Maybe when chimps start building cars.

Damn...I'm having a discussion with a person that doesn't even know how to read.

If you don't follow F1 you shouldn't have questioned me. Senna's fatal blow was caused by the suspension AT IMPACT, but he had no control of his car when he hit the barrier. There are video images of him trying to correct the car with zero effect.
The GREATEST driver in the world does not just lose the car. He had a mechanical problem, which was caused by a modified steering shaft.

Keep defending steering shafts that brake in half. You are doing a great job.

Whatever you say buddy. Maybe in Toyota land the E is on the same level as a Corolla and Prius. I couldn't even imagine a Yugo having a faulty steering shaft.

Toyota can't even build a reliable STEEL steering shaft. Can you imagine if they start producing steer-by-wire? LOL

Are you going to be the first guinea pig in line for that one?

Just because nobody died doesn't mean it's not one of the worst recalls in the history of the automotive industry.

There was a recall once for RR that involved a fire/explosion during a gas fill up. Not sure if anybody got injured, but it definitely ranks at the top with this steering shaft.

Stop twisting Senna's death. He did not die in a Prius. The example was brought up to show that a car without control (broken steering shaft) is one of the worst things that could happen to a driver.

What door handle are you talking about?

Funny you should mention door handles. The only cars that I see on a daily basis with broken exterior door handles are the usual Jap crap.

If you want I can take a picture of my neighbor's Camry. All three of the four exterior door handles are broken. I'm pretty sure that all four broke, but he had to replace at least one so he could get in his car. I'm talking about the 93-96 Camry.

BTW here is some food for thought, did you know that a lot of MBs can be lifted by the door handle (the whole car)? I'm not sure if they are still doing that, but you can definitely lift the older models (up to 95).

Another genius statement from you. Maybe you should tell all drivers that steering is overrated. Just let go of it and let the car straighten itself..."auto pilot mode". That is the funniest thing I ever heard.
Do me a favor next time you enter a highway on a roundabout at 30-50mph let go of the steering wheel half way through. If you survive come back a tell us all about your experience...lol

Life doesn't work like that. Just because nobody got hurt doesn't mean the problem is insignificant.

Keep playing Russian roulette with your steering wheel. What kind of drugs are you on?
Maybe you can open a new driving school where you can teach everyone about your new technique. Let go of the steering wheel when exiting a corner. Or maybe you can present your new idea to Toyota, so they can build a steering shaft with a clutch that disengages every time you’re about to exit a corner.

You really want the picture of the Camry with the broken door handles? I’ll try to take a picture tomorrow.

I sure won't forget the recall. Toyota is the first manufacturer that managed to build a MAJOR MECHANICAL driving component that brakes in half.