Car and Driver hits 4.8sec 0-60 in BMW 335i Sedan???

Something is wrong with those results. How can Car & Driver get the 335i sedan to go faster in 0-60 than the 335i coupe?

The sedan obviously weighs more and has the same exact 3.0 liter turbocharged inline-6 pushing out approximately 300 horsepower and 300 lb/ft. of torque.

It doesn't add up.

I'm happy the sedan is that quick, but why would BMW make a 335i sedan which has 2 more doors than the coupe, costs about $3K less than the coupe and is faster????


That all but makes the 335i coupe useless.

Ladies/Gents,
Car and Driver drivers are on crack when they do 0-60 tests! If you compare to all other magazines, (Road and Track, Automobile, Motor Trend) they always have the lowest times. Example, they are the only magazine that gave the RX-8 a sub 6-sec 0-60 times at 5.9 sec. This is a huge marketing deal for car manufacturers and Car and Driver is in the business of helping them out. I guess they are afraid of getting on the bad boy list and not geting enough test drives or something. Don't believe those 335i times, wait for other magazines to test drive to get a real 0-60 time range and I bet it won't be in the 4's.

It doesn't make it useless. BMW tweaks the motors of these cars all the time. Besides a tenth of a second quicker doesn't say much without knowing the precise conditions of the tests. Both are marvels, the coupe is sexier, the sedan is more practical, take your pick (or get both ;)

I geuss all BMW needs to do is add a turbo,keep the bland interior and this will justify the increase in the price.
I will stay with the naturally aspirated V-6s from Infiniti. That will be a costly repair bill after 50K miles when that turbo breaks. If the seals around the doors can't last past 50K, I have no confidence in their craftmanship.

Do you people realize that they have been using a version of this engine since the 1920s.

So what are the official times now:

Acura TL Type-S: What is the time for this anyone?
Acura TL (Base): 5.9sec
Audi A4 3.2 Quattro: 6.6sec (From pricegrabber??? Other estimates)
BMW 335i Sedan: 4.8sec
Cadillac CTS: 6.9sec
Infiniti G35: 5.2sec
Lexus IS 350: 5.1sec
M-B C350: 6.0sec (Edmunds.com)
Saab 9-3 Aero 2.8T: 6.4sec
Volvo S-60R: 6.4sec

I love BMW as much as the next guy, but apparently C+D have a much more intense relationship with them german boys. There's no way the 335 is doing 4.8seconds 0-60 unless they're dropping it out of a plane.

As for sedan versus coupe weight, I haven't looked up the specs on the 335, but when I bought my 330i in 2001, the same optioned 330ci was 100lbs heavier.

Chip-

G35 lover-

I am guessing you have not had a good experience with you last BMW, hardly fair to base one experience or somebody elses to be the norm.

As far as the test numbers, condition as we should all know make a huge difference and so does the driver. Besided one tenth of a second is hardly anything to get worked up over, a 10 mph tail wind can do that. FYI the sedan and the coupe only differ in weight about 115 lbs not really a big weight savings.

G35 lover-

I am guessing you have not had a good experience with you last BMW, hardly fair to base one experience or somebody elses to be the norm.

As far as the test numbers, condition as we should all know make a huge difference and so does the driver. Besided one tenth of a second is hardly anything to get worked up over, a 10 mph tail wind can do that. FYI the sedan and the coupe only differ in weight about 115 lbs not really a big weight savings.

According to BMWUSA.COM the weights are:
Sedan: 3593 lbs.
Coupe: 3571 lbs.

Maybe they put a 300lb guy in the coupe to test it and a 120lb guy in the sedan to test it ;).

Trust me the BMW 335i is very close to matching the E46 M3 0-60 time. With the next generation M3 making it's debut soon and a reported 0-60 in 4.5 to 4.6 sec. The 335i 0-60 in 4.893 (4.9) seconds make perfect sense. The 335i will fill the gap left by the all mighty E46 M3. At the present date the 335i can't be faster than the current E46 M3. BMW would not make that mistake. However, the next generation 335i will be faster than the E46 M3.

BM3W, the current 335i sedan ( the one just tested) by Car and Driver is just as fast as the E46 M3. Both clock 0-60 in 4.8 seconds and a 1/4 mile in 13.5 seconds.

germannut,

the car they are relating to is the 330i coupe which has the inline 3.0L engine and 255 hp.

the 335i sedan has the same engine with a twin turbo adding 45hp. this is responsible for the faster 0-60 time by about 0.8 seconds.

and your right it does make the 330i useless, thats why they are parting ways with it.

