HOT!!! First Spy Photos of the REAL next generation BMW 7-Series

anyone know what powerplants theyll be using for this car?

Looks nice, but I'm eager to see actual pictures. I can't really tell with this one.

huu-

Use your head! It's called camouflage! It's still going to have kidney grilles- you think BMW would drop their trademark?

looks like a maserati quattroporte w/a front end that hit a brick wall

I've noticed the fat hammerhead hood on the 3-coupe. Looks like a new design element because it's here too.

It's no Pinto, but I like where it's going.

Tifosi, "BMW has alot to do if they want to compete with the new S & LS."

Lexus is the one trying to measure up with the new LS to compete with the likes of MB S-Class, BMW 7-series, & Audi's A8.

The LS is a toyota with a handfull of electronical features and gadgets added on. I would never spend more than 60 grand on a car that looks like it falls into the economy car category.

Right now the S-Class & A8 are the 7's only real competition, with the S-Class being the one to beat.

The read reminds me of a Volvo.

I meant to say rear...

Ugh...they still have not got it right. Even with the camo on, I can see that it still looks like a fat pig. No elegance unlike the competition... :(

Will,

The S-Class looks like a Nissan Altima. You mean to tell me that you'd spend $80,000 on a car that used a $15-$25K car for its design inspiration?
==================================================

What are you smoking? When I see the Altima and the S-Class side by side, I wouldn't even begin to compare these two from a design POV.

How about this: the front of the new Lexus LS460 looks like it was COPIED from the VW Phaeton.

Ooops...

Hmmm... if you take the LS 460 and go back to previous LS's way back to the 1st LS which was based on the Mercedes S-Class... I guess you'd have to say the LS is a Mercedes! It ain't a Camry, but it'll do for me...

Looks nice.
I hope they fix the interior so it is more consistent and flowing.

"The LS is a toyota with a handfull of electronical features and gadgets added on. I would never spend more than 60 grand on a car that looks like it falls into the economy car category."

Then what is A8.A Phaeton with more gadgets and a badge...etc etc

And BMW530i,U MORON,VW Phaeton,r u serious???
do u think Lexus was that silly that they copied a FAILURE.A Failure for their Flagship model.
Not only sounds ignorant but illogical as well.

JUGNU

You all have to be kidding me. There is no way that you still cannot identify Lexus as a major player in this game. For the time that it has been around, especially when compared to the history Mercedes has, Lexus has jumped into the game once dominated by major competitors. When compared to Mercedes, Lexus is still entering & adjusting to the market, but has been delievering refined & incredible vehicles since day one. And where does this article even mention Lexus. Give it a rest for ONE article.

the new ls DOES look like the phaeton, i knew i knew it from somewhere.
btw jungu the a8 and phaeton aren't related.

The Phaeton was a good car, it just failed for the same reasons the Acura RL did. I think if they changed the plastic looking rims, it would have been a nice looking car (although it still wouldve failed). I mean I always saw the Audi A8 as you all see the Lexus LS, an upgraded version of its cheaper sister.

Will & JUGNU,

The Phaeton didn't copy the LS and the LS didn't copy the Phaeton. I would never buy a Phaeton either, for the same reason i wouldn't buy an LS, or any Lexus for that matter.

Lexus's look and feel like toyota's because they are! In Japan there is no Lexus, just higher-end toyota's, the ES350 is based of a Camry platform. Your not fooling me with an over sea's rebadging of the car!

The dash layout and materials all look like there from a Toyota, especially with the digital clock that looks like it was taken from a microwave, and then mounted to the top of the dash.

The interior and exterior of the LS have no-where near the personality and style of it's competitors.

The interior of the new LS looks nice, but personally, the pictures I have seen of the exterior look very bland to me. I can't judge until I see it in person. I drove the new s550, and love the exterior styling and power, however the interior really disappointed me. For $90k+, I expected more refinement and richness, however, it came off to me as a cheap knock-off of the 7-series. Which brings me to the vehicle I ended up purchasing, a fully loaded 750li. For me, the BMW delivered the right combination of power, handling + interior/exterior styling. Just an honest opinion from someone who actually owns one of these vehicles that often get discussed. I look forward to the update in '08.

Actually MunichRob, you were right up until a couple of months ago when they opened up the first Lexus dealer in Japan.

