Luxury Redefined: Have The Top Tier Brands Sold Out To Market Share?

Hey "zoomy"..err "angryinch"... err or is it "Mitch"? Better behave this time or you will be gone like the wind.

I would agree partially 009. The big 3 German makes are definitely trying to gain market share with their expansion into the lower price levels. I would not agree on the "sold out" implication/wording that you choose to use. Even their entry level incorporate new technology (even if those do come from their more expensive models), quality, and a sense of lineage from the top down. The Asian car makers tend to emphasize the characteristics from their less expensive models up, i.e. feature-laden for the buck, low repair cost, and there seems to be a lack of cohesiveness in terms of exterior design. Just my two cents.

YES ..Definitely Yes...one upon a time When MB Was a real Luxury Brand, BMW a real Sport car and AUDI an experiment of VW...now everything is Money...So if they needs sale their dreams to stay alive...they will.

Audi an experiment of VW?? VW was founded by Ferdinand Porsche
in 1937. Audi was making cars in Zwickau Germany since 1910.
This is Autospies though; so misinformation is boosted.

....enjoy

"AUDI an experiment of VW"?
Perhaps Bentley, Bugatti, Lamborghini and Porsche are also experiments of VW?

no, they have not 'sold out.' they are adapting to market realities. due to CAFE requirements, no manufacturer can remain a solely high-end brand with cars that get below-average fuel economy. this broadening of luxury makers product lines is a response to US government policy more than anything else.

Haha.

"Then there are the upstarts. Hyundai and Kia are introducing more premium vehicles without creating a separate luxury brand."

Yeah, they just remove their names off the car outright so you have to guess what you're buying. They're hoping you think you're buying a Bentley or BMW.

Doesn't MB already make a full line of vehicles in Germany, from econobox to delivery truck, much like Toyota in Japan? Its just dumb Americans who think MB is only a luxury name.

Must be the same dumb americans like myself who purchased an LS460 thinking it can compete with an S-Class or 7 Series?

HughJass (love the name by the way) is right about MB. The same goes for BMW and Audi, which make much more affordable, stripped down cars for Europe and have for years.

The only real difference now is that every brand is trying to gain market dominance rather than being happy to sell to a key demographic. A great example of this is VW. They used to make outstanding (if a bit problem prone) cars just a few years ago. Then the decontented the Jetta and sales jumped 50% or more year on year ( don't know the exact numbers). The car is far more reliable, but also sucks to drive. It is no longer the poor man's BMW it is just a POS like every Corolla, Civic, and Cobalt on the road. For those of us who didn't want an appliance and wanted things like sound insulation, independent suspension, etc., the change is a travesty. If I ran VW, I would rather sell to a key demographic and to hell with titles like "best seller." Too bad every car is going this way, including my all-time favorite BMW. It sucks.

All 3 German luxury brands (Audi, BMW and Mercedes-Benz) are creating new models in search for more sales. If this means creating cheaper models that make the brand more affordable than ever then so be it.

Yes and at the same time the mainstream is moving upscale. There aren't any clear divisions anymore like there used to be.

They are in business to make money. They sold out the day they were incorporated.

009 "Yes and at the same time the mainstream is moving upscale. There aren't any clear divisions anymore like there used to be." - Yes, I agree in general. It allows one to be much more comfortable with the decision to buy a "lesser" brand because "I'm getting the same thing as the other guy while paying slightly less". And personally I think that's a good thing.

I am calling out all you posers hiding behind your computers and making delusional comments about autos most of you cannot even afford in order to see what you really drive. Let's all meet for the Rolex 24 hrs in Daytona at the end of the month. Anyone?

Fact 1...The industry has over capacity. Fact 2...European market at best is flat. Fact 3...Cost to close plants in Europe prohibitive due to union contracts. Fact 4...It would be political suicide for a politician to allow plants to close in Europe. Fact 5...The European Union agreement does not allow local governments to bail out automobile companies. Considering all these facts all of Europes leading car manufacturers are pursuing the only survival strategy that might work...go further up market with higher priced products to generate some profits and move further down market to generate enough volume to keep factories open. This will likely work for BMW, Audi/VW and Mercedes but French brands, Fiat, Opel and others could be squeesed out of the market in next ten years. Its the bigger picture and fight for survival that is changing the market...luxury brands are but a subset of large problem/strategy.