GermanNut...

Very good point. I'm just saying, I would really like to see that stop watch C&D was using to clock the 335i 0-60 times. I have a feeling the actual time is closer to 4.9 sec. Maybe something like 4.893 sec. I know we are not spliting hair, but I just don't see how BMW could make the 335i evenly matched with the current E46 M3. At least at the present date, I'm certain the next generation 335i will be faster than E46 M3.

Wow, that was hilariously put, Agent004.

No doubt the BMW is very, very fast. In my opinion, and my opinion only, the only edge that the BMW has over my personal favourite, the IS 350, is .3 seconds to 60 and better steering feel. IS 350 sedan has much better styling - in my opinion, again.

As I type this, I am glancing over the 2007 G35's specs on C&D's road test. The G35 weighs less than the 335i @ 3583 compared to BMW's 3616. Not that it is much of a difference, but just reminds you of how things are changing. The current 330i 6MT weighs in at 3417 lbs.

Hmmm.

this 0 to 60 stat is just a barometer to tell buyers this car is fast. 4.8 4.9 not a big difference, germannut comment "that makes the coupe useless" what does that mean?? It is a envy code meaning i wish Audi got respect like BMW. I am so desperate to find good things about audi that I hang my hat on the fact the audi makes nice interior, and post it a thousand times, and the fact that sells 10 w12 sedan a year, rebadged seat/vw/skoda/ audi cars suck. Bentley and Lamborghi got respect long before they joined VW group.

FYI Larry, the 335i sedan is my next mode of transportation.

FYI Larry, the 335i sedan is my next mode of transportation.

G35Lover....

Good point, but I will go on record right here today and say the next Nissian/Infiniti G35 will have a turbo charged engine. They must add a turbo charge to compete or a 4.4 liter V8. Nissian/Infiniti
has followed BMW lead in all other cases to date. What makes this any different.

There are obviously many factors in acceleration tests. Surface conditions, the amount of feul in the vehicles, how many runs they try before recording the best one, etc. Having stated the obvious, I don't believe its possible to record consistent 4.8 sec 0-60 time out the 335i sedan with "only" 300 hp. I believe, either BMW is under reporting their actual hp rating and/or they had a "hot" version for the press circuit.

Larry-

You said about GermanNut..."It is a envy code meaning i wish Audi got respect like BMW"

You idiot! GermanNut is buying a 335i for his next car! He said the SEDAN makes the COUPE seem useless...

Geez... dumba$$...

Larry, I thank you for admitting that Audi makes nice interiors.

Even a little bit of appreciation is in you guys, even if you think it never shows.

Of course Logical knows nothing about automotive history.

If there was no Volkswagen group, there would be no Lamborghini or Bentley.

The C+D test results of the 335i doesn't impress me, because we all know BMW is under rating their horsepower in an effort to display their efficiency over the other 300hp cars in class. No, what impresses me is the G35! Wow 306hp naturally aspirated, larger and heavier than the equivalant IS350's power and a 0-60 time of 5.2 seconds! Thats a pretty impressive powertrain. You know when I was really into the BMW world at one time I remember one of their engineers making a statement that, "we dont turbocharge because its almost like cheating for horsepower". What people used to always respect about the BMW motors was the fact that they could make so much with so little, and always kept a nice blend of horsepower and torque, and their engines were naturally aspirated and pure. Now all of the sudden BMW turbo charges its 3.0 six that has been in production for quite sometime now and its all the rave. To be honest with you guys I am not impressed, I actually expected more from BMW after they went to a turbo motor. I mean seriously 300hp? lets say it is underrated, and based on Automobile magazine's dyno test, we'll give it the benefit of the doubt 350hp. Am I the only one that remembers this? 1989, Nissan releases a 300zx Twin Turbo (17 years ago)...300hp/ 300 ft/lbs of torque....3.0L DOHC V6 Twin Turbo engine, which ran on only 6lbs of boost! Now fast forward about 3 years....Toyota launches the all new twin turbo Supra. 3.0L DOHC I-6 (like the BMW), Twin Turbo...320hp...300ft/lbs! So 17 years after Nissan introduces the 300ZX Twin Turbo BMW releases its 335's with POTENTIALLY only 50 more HPs, and only 30 more HPs than the 14 year old Supra and its all the rave....BIG DEAL. Based on BMW's reliablity track record I think you will find me driving a 17 year old 300ZX or 14 year old Supra rather than a 335i, at least I know they will stand the test of time and a little hard driving. But for now buying a new car the G35 is my choice, awesome; value, reliablity, and performance...and thousands less than the competition. Now if Lexus and Infiniti are producing this power without the assistance of a couple of turbines, imagine what they could produce if they did......hmmmmm.....Lexus LF-A?? Skyline GT-R????

