C&D November - M45 vs. 550i vs. E550 vs. GS450h

I really hate Car & Driver!!
Worst car magazine I've ever read!! (and i read a lot of them)

Car and Driver forgot to include the Audi A6 .......................!!!!!~!!!!!!

Yeah, the Audi A6 should have been included, but knowing C&D's sport bias, it probably would have placed in 3rd or 4th place.

This isn't surprising. Car magazines are based on sporting ability of cars. The Lexus - was definitely going to come last. The Infiniti winning is no surprise either. The G35 beat the 3 series in a lot of tests back in 2002. Also the new G35 beat the 3 series in most of the test in Motor Trend, but lost to the magical feel ;). Price is also a factor to the grading system - so that also is a plus to the M. The M is quite comparable to the 5 series in performance.

I don't this as a surprise - the M would have won in many tests by other magazines and websites. Maybe if money wasn't a factor than the 5 series would have won. However, if money isn't a factor buy the Bugatti Veyron.

GS450h is not supposed to be sport car and Lexus has never claimed GS450h as a sporty but highly luxury. That's a shame that AUDI is not there. AUDI is defenitly one of the best.I've 2 times driven my friend's car But honestly the Mercedes comparing to the others is should be in last place(i've compared it to LEX and BMW).I would say:

1.Infinity M45
2. AUDU A6 V8
3. BMW 550
4. LEXUS GS 450h
5. MERCEDES E550

And waiting to see the GS480!

Lexus has never claimed GS450h as a sporty...
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No? But they do so with the regular GS. And that car get's WHOOPED by the competition when it comes to driving dynamics. ;)

all cars in this segment should be QUITE sporty.
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I don't quite understand what you mean here.

1) SHOULD as in "must" meaning the manufacturer HAS TO ENSURE THAT THEY'RE SPORTY

or

2) SHOULD as in each car will have some degree of sporty driving capabilities.

?

But honestly the Mercedes comparing to the others is should be in last place(i've compared it to LEX and BMW).
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May I ask why?

All reviews of the new E-Class have commented on how the drive is much better than before. I'm pretty sure it even outclasses the Lexus GS - but the Lexus GS never even came close to matching the E-Class driving dynamics even before that car got a makeover.

You've got to love the way the new E looks and drives. The refresh is fabulous- this one has the Sport Package with the gorgeous rims. The E550 is supposed to drive beautifully, BTW.

I think that the 2007 (350hp) A6 4.2 quattro should be in this test, not the GS450h. A hybrid doesn't really belong here.

Kevin-

GS480? I'm sure you meant 460.

S4cabriofox-
"I think that the 2007 (350hp) A6 4.2 quattro should be in this test, not the GS450h. A hybrid doesn't really belong here."
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Why doesn't a hybrid belong there? It's fast and comparable to those other cars. Just because it's a hybrid doesn't make it any less of a car. I bet if it was an MB diesel engine you'd be whistling a different tune.

''May I ask why?''
BMW530i
this is my opinion and i'm defenetily not the only one who tried these cars. Please don't be such fanatic. If you love BMW this is your choice, i prefer AUDI and LEXUS.

S4cabriofox
Yes you're right the GS460!

Of course I'm gonna go out on a limb and praise the M45. I actually liked the last M, with its svelte lines and "musclecar" type attitude, it was definitely against the grain. I'm sure you will notice the "Z" avatar by my name, which throws out any objectiveness towards Nissan/Infinitis.

At least there wasn't a Renault. ;-)

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just want to say that i've tried the GS and it's a very pleasent car. It's not as sporty as BMW or INFINITY. but it's powerful and impressively stable at high speed.

I would like to have AUDi is this test as well!

just want to say that i've tried the GS and it's a very pleasent car. It's not as sporty as BMW or INFINITY. but it's powerful and impressively stable at high speed.

I would like to have AUDi is this test as well!
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Well obviously you have never tried the new E-Class. I have, and it comes very close to touching the 5-series in terms of steering feel and suspension setup: very close.