Munichrob,
I am afraid to say that if the ES350 was based on a corolla or an echo i would still take it over a 3 or 5 series. On the other hand if u say that lexus feels like a toyota which i don't see where the problem is, why doesnt the Phaeton feel like a jetta or an A8 feel like an A2??
If u would like to compare the LS to the S-class, the LS is more powerful (compare number of gears, weight, aerodynamic drag etc...) is smoother as it always has been, is quieter as it always has been, is more comfortable as it always has been, looks nicer (looks are opinions) has better interior and mechanical quality, is more reliable and durable, consumes less fuel, is more environmentally friendly and has more or less same options except the S does not have that first class seat in the back.
Please all lexus lovers give me ur feedback.!!

I believe that the new designs of Lexus are "OK" looking in pictures. Its when you actually see them when you realize each line, and how everything just comes together. I do like the syling of the 5-series as many others do not but each lexus in person is incredible, except ofcourse for the dying SC 430. The new ES really doesnt look that good at all in pictures to be honest but the first time I saw it in person, i was amazed at how great it looked. Same goes for the IS, even though i have a small problem with the back headlights, but nothing major. The GS, i fell in love with the first day I saw it at the dealership. The inside, even better. Lexus has done an outstanding job.

I am not biased against the Merc however. It is a nice car but I feel their designs, except for the new S, which isn't bad looking, is a little dated. Although the C class and IS are the lowest counterparts of their companies, the C feels much cheaper then the IS and would pick the IS in a heartbeat over the latter.

The back end reminds me of a Volvo and the front end just looks out of proportion.

Haha, another 100 post Lexus board. The anti-Lexus crowd has come again.

Oh by the way BMW530i I don't Will was comparing the current gen Altima with the S-class, but he was comparing the new S-class with the Altima from 1998+. There are similarities between the current gen models.

Well this board will be around 100 posts in the near future.

"Oh by the way BMW530i I don't Will was comparing the current gen Altima with the S-class, but he was comparing the new S-class with the Altima from 1998+. There are similarities between the current gen models."

Should say:

Oh by the way BMW530i I don't think Will was comparing the current gen Altima with the S-class, but he was comparing the new S-class with the Altima from 1998+. There are no similarities between the current gen models.

All I can say is that the back of the old Nissan Altima is quite similar.

new 7 is nice. headlights need some work. as far as lexus goes. im not a hater, lexus is a good company, they make good cars, with the least amount of problems. but they just dont have the sexiness of a bmw. their classy .. but just not sexy.

Will,

The S-Class looks like a Nissan Altima. You mean to tell me that you'd spend $80,000 on a car that used a $15-$25K car for its design inspiration?

------------------------------------------

How on earth would an S-Class look like an Altima? Either you are high or you simply have bad vision. Come on now, no one would even compare these two cars. The Altima is rubbish compared to the S-class. They don't look anything alike.

-----------------------------------------------

How come the next generation 7 looks like the 02' 7-series rear end again? Perhaps some of those pieces are just reflective pieces instead of actual lights. The car is masked up pretty well. For sure it will share cues with the new 3-series sedan/coupe. It will be a benchmark for the new BMW models to come in the future.

Huu76 ?? Audi sytle headlights??? you're jealously exceeds your car logic. The current BMW 7series was the first car with headlights like this.

Munichbob....sure the Lexus is a toyota..which kills me with the people on this site....the reliability, residual value, and quality alone should make you eat your words. Me being a BMW owner (645ci) I can only respect what Toyota/Lexus is doing. Most toyotas are built in the US..the lexus is built in Japan. A lotof the BMW's are built in the US nowadays, but not the M's and the & series. My point is...you and a lot of readers on this site act like spending 60k on a Toyota is a bad thing...I guarantee if you spend 60 on a Bimmer and a Lexus at the same time..in 3 years..the Lexus would be worth more and will probably have less problems and cost less to maintain and get you just as many women (except for the 645ci)..i think of 7 series as drug dealer mobiles (in Atlanta)...but I think the new ls460 is a copy (design wise) of the 745..but as far as value and reliability...nowadays, you can't beat a lexus..now this is coming from a 645ci, s430, and q45 (1999) owner..they all have something different to offer...of my three cars..the Q..still has my heart...it just doesn't turn heads as much..but quality and reliability is too die for. Its the same way I feel about Lexus....Quality and Reliability...can't be beat...I will admit though..nothing drives like a bmw..as far as handling and sportability

Listen ppl. End of Story. M6 is the best built car in the world, I made it with my own hands, I designed it. No 7 series, VW, S, LS, or any of that shi! is gonna change that. Got it.