So 17 years after Nissan introduces the 300ZX Twin Turbo BMW releases its 335's with POTENTIALLY only 50 more HPs, and only 30 more HPs than the 14 year old Supra and its all the rave....BIG DEAL.
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Did it ever occur to you that the horsepower output of the 335i is "all that it needs" to perform well?

Probably not.

The Supra and 300ZX were awesome machines in their day and still are, but you obviously have no idea what BMW is about. BMW isn't about sheer horsepower but about BALANCE. The 335i has enough power to satisfy the kean driver and performance enthusiast, while at the same time offering excellent handling qualities.

Case closed.

They were bought by Volkswagen in order to resurrect the brands from going to extinction.

Logical what other group would have bought them? Ford? Hahahahaha not a chance. Chrysler....NO!

Look at how amazing Lamorghini turned out. The Gallardo, the Gallardo SE, the Gallardo Nera looks amazing. Not to mention the Murcielago LP460 and roadster (now that is one sexy car)

Bentley's new enormous success with the Continental GT and Flying Spur and the upcoming Bentley GTC.


Lamborghini sales are skyrocketing and the same goes for Bentley.

Volkswagen I commend you on a job well done with two ultra-exclusive brands.

It solidifies Volksagen's ability to be a tour de force in the car kingdom.

They cover everything form cheap ordinary cars such as Volkswagen to high-end cars such as Audi and the ultra-high end Bentley and the sports car to drool over with Lamborghini.

Volkswagen you are a true tour de force and a great one at that.

I'm waiting for the day BMW gets bought over by volksagen too.

Hey BMW 530i (why not 545i or 550i? Couldn't afford it? needed the propeller on the hood?)
BMW isn't about sheer horsepower but about BALANCE. The 335i has enough power to satisfy the kean driver and performance enthusiast, while at the same time offering excellent handling qualities.

Did you forget what this current topic was about? 335i sedan 0-60 in 4.8 seconds.

0-60 times are typically based on straight line performance. This has nothing to do with handling, or the "total package" that BMW offers. These numbers are a result of the BMW 335i's twin turbo six. I was just pointing out that the BMW is not that impressive based on what the Japanese have accomplished with turbo sixes in the past.

Yes the BMW's are well balanced cars, I just expected more from them based on their past accomplishments without the assistance of Turbos. When a front runner starts "cheating" they should come out with results that are unattainable by others.

I apologize that you were so offended, I didn't mean to hurt your BMW pride. You come off as one of those guys that justifies why his BMW is always in the shop. Thats ok it gets the ladies doesn't it?? Not that you could offer them anything else.

C&D 335 coupe 0-60 was with an automatic
C$D 335 sedan 0-60 was with a manual hence the faster time

RICEMASTER

^ Good Point

BMW for years made a point of not turbocharging, and kept churning more HP's out of these NA engines. But if you notice the E46 M3 despite making 333hp could only produce 262ft/lbs of torque! Did BMW reach its pinnacle with NA sixes? Was this the only way they could produce that kind of HP without sacrificing torque and keep the blend of HP and Torque we have all become accustomed to from BMW?
Hmmmm, how the world changes Japanese making torquey NA sixes w/o turbos, and the Germans using forced induction for torque & hp......A decade ago no one would have believed it. But at least the Japanese are staying true to their dependablity... sorry so have the Germans, last I checked the German cars still have lots of electrical issues.

Mazman,

0-60 times are typically based on straight line performance. This has nothing to do with handling, or the "total package" that BMW offers. These numbers are a result of the BMW 335i's twin turbo six. I was just pointing out that the BMW is not that impressive based on what the Japanese have accomplished with turbo sixes in the past.
============================================

The Japanese have been known to have a fetish for extracting ridiculous amounts of horsepower from smaller displacement engines. Attaining over 100-hp per liter has been a favorite within the Japanese car industry for years - especially with forced induction motors.

