The next generation A4 to unseat the 3-series as best selling premium-luxury sedan?

Although, I am a hardcore Lexus fan but let be fair, it not fair to compare the new RS4 with 420 hp with the old M3 which only had 333hp. The Current RS4 with 420 barely beat the M3 with only 333. Wait until the new M3 with 420+ hp come out and see how fast it goes. Than at that time we can compare the two car squarely against each other.

By the way it does not matter because the IS500 is coming out with 430 or 440 hp of their own. It will be really exciting to compare the new M3, the current RS4, MB C-class AMG, the G35 and the Lexus IS500.

Lexus

This maybe true since Audi is building momentum, but they need a stronger hold in the American market to absolutely claim victory. However you don't suppose that BMW is sit there quietly. There is a chance there though.

IMO, Audi focuses on their market: the AWD market and the AWD performance market in the US. I don't think they designed the A4 to topple the 3-series at all. They stick to what they do best: and that's not making a balanced sports sedan (RWD).

BTW, this isn't a smashing against Audi.

i like the way that audi is cheaper then the other germans. i hope they keep it that way. My next car is an 08 tt.

"OR the second way being that they have had a chance to de-throne BMW every single year since there creation, for over a decade, and still, they haven't. So why would this next design be any different."

It wont. The 3-series always stays ahead of the competition.

What about the TL Type-S?
It's plenty fast, and I think it has MUCH better styling in and out than the G35. Of course it can't touch the 3-Series, but it's a bargain.

Another weekly, silly pointless post by Germannut. 1) BMW 3 series is #1, but the next best are the Lexus IS and infinti G35 both of these are better than the Audi A4 , more stylish, more exciting. i know this upsets the rebadge VW fans but it is true.

I would take a 3-series coupe over anything Audi currently makes. Hopefully the new A4/A5 will sway opinion. The current A4 is just not big enough or small enough or sporty enough or powerful enough or dynamic enough to compete with all those other cars.

Audi could make a great A4 before trying to unseat BMW. First things first :)

GermanNut- i hate these post

Audi will do well with or without BMW
Audi Sales are up 5 % and BMW is down 11% so things are going well as of now

I rekon the new range of toasters coming out onto the market will be better than the current range.

Better styling, faster, more features.

GermanNut, the base price of an M3 is 18 grand cheaper than that of an RS4. Expect to see the price of the new M3 undercut the the RS4's price-tag by about that much aswell...just the new M3 will have the performance to match or break the RS4. Sounds like a smarter buy to me!

Another thing is, you were only able to mention one thing the A4 does better than the 3-series, while you were able to mention multiple thing's the Bimmer does better than the Audi. Interesting.

Actually, the new M3 features a jack squat of standard options compared to the RS4. When optioned out equally the RS4 is only several thousands more expensive. Also, no one can truly compare the M3 and the RS4. The M3 is missing a set of doors (all wheel drive and 365 day a year drivability) when the sedan M3 comes out there can be a real comparison. Or better yet, wait until the RS5 comes out. Anyways the new A4/A5 will have a brand new platform. They will fight very well.

The sedan, probably not.

For starters people won't accept a FWD car as a sport sedan equall to BMW's 3er. Besides, Audi's philosophy is that of an all rounder, not quite as focused as BMW.

The wagon on the other hand will probably beat, with the new AWD undoubtly, its BMW counterpart.

Sedans, sport(y) are usualy the turf of BMW since the 1960s, while is better at wagons.

GermanNut failed to start a flaming war this time :D

This is a toughy. Both the A4 and the 3-series has their own pros and cons. The A4 IMO has a more solid feel to it. Road noise is kept down for the most part with the A4 with a door-closing assist (I think). However as for being 'dynamic' i'm afraid the A4 has come short.

This is the A4 vs 3-series, not the RS vs the M. Why are people bringing that debate up again?

There are several 3-series and A4 competitors out there and they would be considered premium-luxury sedans as well if you want to put them under that category. G35, C-class, TL, IS for example. They are all in the luxury sedan segment. More specifically "entry-level" more than "premium luxury".

efoxS4, if you believe the interior of the RS4 matches BMW's best (best being a 6-series & 7-series)... your bias towards Audi is obviously so strong, I can't even have this debate with you!

That said, your knowledge on the M3 (and BMW in general) is so poor, you try and compare it with a Civic.

First of all, BMW doesn't offer cloth in any of their models, if it isn't leather it's fake leather. Leather is standard on the M3 but for the Alcantra leather, (top of the line leather) it's optional.

