Federal Regulars May Tweak EPA Rules To Help Diesel Automakers

So I see you didn't take the time to read the article.

Studies that I have heard of, have said that the production process and immense amount of minerals needed for batteries are in fact dirtier than gasoline and diesel engines. SO, before anyone goes making policies about anything, it might be nice to get to the bottom of this before supporting any specific technology. We cannot always just jump on the product/policies with short term gain. Look at global climate change, it's happening and it's because of short term gain type choices.

And studies that I have heard of say the opposite of your studies:

http://pubs.acs.org/doi/full/10.1021/es903729a

http://www.empa.ch/plugin/template/empa/3/99149/

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2010/08/100830120945.htm

Which one of us has a better hearing do you think? We may need another study :p

Thank you for your links, vdiv. I always appreciate them and find them helpful.

"SO, before anyone goes making policies about anything, it might be nice to get to the bottom of this before supporting any specific technology."

Problem is, CarCrazedinCali, that the oil industry has LONG enjoyed policy support. Perhaps we can remove it, give it to the battery/clean-electric folks and then call it a level playing field in about 60 years?

I think it's a mistake for the car companies like BMW to ignore diesel. Coupled with efficient multi-gear transmissions, catalytic converters, and particulate filters diesels have a lot to offer. Not to mention running on cleaner-burning biodiesel.

Oil industry get HUGE subsidies, STILL. It's unbelievable. If the U.S. can cut those freebies and just let oil prices rise, people will turn to better alternatives. Obviously, diesels for commercial trucking is a different matter, and I would rather directly subsidize trucking than the petroleum industry.

In CA when gas prices were $4.25, traffic was better, people took buses and carpooled, it was awesome.

It should be the bottom line, what is cleaner and more efficient, hybrids require batteries and minerals that are not that great on the environment...so what is cleaner? Did everyone hear that Obama wants transport trucks to convert to natural gas, can you imagine how big the gas tanks will have to be, how about the dangers they would be in the event of an accident.

The cleanliness of electric cars depends a lot on how the electricity is produced. In a country where most of it comes from coal, I seriously doubt they are cleaner than latest generation diesels (which we still do not get in the US). The technology for electric and plug-in hybrid cars has made great advances, but it is still not at the point to be able to replace the IC engines, but today you could easily replace all of the V8 engine in pick-up and work truck with smaller V6 Turbo-Diesel engines with great benefits in terms of mpg and emissions.

It is easier to clean the emissions of a coal power plant located somewhere remotely (clean-burning boilers, particulate filters, carbon sequestration) than the emissions of thousands of vehicles driving around where people habituate. Coal-fired plants can be and are being converted to much cleaner natural gas-burning ones.

Parts of the country do not even have coal power plants and rely more heavily of nuclear, hydro, oil and gas stations.

The electric car itself has no emissions and can use electricity produced from any source. EV owners often choose a green electricity provider or use their own renewable sources if available. The task of cleaning the emissions of power plants is independent from how we use the produced electricity, it has to be done regardless.

There is not going to be a point at which EVs will replace ICEV. EVs are getting better and are increasingly meeting people's needs, but in the mean time we can improve the gasoline and diesel engines. Considering the astronomic political and economic resistance the transition to EVs has been and will continue to be a long one.

I read somewhere that coal power plants emit more radiation then nuclear power plants.

The more you know! *star*

That said, I often wonder if the efficiency of coals chemical energy being converted to thermal, then to kinetic, then induced to electric, then to chemical in a battery, then to electric, then to kinetic is any more efficient then just chemical>thermal>kinetic

You left how much of the energy is lost in the long transmission lines. And yet electricity is still cheaper source of energy than gasoline.

If IC engines are more efficient then we should have all of our kinetic appliances at home powered by them, coffee grinders, vacuum cleaners, washer machines, garage door openers, air conditioners and fans. That will be a racket...

It comes to show you how inefficient IC engines are at converting energy and in a way how much potential there is to improve them.

I disagree, most of our appliances at home are not battery powered, and thus cut out a few conversions/inefficiencies. Further, if you look at things that aren't directly plugged into the wall you'll notice that many of them are powered by ic engines, i.e. lawn mowers, weed whippers, chain saws... there are electric alternatives to all of these on the market, but electric versions tend to be heavy or underpowered, or lacking mobility (i.e. extension cords needed)

Li-ion battery charge/discharge efficiency is close to 100% depending on the specific electrode chemistry and charge/discharge regimes. NiMH batteries are at about 90%, NiCd are at about 80%.

http://www.pluginhighway.ca/PHEV2007/proceedings/PluginHwy_PHEV2007_PaperReviewed_Valoen.pdf

The electric lawn care devices are usually lighter and require less maintenance, but are less powerful than their gas-powered brethren. I was talking about motorized devices inside the house.

Can you tell me what motorized devices are in the house that have batteries? I'd especially be interested in anything with 0.5hp or more that isn't plugged in.

Why 0.5hp or more? I have a Dyson cordless vac that may be close.

Your cordless vacuum has 62% less power then the average vacuum lol! It may use the power it does have more efficiently, but that has nothing to help you support your argument.

Why has no-one made a diesel electric hybid. the VW Jetta would have far better gas mileage if they used to 2.0 tdi in the hybrid instead of the 5 cyl. In fact a smaler 1.8 diesel with that hybrid drive train would still smoke a prius and get as good or better gas mileage while being much more fun to drive.

I bet the oil companies wouldn't want any company to make anything too efficient, efficiency is bad for business and tax collection is where our governments would agree with the oil companies, just my conspiracy theories.