So, you get gobs of power but engine wear and tear (engine life) is affected by this. Generally, such motors won't last long in the long run. The 335i is supposed to offer impressive performance while at the same time being able to last longer. Hence, BMW held back with the horsepower. Many feel, and I do to, that the 335i is actually underrated in terms of horsepower.

And why should I buy a 540i when the 530i suits me just fine? This isn't an E60 but an E39 5-series which I drive. Heck, I'd even be happy with the 525i. All I wanted was a prestigeous SPORTS SEDAN. When I was shopping for a car in 2001, the BMW 5-series was the best choice on the market, next to the Infiniti M. So yeah, I wanted the badge of course, but I am also a BMW fan and I feel I know what these cars are about.

Ricemaster,

What about all those folks who bought slowazz 530i and 323 and 330? Don't they deserve more HP to balance this "mysterious" BMW handling dynamic?
==============================================

You have to be one spoiled brat if you think a 530i is slow, or a 330i for that matter. The competition upped the game, BMW is reacting. So what? It is still a fact that BMW gave their cars enough power to be competitive, but the focus of their cars was ALWAYS handling. Get that into your head.


Now that BMW has stop jacking their customers and actually give them HP to keep up with the competition, BMW fanboys still making excuses. In the past when BMW was overcharging people for WAY WAY WAY TOO LITTLE HP/TORQUE, BMW fanboys only excuse was BMWs handling dynamic is more important than HP, the competition needed HP cuz they don't have the BMW handling.
==============================================

First, I am NOT a BMW fanboy. I love BMW, but I am not fanboy and I don't make stupid excuses about BMW. BMW is about handling, which is part of driving dynamics. I could care less what actual BMW fanboys say. I know what BMW is about. Period.


Obviously BMW disagrees with these fools and admit their cars are just SIMPLY TOO SLOW by adding power adders. So in order not to lose any future sales to the japanese onslaught, they have to cheat while their competition stays natural aspirated. Just wait for the new IS450H.
==============================================

What kind of bullshit are you spewing now? "Cheat"? If forced induction aids performance and fuel economy, then why not use it? Sure, using a turbo was pretty un-BMW-like, but you're forgetting that BMW had a turbocharged car before in the past: the 2002.

Also, the competition has upped the game. BMW is reacting. If they decided to use a turbocharger, that's their decision. If they wanted to, BMW could build a 3-liter+ engine with over 300-hp. Heck, almost every carmaker with the technical know-how could do that. BMW has that technical know-how, earned from the participation in motorsports etc.

Last thing Mr. Know-It-All. Lexus and Infiniti cars have the advantage that they're DESIGNED for the US market. BMW has to adjust their cars for EUROPE, ASIA and other markets besides the US. In some of these markets, horsepower or power output in kW is heavily taxed - such as Europe. You know what this means, smartass? You figure it out.

Look at the idiots , Mazman and RICEMASTER.

Still bringing up that crap about the "superior" old jap cars. Or maybe RICEMASTER is happy with his Civic Si that he tries to convince himself its better than a BMW , coz its lighter and cheaper and more reliable.
on the other hand, the troll Mazman is worried about the torque, wat a troll. THIS WAS BMW's philosophy u moron.

BMW530i

ur wasting ur time man with trolls. Dont b bothered by wat they say about ur 530i, it remains one of the best designs ever made ;)

QUESTION: CAN ANY OF YOU BMW HATERS AFFORD ONE... NO... IF YOU COULD UD BE DRIVING ONE YOUR JUST A HATER CAUSE THERE WORTH MORE THEN YOU GET PAYED EVERY DECADE

They got 0-60 in 4.9 secs. in the coupe in the october issue and the coupe has better handling.

Thanks M53R. ;)

Logical, no rappers care about who shares a platform with whom. The bottom line is they are driving a Bentley and you for that matter are not. Volkswagen uses its platforms in the exclusive Bentley Flying Spur and Audi uses its HVAC controls in the stunning Lamborghini.

Understand that Volkswagen is making a bold statement by allowing such prestigious brands to share its platforms and controls. What is happening as a result? Their respective sales are skyrocketing.

Logical, please the whole world knows BMW doesn't compare to Bentley or to Lamborghini. The Bentley is too luxurious to be bothered with the BMW and the Murcielago too fast.