It doesn't really matter what C&D think because it not going to stop me from liking Lexus, Audi or BMW brand. I am a Hardcore Lexus fan but I still like other sport car brand. Like what they say matter, it not going to stop Lexus, BMW, MB or Infiniti from selling it car. And yeah..I have to agree how come the Audi is not on this comparison? That why I don't really C&D magazine. When it come to car buying it all about the price, preference, realiability, comfort and style. There hell in no that you going to tell me that the Infiniti is more Lexurious than the Lexus or MB. As for having a Lexurious interior design Lexus got to be number #1 in this category for sure.

Lexus

I agree with most of the post ^above^ except the part about interiors.

All cars in this class have good interiors, some are just better than others. To me, Audi, Lexus and now MB are in first place when it comes to interiors.

This isn't the first time Infiniti has won.


Might I say, Infiniti is the only Japanese luxury brand that has beaten BMW in these types of tests.

1995e34,

Point taken, but how many of the customers from say Lexus or MB actually care about sport? NOT MANY.

Your typical E-Class isn't aimed at a 20ish year old enthusiast. The same goes for the BMW 5-series, except in the BMW's case, it has that sporty attribute. ;)

Well obviously you have never tried the new E-Class. I have, and it comes very close to touching the 5-series in terms of steering feel and suspension setup: very close
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BMW530i

of course i've driven the MB E class 550. I realy like that. But not more than GS450 and AUDI 6 V8. Again this is my opinion and nothing gainst you!

Infiniti M45 Sport is the good looking car between them all ....and 5-series comes 2nd...

lexusis350-

No, no, no. Not what I meant at all. Hello! One of my cars has an L-badge on the hood!

I'm saying that the hybrid seems out of place here; a diesel would in a V6 comparison test, too. The hybrid seems more in its own when compared to only one other car, as a means to see which method of propulsion is better. It has been compared to the 550i singularly before (and sadly it lost), but because three other conventional sedans are here, it would be more apt to compare the GS430 or A6 4.2 quattro. I understand that the GS V8 is underpowered right now (the V6 is more powerful!), and so I thought the A6 should be here instead.

Where is the A6/S6?

the A6 is overated....

BTW, the gotta have it category is a joke.

1995E34,

We don't get in a uproar because Infiniti can only beat a BMW on Price. Thats always the deciding factor. Most of us in this price range don't care about $15K, when a person is looking in this segment price should not be the concern.

but $15k is lot...u could get another car with that...

Am I the only person left that does not worry about price anymore, you pay for what you get.
If a car can only beat another based on price and if so many people are concerned about "value/performance" for the dollar than their are many cheap vehicles that will out perform all of these.

^^^^agree^^^....like I said before, the A6 is overated.

1995e34 - yes your are right. You see if a person has the 70k to buy a car - that person can buy the BMW. But with that 70k one cannot purchase a Ferrari, right. So except for the very few billionaires and multi-millionaires in the world, most people have budgets. The amount in the budget is different. Car and Driver is a magazine that rates these cars - and based on their reviews people buy the cars as well. So performance-per-dollar does matter to C&D as well.

The A6 is a very good car, it's ride is a little choppie, but for day in day out use it's much better than the Infiniti. The M35/45 never really settles down around town. If the weather is at all dicy stay home even with the M35X, the tail still likes to play too much for most drivers talents. Plus the M35/45's seating positon is way to high and offset, it's almost like seating in the FX.

Of course, you can look at the situation without price added on. But of course, there is one problem with that: you have to pay for the car with money (or loan, etc.).

Kart1- When the magazines compare vehicles most of them put to much into the price difference, C&D even does it when the compare Ferraris and Lambos. We all know price is going to matter to some people, but the cars should speak for themselves. If you don't have the money or credit you don't need the car. If a person really likes the cheaper car because it's better for them thats one thing, but don't settle because of price. I just get upset that the best car dosen't always win.

The S6 would have had the most performance.

adoptgreyhounds - I get what you mean. I guess what they should do is make two categories for winning. First have a subtotal for the best car and then add on the value part at the end. Do they already do something like this - I think they do. So we know what the best car is and also what is the best car for the money.

Road and Track does that. The worst part about the Car and Driver ratings is the stupid "Gotta have it category" It is wrong many times.

towards a sexy car. The 5-series will be rememberd as car hads of it's time.