Now thank you.....................................................................and ur welcome!!

THE best car in the the world is the M3 because its cheaper than the M6 and its better than anything in the world , now go sell your kids and get one NOW!!!

ryaajus, ToyotaLexus & Will...

ryaajus name me one BMW model made in the states? There are none! Your thinking of Mercedes which makes a total of two models in the states, which isn't alot.

ToyotaLexus I'm positive you've never even driven the S-Class...It's ride is so comfortab the benchmark in this category without question!

ryaajus, ToyotaLexus & Will...

ryaajus name me one BMW model made in the states? There are none! Your thinking of Mercedes which makes a total of two models in the states, which isn't alot.

ToyotaLexus I'm positive you've never even driven the S-Class...With an interior so rich & luxurios, a ride so comfortable and quiet, it's no wonder it's the benchmark in this category! The LS might have more ponies under the hood, but so far it's proven to be the slower car between the two.

And Will I never said the LS was off a Toyota platform, I was jus making the point that the Lexus department is merely the toyota department in disguise. Disguises don't fool me, especially not with the dashbord they threw in the LS...Looks like a Toyota equipped with a Navi.

The front is an improvement on the current 7 series but the back looks just as horrible as the current one. Hopefully this one will not have as many quality issues as the last one when it came out. Why can't BMW make their cars as reliable as Lexus.

munichrob, the z4 and x5 are built in the states. m-b makes the ml, gl and r class in the states.
with the LS-toyota thing, i wouldn't care anyway. why does everyone hate it when 1 car is based of another?

Front end could be a bit better...back end is the same old ugly. Then again...this hasn't been finalized...luckily.

Will,

I know alot more about Lexus than you would like to think. I also know that your most likely the perfect customer for Toyota/Lexus because here your are trying to argue the fact that, Lexus's don't feel and look like Toyota's WHEN THEY ARE!

The interior of the LS might not exactly replicate the interior of a toyota model, but if you showed me interior pics of both the LS & Camry, I'd have no doubt in my mind they came from the same company.

My comment about Lexus being a Toyota department in disguise does go to show how much more I know about Toyota/Lexus, which seems to be more than you do. Lexus's have hidden Toyota badges around the cabin, there just in small print and places you hopefully won't notice them.

It's not hard to see that the Toyota & Lexus design studios are the same...The toyota camry looks like an ES (mabye because the ES is on a Camry platform), the Toyota Avalon uses many GS styling cues, & the Solara looks like an SC430.

Why spend more than 60 grand on a car that looks reflect a vehicle of half the price?

most of the people here must have been molested by lexus when they were little because someone just mentions them and boom... hate mail.

Now, I hope to see good comments like, how does it looks, or how the car could be better built. That being said it would be great that car engineers and designers enter to this page and read our comments like, “hmmm that guy has made a point,” etc.

Unfortunately, most of these comments remind me of historic times of racism, intolerance, and even tyrannize.

People, the beauty of this life is the diversity of so many things!!!!! Imagine a world where all the cars had the same design. Where everything would be the same and everyone had the same house of the same color. YES, IT WOULD SUCK SO MUCH. Of course this type of life is that compared to that of communism (but that’s not my point here). My point here is, WHEN YOU SEE A BLOG NAMED “new BMW spy shots,” TRY TO COMMENT ABOUT BMW, or Lexus only respectively.

Why every time a car company announces a new design for a new model you think of the competition? WHAT THE HELL DID LEXUS MADE WRONG TO BMW?

I see, develop a car company from zero to TOP10 sales in less than 10, versus that of a century from BMW, AND MERCEDEZ. And you have to admit guys, Lexus has the best reliability. And I don’t care if I am now talking about Lexus under this BMW news, but I am just making a GREAT POINT HERE.

Do the math guys, 10 years versus almost a century. It’s a big difference, right? So, there’s nothing you can do about it, Lexus is and will continue to outperform EVERY SINGLE piece of European junk from the lady Mercedez and the Bavarian Motors Company. (And YES, Mercedez is the name of a lady, what a silly lame. And Bavarian thing also is true, so you can tell now how that bunch of Barbarians from the movie GLADIATOR COME FROM. That makes LEXUS being MAXIMUS, and BMW all the bunch of pussy Barbarians from the first battle at the beginning of the movie. That is how LEXUS is going to finish BMW.