Rolls-Royce, hahaha. Compete the Phantom to the Bentley Azure Mulliner.

Now we can talk about desireability and price. The Zure Mulliner goes up toa price of $394,000 and change.

Let's see the Phantom cross $370,000.

Logical, if you accept the fact that Audi uses better materials quality, has higher build quality for the interior and has a better layout along with being ergonomically more sound than BMW, I will accept the fact that BMW has better driving dynamics.

Fair?

Thank you for agreeing. Rolls-Royce doesn't make speciality versions of the Phantom. Therefore they can't get higher prices the way Bentley does for Azure Mulliner editions.

I don't think Rolls-Royce comes close to touching the specialty version Bentleys such as the Azure Mulliner or other highly limited editions.

Not only are these Bentleys harder to find because there are only a handful ever made, but the trick to owning the Bentley is if you want to drive it, go ahead. Meanwhile if you want to bask in the luxury you can do that too.

The Rolls-Royce is strictly a chauffered car.

I woud like to mention the Phantom comes in one model and one model only.

The Bentley through Mulliner uses customization and Bentley has even put microwaves in people's cars for them.

There is something about desireability and there is another thing about exclusivity through customization.

The Rolls probably wins to the layman in terms of desireability.

Those who are rich, and know exactly what they want, Bentley gives them the option of owning a Bentley that no other person has though almost exact customization.

AussieBimmerRep, & M53R

I can afford a BMW, and have owned several in the past. My comments are not based on the fact that I can't afford one its based on my past experiences with them. Among the BMW's I have previously owned are the following;

325ci, 325ci(again), 325i, 328i, and a 330xi. I now own a G35, and my next car will be an M45 Sport.

I have owned all these cars, and I am mostly likely younger and more successful than you are. I know this because you obviously don't have the class to be successful people.

Unlike you two, I am a confident man, who can drive an Infiniti because I respect what it offers. I can afford more than a G35 but I drive one because I truly love the car, and find it so fun to drive. Really guys, if I wanted to drive a 2001 BMW 530i I could sell my G35 and buy one, and have enough left over to buy a dependable Japanese car to get me around when my BMW is in the shop.

Truly the both of you drive a BMW to make up for something you are lacking.....I am sure we all know what that is. You're the type of guys that throw your BMW key chain on the table everytime you meet someone in a public place. You need the attention because obviously you have been deprived of it all of your lives, more than likely even by your own parents (they had a hard time accepting you, yes this is true).

Neither of you could own an Infiniti, or Lexus because it doesn't have the brand image to support your lack of confidence in yourselves.

Regarding the E39 530i, I too believe that it is a very attractive car. But lets be honest, we are all enthusiasts here. Therefore, we would all opt for the best performance variant we could afford. Obviously BMW530i couldn't afford more than that, I am sure he wouldn't refuse an M5 for the same price because, "he just doesn't need that much power".

Finally BMW530i, regarding your comments that BMW doesn't tune their engines to run on maximum performance???!!!! THAT IS BS!!!! Look at the first E46 M3 Engines, how many popped before those arrogant BMW people finally started replacing engines on their own tab? Did you know that several BMW M3 owners paid out of pocket for those repairs? Until BMW finally admitted their faulty engineering due to an overwhelming amount of reported cases!
You see thats the other part of why I am sick of BMW's its not just the way their over glorified, its the arrogance of the people that run it.
They blame their clients first when something goes wrong, and even after they pick up the tab they still don't admit they were wrong!!!! Talk about frustration! Its not just the HPs that the Japanese are putting out lately that has accounted for their current conquest sales over the Germans. Its the fact that they have always maintained consistancy when it comes to dependablity, and standing behind their product.
I have no respect for BMW530i's, AussieBimmerRep's, or, M53R's opinions, because they are so overly biased that logic bec

...becomes irrelavant. To make a statement that I criticize a Product because I can not afford it is just arrogant....come to think of it maybe you three are the right consumers for BMW.....

MAzdaman, what's this BS about the japs comquering the germans ?!

Do Lexus/Infinity/whomever sell over 1 million units per year across the globe ?!

And if all the germans have is prestige/heritage/image factor, why do they have the right products for the world, and the japs. only for the USA ?!

Do you really belive that the G35 will be faster on the Nring than the 335i ?!