528i

LOL

Last generation of Infiniti M was my favorite Infiniti ever. New M has those awkwardly looking tail lights, not proportional to tha car at all.


G

I saw an S-Line A6 today... simply stunning. Much better than any bodykit you can get on a 5 Series or E-Class (includes M5 but not E63 AMG; I've gotta love the E63).

With 350hp, the new A6 4.2 quattro will run with more powerful cars. The A6 3.2 is mediocre for an Audi, and if I was shelling out $60K for it, I would just buy an S4 for the extra $5K, like I did.

And $70K for a 550i? Whoever spends that much is an idiot. Hello 750i!

S4cabriofox-
"And $70K for a 550i? Whoever spends that much is an idiot."
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Whoever spends any amount of money on a German car is an idiot.

lexuis350

And spending that much moeny on an American, Italian, English, Japanese, is any different? If you really think about it, any car over 25k is not very smart, but if you have the money it isn't so bad.

The A6 4.2 Quattro is a hot car but looses points for being overweight. Performance wise it probably wouldn't have done to well.

The S6 would have.

I'd like to see C & D kick it up a notch.

Do a version of M5 vs. E63 vs. Maserati vs. S8.

the gs450h claims it is a car based on performace and luxuary, and it is a hybrid. it would win my vote as the worst car up there as well. it should be like this M, A6, E, 5er, GS

So, the BMW 550i drive is more fun, but the M45 cost less therefore C&D places it first. So the way I would interpret C&D conclusion is if you can afford the BMW 550i buy it because it is more fun to drive. But if money is an object then select the M45.

I like the M45, I think it's a great value, but it won by a single point that it wouldn't have had if BMW hadn't overoptioned the test vehicle. $70k is more than a typically equipped 550i costs, a 550i with sport package, cold weather package, premium sound, and navigation would be around $65k MSRP. That's still more than the M45, but you also get free maintenance and the car will recoup the majority of the price difference on resale, so the true cost to own isn't much more than the M45. As for "Gotta Have it Factor", that's subjective and personally I think they were wrong, but that's just my opinion. Look at it this way -- if someone walked up to you and said "I have an M45 and a 550i and I'm going to give you one for free", I don't know of many people who'd take the M45 over the 550i.

Why TF r u people talking about the A6 if it isnt here.

OR

as u will understand:
Audi A6 is just too good to be compared to such cheap crappy cars

kidding, but u people really need to stop saying this kind of stuff

logical-

"s6 still a pig and more expensive. would have most cerainly lost."

And yet, when it was compared to the M5 and E63 AMG, it came in second, ahead of the M5, even though it's significantly less powerful and not meant to be an über-sedan (the RS6 will fill that gap). For $2K more than this 550i, with more standard features, 75 more ponies, and just a much cooler engine and pedigree, I'd take it for sure.

The BMW 550i should have come last because its so ugly!
Sorry I had to say that, why did BMW have to let the most legendary mid-size luxury get butchered?
The E39 BMW 5 series will always be an all time favorite to me. I really like the way the E60 drives, but its like dating a girl because she is good in bed, and always keeping the lights off because of the way she looks!
The Infiniti M45 Sport was so deserving, what an amazing car to drive, I have had the pleasure.
You know I personally think the M45 Sport is under priced. But no complaints, under priced is better than over.

RefuG-

I agree that the last generation M45 was the best. The current cars all kind of blend together. The last M45 had a distinct style, boxy but sporty looking.

BMW and Lexus are not really competitors - if examined closely.

But since they're both considered luxury brands in the US, shoppers compare them.

No shit that Lexus are more comfortable, but BMW's have to offer that compromise if they're remaining true to their philosophy. If you want good driving dynamics, you have to sacrific some comfort, hence the "rougher" BMW suspensions.

But that leaves me wondering why BMW insists on calling themselves "luxury?"
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I believe they refer to themselves as "sport luxury". ;)

I believe they refer to themselves as "sport luxury". ;)

So does Infiniti, how are they not comparable?

Will,
While I agree that BMW has a long way to go before being comparable to a Lexus or Mercedes, I also think that Mercedes has a long way to go before comparing themselves with Lexus. I can almost see the vein popping in BMW530i's head, can't you?