By the way, for all those morons who keep posting ignorantly that “Lexus are Toyotas made in Japan.” Let me just make one point here. Yes, since the beginning until like a couple of years ago, Lexus cars were all Toyota models from Japan, made both in Japan and USA. Because Lexus is believe it or not, an American car brand, from Toyota of course. But, since the new L-Finesse philosophy was introduced, they started making a completely new line of different cars not related to any Toyota (with the exception of the ES, and the RX which are Luxury Toyotas in Japan.)

That’s why in the past Lexus was made from other Toyotas in Japan, but GUYS, TAKE A LOOK FOR YOURSELF OF THE TOYOTA website of Japan, and you will see that they ALSO make LUXURY CARS under the TOYOTA brand. That’s why a group of Americans decided to take those Luxury Toyotas here to America, BUT with a different badge and name (Lexus), because they knew that we would be comparing them with the other economic Toyotas.

It would be great if here in America we had that kind of vision they have in Japan. Toyota is a company which can do both reliable

It would be great if here in America we had that kind of vision they have in Japan. Toyota is a company which can do both reliable luxury and economic cars under a same badge and name.

hahahahahahhahahahahahahahha
auronsicero is a complete idiot.
"so you can tell now how that bunch of Barbarians from the movie GLADIATOR COME FROM. That makes LEXUS being MAXIMUS, and BMW all the bunch of pussy Barbarians from the first battle at the beginning of the movie"


ahahahahahhahahahahahhahahahha.
why do you think lexus will finish everyone? lexus is just a company. european junk? jesus christ.
you seriously are stupid.

Will,

"The S-Class reflects a car not even a third of its price. And how dare you talk about a Lexus interior! You know nothing about them, if you think any company makes a better one!"

I'm sorry but Lexus interior's aren't that striking, there boring. Mercedes & Audi both make way better interiors than Lexus hands down. The A8's interior isn't far off from a Bentley's in style and feel, & the S-Class's interior feels rich & classy to no end!

The personality of the LS's german rivals is no question more prominent inside and out. The S-Class intergrades a classic beautifully designed hand clock into the cars dash, while the LS intergrades an 80's looking digital clock into their dash!

When you see an S-Class or 7-Series on the road, they stand out and catch your eye. Even in the eye's of the non-enthusiast, there's no question that it's an expensive car. If your mistaking an Altima for an S-Class, you need to go get your eye's checked...immediatly.

Lexus's may not lack the quality, but they lack the personality of it's german rivals to the point that there just sterile car's. There only jewel is the IS.

auronsicero,

"So, there’s nothing you can do about it, Lexus is and will continue to outperform EVERY SINGLE piece of European junk from the lady Mercedez and the Bavarian Motors Company"

Lexus has been notoriously known as a rip-off Mercedes by many people in the car world, and Lexus is still yet to outperform Barvarian Motor WORKS...not company moron. Even their 306hp IS350 couldn't outperform BMW's 255hp 330i!

Lexus doesn't have one model that is considered the benchmark in it's class, Lexus has a lot longer to go than 17-18 years to be excepted world-wide as a true BMW, MB, & Audi competitor!

Will-

"You know nothing about them, if you think any company makes a better one!"

My wife has a Lexus. I've been to the Lexus dealership many times. Audi makes better interiors.

That's all I'm saying. When you flame at me, I won't respond.

but it was VW that copied the Phaeton.
======================================

This car came out waaaaay before the new LS. Caught you lying again, Will.

While we're at it, check out this review of the current Mercedes S-Class when it first came out: http://www.caranddriver.com/idealbb/view.asp?topicID=67594&forumID=21&search=1&searchstring=

Again, written by carwimmer.

Hey AURONSINCERO

Do the math guys, 10 years versus almost a century. It’s a big difference, right? So, there’s nothing you can do about it, Lexus is and will continue to outperform EVERY SINGLE piece of European junk from the lady Mercedez and the Bavarian Motors Company.
================================================

Lexus was founded like what? 20 years ago. They've had it EASY because they didn't have to invent anything. The oldest German brand is over 100 years old and they've had to FIGHT for their place in the world. Watch your bullshit comments.

(And YES, Mercedez is the name of a lady, what a silly lame. And Bavarian thing also is true, so you can tell now how that bunch of Barbarians from the movie GLADIATOR COME FROM. That makes LEXUS being MAXIMUS, and BMW all the bunch of pussy Barbarians from the first battle at the beginning of the movie. That is how LEXUS is going to finish BMW.
=======================================

Ah, we're going to personal insults now eh? Mercedes was the name of the daughter of Emil Jellinek, one of the first customers of Daimler-Benz cars. The very fact that you so vaguely write "lady" tells me that you know jack shit about automotive history. Also, BMW isn't the name of a lady, but an abbreviation for Bayerische Motoren Werke.