DarkOneForce,

I didn't say the Japs have conquered the Germans, I described the increase of Japanese luxury brand sales as a result as conquest sales. Go look up what "conquest sales" means and then post again.

Is the G35 faster than the 335i on the Nuremberg Ring? Probably not...now if you add a couple of turbos to the G35's motor it probably would. Remember the Nissan Skyline GT-R was the first car to break 8 minutes on the Nuremberg, several years ago.

Mazman,

Finally BMW530i, regarding your comments that BMW doesn't tune their engines to run on maximum performance???!!!! THAT IS BS!!!! Look at the first E46 M3 Engines, how many popped before those arrogant BMW people finally started replacing engines on their own tab? Did you know that several BMW M3 owners paid out of pocket for those repairs? Until BMW finally admitted their faulty engineering due to an overwhelming amount of reported cases!
==============================================

The case with the M3 engines was unfortunate, fine. BMW could have hanlded it differently but they didn't. We can't go back in time and change things, so this will have to sit with BMW forever. Fine.



You see thats the other part of why I am sick of BMW's its not just the way their over glorified, its the arrogance of the people that run it.
They blame their clients first when something goes wrong, and even after they pick up the tab they still don't admit they were wrong!!!! Talk about frustration! Its not just the HPs that the Japanese are putting out lately that has accounted for their current conquest sales over the Germans. Its the fact that they have always maintained consistancy when it comes to dependablity, and standing behind their product.
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Very well said, Joseph Goebbels. Excellent propaganda. If I worked for Nissan, I'd hire you on the spot! Keep it up! Dipshit.



I have no respect for BMW530i's, AussieBimmerRep's, or, M53R's opinions....
========================================

Yeah? Well I don't give a shit about your opinion either, which smells BIASED as well. FYI, I try to be objective most of the time. Just because I said something which you disagree with, you call me biased? Wow...talk about immaturity.

BMW530i

My biases are based on personal experiences, not because I want to sell you a Infinit/Nissan Product. I would credit a Lexus/Toyota with the same amount of respect for quality, and durablity.

I was at one point a big fan of BMW, I remember watching them grow from the time they were labelled;
"Poor Man's Mercedes"

I am watching Infiniti grow the same respect and Heritage. Look at Lexus, their brand loyalty is one of the best! If Infiniti begins to get a fat head like BMW did, and starts sacrificing quality and reliablity while charging a higher and higher price over the years then I will jump ship just the same as I did with BMW.

I dont for see this in Infiniti's future, as the Japanese have a high level of Pride in every product they offer. Where as the Germans have a high level of Arrogance. I predict the Japanese will win this luxury car war with the Germans one day soon. However, the Germans are too arrogant to admit how close the Japanese are to defeating them.

mazdaman wrote:

DarkOneForce,

I didn't say the Japs have conquered the Germans, I described the increase of Japanese luxury brand sales as a result as conquest sales. Go look up what "conquest sales" means and then post again.

Is the G35 faster than the 335i on the Nuremberg Ring? Probably not...now if you add a couple of turbos to the G35's motor it probably would. Remember the Nissan Skyline GT-R was the first car to break 8 minutes on the Nuremberg, several years ago.

------------------------------------------------------

To conquer means for one to expand over another. The
germans aren't standing still, contrary to popular belive, so they're not exactly conquered, or in the position of being conquered.

In Japan, they're actually the ones expanding/conquering the premium merket BTW.

And what does adding turbos have to do with anything ?!
The faster M3 CSL is actually naturaly aspired, as is
a Porsche GT3/RS.
Does turbo = chassi tuning ?!

In theory at least, these cars are in the same class.

And please don't come up with things like the GTR, cause these are striped down cars comparable to the likes of the M3 CSL or M3 GTR street-legal.

mazdaman wrote:

BMW530i

My biases are based on personal experiences, not because I want to sell you a Infinit/Nissan Product. I would credit a Lexus/Toyota with the same amount of respect for quality, and durablity.

I was at one point a big fan of BMW, I remember watching them grow from the time they were labelled;
"Poor Man's Mercedes"

I am watching Infiniti grow the same respect and Heritage. Look at Lexus, their brand loyalty is one of the best! If Infiniti begins to get a fat head like BMW did, and starts sacrificing quality and reliablity while charging a higher and higher price over the years then I will jump ship just the same as I did with BMW.

