Cadillac To Upset The German Dominance Of Power With Radical 2017 ATS-V Black Series?

Caddy might offer more power than the German luxury makers, but I don't believe the only thing that keeps Caddy from being in the same league as the German brands is power. In fact, the German brands offer lots of cars with less power than the Caddy, and yet, MB is MB, BMW is BMW, and Caddy remains Caddy, trying to shift the public perception that it's up there with the big boys of luxury.

Sure, there are Caddy fans, some of whom will be pissed by this post, but there just aren't enough of them buying Caddies to result in Caddy being one of the Big 3 luxury brands (currently Mercedes, BMW, and Audi).

At the moment, you are correct. Lets see where Cadillac is in 10 yrs, which will go by pretty quickly.... It took Audi what 30 years to be seen as an equal to BMW/MB? They did it by huge cash investments by VW and no doubt purchased market share. BMW was viewed as a small sport sedan mfr until about 2000 with the 3, 5 & 7 Series. MB has been around for over 100yrs and has the lineage. That said, all these mfr's as well as Lexus benefited from Cadillac's fall as the UAW drained the company of resources to compete... this is a new day and your bias doesn't reflect the current state. Sales is not an indicator of competitive machinery, the current crop of Cadillac's more than compete. Go drive one by the way before you bash them... and you might be surprised....and you'll find they're not "clones" they're their own products, with their own personalities...

I not only AGREE with this comment but I would like to add to it.
These Super powerful upgrades luxury sports cars sell in incredibly small numbers - and do nothing to establish the Brand.

However - I disagree that the "German Brands" are the target that Cadillac should be going after. Cadillac was a LUXURY car company - not a Luxury Sports car company. For decades - a Cadillac meant solid, dependable, powerful,quiet, Luxury, interior space and appointments. And they did not actually compete with BMW or AUDI (Whose large cars do not sell much) - because they sold MOSTLY small Sports Sedans whose interior space made them essentially two seaters. Mercedes did compete with the S class sort of.

Now - what we have is Cadillac attempting to compete with Audi and BMW - by producing these little two seater (CTS and ATS rear seat room may as well be a package shelf) - no trunk space - no spare tire - Sports sedans for WHO? Cadillac has abandoned its market only to attempt to split up a market that simply isn't that big in the USA or CHina.

People buy Mercedes and BMW for the name. Once they realize Cadillacs are more reliable and offer more car, the tide will change.

MDarringer writes "People buy Mercedes and BMW for the name. Once they realize Cadillacs are more reliable and offer more car, the tide will change."

I don't believe you're right about buying for the name. These brands are highly desired not because of brilliant marketing, but because they have a history of creating highly desired vehicles.

As for for sudden switch to another brand scenario, this happened when Lexus first appeared on the scene. I believe it happened because Lexus offered a car that was similar to Mercedes in terms of styling, feel, and apparent level of luxury, all at a considerably lower price. Many Lexus consumers were former Mercedes owners.

These conditions do not yet exist with Caddillac. Even if Caddy arguably offers similar handling and higher reliability at a lower price, their styling is radically different from the top luxury brands (MB, BMW, Audi, by unit sales), and *I* believe their styling screams "Made in Detroit," which has not won over the hearts of many luxury car consumers.

Cannot agree with the comment on the Unions in the USA.
What people forget is that both Germany and Japan are just as highly unionized as the USA - and it was in Germany that they had the highest cost - not the USA. AS a result - German cars were much more more expensive than American cars to produce and then Purchase.

My point was that GM could have competed with the Germans - but the Luxury Car Market that Cadillac was in - in the USA - was NOT the same market that the German Small Sports car market competed in. A Cadillac DeVille owner - or a Town Car Owner - was NOT looking for a small - tight - fast sports car with no interior space - and little trunk space. They were - AND STILL ARE - two different markets. And I disagree that Cadillac should have deliberately Abandoned the Large Luxury car Market - to compete in the space with the Germans - when that market is smaller in the USA and China - and has MORE competitors. If they wanted - Cadillac could have competed in BOTH markets (With the Escalade - they actually do) - they could have produced NAMED cars for the Luxury car market - and Alphanumeric nonsense for the Luxury Sports car market.

However - to actually come out and tell the people who bought the Large Luxury Cars that they don't want them as customers was a stupid idea for DeNysschen and Cadillac. And Cadillac's largest sellers are the Big Luxury SUV's - (AS is Lexus too) - not these little sports cars that sit on the lot along with the even worse ELR. I believe Cadillac should take the current XTS - and make it a line of Two cars - an "L" Version and a regular version - and compete with the Lexus LS350 with the small one - and get back SOme of the old market - where the volume would be.

The Cadillac store in our group has no trouble selling the "V" models. It's the base models that are the tougher sell.

i dont care if the caddy's are faster than amg/ M/ rs lines. go sit inside of the latest ats-v and youll see why i would rather be in a slower german car, than a fast caddy.
Not saying i wouldnt ever want or get a caddy, but if an m4 leases for 900 a month, the ats-v would have to be 600 for me to take it over the bmw.

Wouldn't a m4 compete against the CTS-V? I find the CTS much more usable.