Second, if you have paid any attention to the standard upgrades BMW gave the new 3-series coupe over the old one, you'd realize the new M3 will have just as many standard options as the RS4, and will still carry a base price of about 48 grand, 50 grand at the most!

Another thing, I've seen way more consistent numbers with the RS6 running a 0-60 test in 4.4 sec. The RS4 however has 0-60 test numbers all over the place...from 4.5 being most consistent to 4.3 or 4.4 being rare results!

With all of these accurate predictions we can make, it appears the RS4 is enjoying it's 15 minutes of fame before the real talent comes to town!

efoxS4, I don't know why you persist to say the standard M3 comes with cloth on it's seats when it doesn't. It comes with standard leather seats.

Another thing, you'd have just as much trouble buying an RS4 for it's base price of $66k as you would an M3...So what's your point?

BMW had planned a V8 with well over 400hp well before the public knew of the new RS4. Do you think the new RS6 & S6 would have a V-10 if it weren't for the new M5?

So please don't make comments like the RS4 is the Bimmer's new benchmark.

I have brand loyalty, Logical, It's to BMW. Why else would we have had so many?

By having an Audi it makes you support the brand. When you end up getting another brand it just makes you support the new brand. When the new brand is a BMW or Porsche there is reason to say that you will stay with the brand due to its rich history and ability to make truly awesome luxury-sport cars (BMW) or sports cars (Porsche).

First off, Larry:

Defining what car is 'better' is highly subjective. Sure, I'll make statements claiming that Audi is better than Lexus, but that can be corroborated by technology, motorsports, and international recognition Audi has received. Lexus on the other hand can't claim a single advantage other than flawed quality reports.

Sales are not the ultimate determinant of what makes a car better--in the US, this is most often due to brand recognition or association--specifically marketing, something Audi has neglected in the US. Personally, I like the exclusivity of driving an Audi.

Just wait until the next A4, and other models Audi has coming, including the R8.

...Audi models depreciate very quickly, and I believe it. Why is that, by the way?

because they're POS after a few years. for a while, a mechanic and i partnered in buying clunkers cheap, fixing 'em up, and reselling 'em.

we looked at an audi for which the owner was asking about $900. beautiful interior. but just scanning the tires (good job, quattro!) and engine compartment, he would've had to pay US $100 to haul it away.

MunicRob
BMW & MB both offer Cloth upholstery in their Cars

Will & ApexAlex
Audi Depreciation is lower than that of comparable MBs & BMWs

( EVERYTHING I JUST SAID IS TRUE FOR THE UK & EUROPE. CHECK IT OUT )

I95SPEEDINGTICKETS,

Mercedes offers cloth on the C-class, BMW offers FAKE LEATHER...NOT CLOTH.
Yes you will find cloth on an old 323i but not a new one, and definitly not on an M3.

Will- (I modified your sentence slightly)

"When it comes to BMW, why do you BMW fans always ask everyone to "wait" for the newer models? Let's talk about the current models."

Nobody wants to talk about the CURRENT M3, because it has been destroyed by the CURRENT RS4.

Audi fans are eagerly awaiting the new M3 to see if it will live up to its hype and mania generated by the E46.

If BMW falls short, we know the Audi will reign supreme since the C63 won't even be a true competitor to these cars (lack of a manual and not nearly as precise handling/road feel)

The RS4 sets the bar VERY high. BMW itself even admits it.

We know exactly who they are trying to defeat with the new M3. The question is will BMW actually do it?

Of course, BMW is not gunning for the RS4 when just a week after the RS4 was launched, BMW decides to oh so conveniently delay the new M3 by almost 6 months.....

Audi fans will, unlike many BMW fans, acknowledge the strengths of the competitors' cars. If the new M3 proves to be better than the RS4 in some ways, then we will give BMW credit.

It is now BMW that is playing catch up to Audi with the RS4. Many BMW fans will not admit this and say 'just wait until the new M3...'. Saying this is not only admitting defeat, but it doesn't give credit to Audi for creating a fantastic car.

anS4inOC,

"It is now BMW playing catch up." Please we all know the one playing catch up is Audi, their the underdog's while BMW's the benchmark.

The current RS4 outperforms the current M3 because the RS4 is a generation ahead of the of the M3...It be like BMW fans boasting about how the current M5 outperforms the last-gen RS6.

About your playing catch-up comment, BMW fanatics had already heard rumour of the V8 400+ hp engine BMW's slipping into the new M3, well before any RS4 specs were released.

Bimmer fan's arent admitting defeat, were saying the real fight hasn't even begun for Audi!