Dipshit.

Oh, and Lexus "finishing off BMW"? What are you smoking? Lexus doesn't even make sports sedans except for the IS, and that car is still biased towards luxury and comfort - two aspects which the BMW 3-series doesn't even focus on.

You truly are an idiot. First your lame comments on how Lexus has done so much in the last 10 years, next, you don't even know where the names of the two German brands came from.

Want to know something else? You flame Mercedes and BMW for having "ugly names", yet you love Lexus? Lexus is a rip-off of a "Luxus", the German word for luxury. Tell me how lame that sounds. Lexus...Lexus... WHAT AN "UGLY" NAME...

DIPSHIT.

Who's desperate?
================================

Answer my question Will. The 3-Series is the better handler, which is the KEY ISSUE for a sports sedan. Performance wise, the 330i is still fast. Fast enough to satisfy most enthusiast.

Every Lexus fan seems to think that just because the IS350 is faster, it's "better". Bullshit.

The IS350 is the better luxury car, the 330i is the better sports sedan. Case closed.

Handling: BMW
Price: Lexus
Luxury: Lexus
Quality: BMW & Lexus
Style: SUBJECTIVE
Value: Lexus

Now, notice how honest I was above. When it comes to value, fine, the Lexus wins.

BUT...

The issue at hand here is who makes the better sports sedan. Lexus claimed the IS350 is a 3-series beater: Uh no. It handles like a 1970s land yacht compared to the 3-series.

Handling in traffic is irrelevant, but when you reach those backroads, it becomes important to the enthusiastic and purist driver. Whoops, I forgot, 99% of folks who purchase an IS350 are NOT ENTHUSIASTS. They just want some well equipped car that is fast and reliable but flies off the road when the first curve comes...

Where did Will go? Did my honesty break his heart?

God you guys are lame. Sad, but true. Get back on topic, arguing like little children. Well my dad can beat up your dad.

Rupert, MunichRob, BMW530i

I don't know why, but everytime someone posts something in this website, there a bunch of people who take everything personal, using a hardcore language. Look, I haven't isulted you in anyway. That's what I hate of the forums. Here you try to convince everyone by methods of violence using a explicit language with people you don't know.

I can asure you, that if we were having a person-to-person conversation, you would never dare to talk to anyone like that. Because guys like you, are a bunch of lamers and weaklings who try to feel bigger than everyone else, by insulting people you don't know. Unfortunately, it is so pathetic of you comming to read comments you don't like, and take it personal like if you were the grandson of the guy who invented BMW, or Mercedez. If that is your way of life then I can be sure you don't even drive a BMW, or Mercedez, and not even a Lexus. And I really don't care if you do.

That's why I don't usually post in the internet because this kind of forum conversations without any respect, I call it a conversation of morons.

By the way, I REALLY, don't care if Lexus is better or not than BMW, nor Mercedez. Lexus doesn't pays me for giving them credit in these forums, and I am sure BMW,AUDI, or Mercedez, etc., doesn't pays any of you too. I just like Lexus, and I don't care if you do. That's my way of life, I am studing now Pre-Med, and when I finish my M.D., my first luxury car will be a Lexus.

It would be so stupid if guys like you after writing down so many $h#T about Mercedez, or BMW, you end up with a Kia. Unfortunately, that's how life is.

AMEN.

P.S. YOU CAN INSULT ME THE MANY TIMES YOU WANT AFTER THIS, BUT I DON'T GIVE A _-_-_-_ OF WHAT YOU SAY. I WILL JUST CONTINUE READING MANY OTHER INSTERESTING COMMETS FROM MANY OTHER INTELLIGENT READERS WHO VISIT THIS PAGE.

Correction in the P.S. Section.

(COMMETS) Should be COMMENTS FROM MANY OTHER...

Will, point of my post was more or less to call out people who talk rubbish, I think you can appreciate that. I like your posts and think you have good insight on stuff, but I think you can agree this is ridiculous.