Wow! Finally someone who knows what they are talking about.

USNA1999, There aint no way on earth or in hell you are driving a Lexus LS460. If so prove it? Upload a picture of you sitting inside YOUR LS460 you have been ranting about, how it cannot compete with S-Class/7Series, and proof of a valid DMV printout showing you as the legal current leasee/owner of it. Most discerning buyers are very serious at this level and will do an intense research, do back to back comparisons and ultimately do comparitive back to back test drives and make their decisions from there. Finally, two things above I also noticed. One, you say you drive a Lexus LS460 but you post an orange BMW (great car no hate from this side) next to your rants/raves. Secondly, you said;..."must be the same dumb Americans like myself who purchased a Lexus LS460 thinking?....If you say you were thinking, I seriously doubt your thoughts were and are logical. Sounds more like the thoughts and talk of an habitual liar. So, submit your proof and try to be mature about it for once in your Autospies life will ya...

Awesome! Tell me where you want me to email the pics.
First, the orange M3 is my neighbour's Lime Rock edition (1 of 200); I believe his is some number in the 40s. Why would I put a picture of a "hardcore" LS 460 instead of his beast. Maybe I can put a picture of his Porsche 911 4S.
Second, not only I will the pic of the LS but my wifes TOUAREG and my daughter's MINI.
If you want, I can also throw in pictures of New Years in Antwerp and the holidays in London. By the way, I also heading to Taiwan, China and Japan in March. Yes, I can afford this lifestyle.
Let me tell you a little more about myself, Naval Academy graduate, MBA from the Naval Post Gradute School in Monterey, CA. Currently receiving a $50K military pension for serving 20+ years and retiring as a CDR. Also, currently working for big pharma, 2012 earnings $120 plus 45K bonus plus the military pension (you do the math).
I live in Plantation Estates in Julington Creek Plantation (St. Johns, FL) area code 32259.
I don't have nothing to hide, I am proud of what I have achieved. Unlike many of this board, I am not hiding behind a computer and keyboard. Anyone heading my way please let me know and I will take you out to lunch.
As a matter of fact, all you "wannabe enthusiasts" let's meet at the Rolex 24 hrs in Daytona at the end of the month and check each others rides.

Ok,it is dark outside here in JAX but I just changed my profile to reflect my wife's TOUAREG. I will do the MINI next.

Let me know when you have seen the TOUAREG, so I can put a pic of the MINI from my daughter's computer. I will upload the LS once you have confirmed.

Don't make wait all night, I go to bed early. I get up at 0430 to run a few miles.

Yes, there are people around who make money. There are also people around who make enough to regard USNA1999's income as mere pocket change. "Wealth" is a relative term. The truely rich have no need to flaunt it.

Agreed with HughJass. The 3 German marques have been offering full-line car ranges in countries outside the US for years. They are not just further enhancing those product lines and making them available in the US.

...Awesome USNA1999! Now upload all your pics here on Autospies. I'm sure the other guys on here want to see the other rides as well as that boring LS460.

lexworld,
Like I told you, I wake up early. Getting ready to go run a few miles.
This is my daughter's MINI, please confirm when you have seen it.
I can also upload pic of the house if you want, maybe you should come down to JAX so you can look at the registrations in person.

Just look for the SUVs. The Europeans knew better, but they followed the money.

Lexworld,
OK, I am back. Not sure on which coast are you in but I have to get ready and head to the office. Long day today since its Friday. I will post the picture of the "bestes car" in the world after work.
Funny how some of you guys make comments about cars you have never owned but love to make assupmtions on them.

lexworld where are you hiding? I have a few more pics to show you.

lexworld, I forgot but I also have this. Didn't mentioned it before because you might call me a "liar".

Lexworld I got tired of waiting for your confirmations on the pictures. I guess you missed the MINI and the bike. Let me know if you still want to see them.

no, they have not 'sold out.' they are adapting to market realities. due to CAFE requirements, no manufacturer can remain a solely high-end brand with cars that get below-average fuel economy. this broadening of luxury makers product lines is a response to US government policy more than anything else.