"Where did BMW530i go? Did my facts break his heart?"
==========================================

Right here, dipshit.

auronsicero

THERE'S AN S IN MERCEDES.

i didn't take anythign personally, but the style of your comment and the sheer ignorance of what you were saying astounded me.
bmws are for barbarians, bmws are pussys (what are you, 12?), lexi are slaves that win gladiator fights (!!), lexus will rule over all other companies...???? why would they? seriously, when people say this, i ask what makes lexus so different and brilliant?
they are just a car company that makes a few reliable cars, cars that don't handle particularly well, or have direct and accurate steering. they are not the best thing since sliced bread. they make cars. and when 2 of them are DIRECT REBADGINGS of toyotas (the 2 suvs, not rx), it ain't good.
i don't care about the toyota links, but when all they can be bothered to do is stick on dual heads and call it a lexus, a car that is supposed to be refined and quiet, and its on a very poor suv with a rubbish engine and a ladder frame, it's not good.
seriously, i'm 16 and way less childish than you.

I have never seen such a pathetic post!! LMAO...I am pre-med....RU kidding me????? OMG that is so hilarious youre not even in med school and he's talking about his first luxury car purchase??? Look Lexus is a great car if you are female or over 50 or both...Just look around at who drives em. Thank god BMW and MB keeps the prices higher so all the lexus cheap skates wont buy em or cant afford em. Twin turbo 335i or IS350??? No camparison...aggressive drivers are taking the real machine every time...you all know which one dont you?? When the new V8 M3 comes out this argument will be over.

Will-

You've never sat in a new A6, or an A8 for that matter. Both have easily the best interiors in class. The A8's Bond-like screen is beyond cool, and there's acres of wood, but it doesn't seem like too much. It's extraordinarily simple and elegant, how a luxury sedan should be. I think that its interior has an absolutely harmonious, perfect design. And I don't use perfect lightly,

I also had a previous-gen A6 ('00 A6 2.7T quattro). I was immediately hooked on Audis. The interior was beautiful (far better than our RX300 and the Acura I had before), the speed was exhilirating, and it had a classic style that's still fashionable today,

Plain and Simple:
The Germans innovate, the Japanese copy and perfect.
We all know what a nice driving machine the Germans can create, but we all know how dependable they are (too many problems).
Now that the Japanese are perfecting what the Germans are bringing to the market, you end up with cars with little or no compromise.
This is why the Japanese will one day rule the car market.
Its been a greater struggle turning luxury buyers into Japanese car consumers, but this is due largely in part to the fact that most are brand whores.
The world is turning now, german luxury car owners are getting fed up with the poor reliablity of their cars and turning them in for Japanese luxury brands. Why shouldn't they? The Japanese luxury brand, (especially Infinitis) are becoming more and more of driver's cars, and still maintaining the durability and low cost maintainance that they always have.
BMW and Mercedes are only now realizing this, and responding with mega horsepower, and performance. But due to German Engineering Pride they will always want to be the first introduce anything to the market. The sadest part is that you as the consumer end up being their test pilots, and ultimatley are the reason that Japanese continue to offer a supreme product.
So the guys on this blog that continue to defend the German brands, please continue to buy them, without your market testing the Japanese wouldn't be able to offer me such a dependable variant of your unreliable "luxury" cars.
One piece of advise to the German brand whores, try to keep a friend that owns a Japanese car, you will need someone to pick you up from your local service department all the time.

I've had a BMW 5 series, which was the single worst car I've ever had and I've had some real clunkers. I've had 7 Mercedes most of which were fine automobiles, but the last S class I had was a disaster taken back by Merceded as a lemmon. I've had a Lexus LS 430 which was a wondeful car and now own an Audi A8. By a wide margin, the Lexus was the best of the bunch. While the Audi interiors are beautiful and have a reputation for being ergonomically well designed, they are amaturish campared to the LS. The MMI is almost as bad as the BMW iDrive. It requires far too many steps just to tune in the radio. Setting a destination in the navigation system is a tortous procedure that should be outlawed by the Genevia Conventions. You can't see out of the rear of the car unless the rear seat headrests are removed, which can only be done by the dealer. The trunk is 25% smaller than the LS. The cup holder is positioned so that it interferes with the MMI controls and is designed so poorly that cups tilt and pour their contents onto the console shorting out the MMI electronics. With 19inch wheels the thing rides worse than a jeep. While ther are both driver side and passenger side air conditioning system fan controls, there is only one fan so you can't adjust different air delivery rates for driver and passenger. While the Lexus also has some minor ergonomic issues, it is far superior to the A8 and 7 series BMW's. I have driven the new S Class. It seems to be much better than the last generation, but I think it's UGLY and overpriced.

The S class is and will always be the best full sized sedan in the world..