I dont for see this in Infiniti's future, as the Japanese have a high level of Pride in every product they offer. Where as the Germans have a high level of Arrogance. I predict the Japanese will win this luxury car war with the Germans one day soon. However, the Germans are too arrogant to admit how close the Japanese are to defeating them.

----------------------------------------------------


Well the no. 1 manufacturer in recalls this year is actually Toyota, not any german manufacturer.

I don't give me this BS in arogance and PR crap, cause Toyota is right over there.

Have you even seen some of their comercials ?!

And why all of this, because they're cutting corners too.

And BTW, if you're complaining about prices you should come to Europe, to see how we do here.

Also you're not taking into consideration the fact that a G35 has 40% components from other Nissan's and that the yen is artificialy kept low by the jpanese central bank, why the germans have to struggle with a
powerfull euro.

And BMW's intention was never to be a "poor man's MB", they wanted to reach parity with MB, but to have their own identity/image.

Sorry if their goals were not to your liking.

Mazmam, I agree with you. I traded my BMW320D for a Lexus IS250 as it blew the turbo twice in less than 30000km now that was an unreliable POS. With my current car I am the happiest car owner and customer on the planet.

Mazmam, I agree with you. I traded my BMW320D for a Lexus IS250 as it blew the turbo twice in less than 30000km now that was an unreliable POS. With my current car I am the happiest car owner and customer on the planet.

Having had experience with a turbo charged BMW before, I wonder how long these turbos in the 335i are going to last before they blow.Ill never buy a BMW ever again considering their arrogance in dealing with customers. Lexus does a good job!

Your posts suggest you're really a Ricer...this is why you choose the 530i instead of the faster 540. You only want the car for the same reasons I do...the BMW badge!!
=================================

What does me choosing a 530i over a 540i have to do with my personality or desires? Does it matter whether the car is a 530i or 540i? You still have the BMW badge and you still get a fun to drive and sporty car. That’s all I wanted. The performance of the 530i suited me. Also, I bought my 530i used. One of my friends was selling his and I know that this guy treated his cars like he treats his wife – it was an excellent buy. One more thing. I find the performance of the 525i to be adequate. I WOULD NOT HAVE A PROBLEM with a 525i either.


When performance enthusiast confronts you about the slowazz 530(slower than accord/camry V6), you punk them into thinking you're all about handling and not power.
==============================================

Let me get this straight. If a V6 Camry beats me, I am supposed to feel ashamed or ripped-off? Well, I DON’T. First, the new V6 Camry is immensely powerful and it is a NEW car. Second, it looks and drives like a sleeping pill. Give me the slower but more fun to drive car. Incidentally, my 530i has a manual transmission.


If BMW was as good as you claim, why add more power just cuz the competition did? They still can't match the BMW driving dynamics right? If people bought BMW strictly for driving dynamic and nothing else, so why should it bother BMW that their cars are always getting burn in drag races by inferior driving dynamic cars?
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First, BMW’s are primarily made for handling. They’re given enough power to be competitive, but their main focus is on handling and driving dynamics. A lot of people who buy BMW’s are admittedly going for the badge – and know nothing about the brand. Those are the kinds of people who complain that their car got smoked by _____. Also, since when has straight-line performance been an indicator of a cars overall performance? How many roads are a straight line? Last time I checked, roads had curves. Some extreme ones too...

Second, Acura, Lexus and Infiniti products have the advantage of being designed for the US market, where power is king. The German brands have to adjust their models for a GLOBAL MARKET. That means no 250-hp 330i for Europe or a 330-hp 330i for America, they offer the same model in all markets with the same power output.


1) They're not as secure with themselves as they would like everyone to believe.
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Yes, BMW must have a small penis...


2) Their vehicles driving dynamic is over rated and simply not good enough despite their vehicles doing well in the market.
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What does a turbo have to do with driving dynamics? Sometimes, the crap you write really confuses me. A turbo is engine-related and h

Mazman,

My biases are based on personal experiences, not because I want to sell you a Infinit/Nissan Product. I would credit a Lexus/Toyota with the same amount of respect for quality, and durablity.
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I respect Toyota and all other brands, however some of their supporters on these boards are just tempting flame wars. I like to tell people "the truth", and then what happens? Flame wars erupt because most of the 12 year-olds on these boards are blinded by daddy's Infiniti or Lexus.


I dont for see this in Infiniti's future, as the Japanese have a high level of Pride in every product they offer. Where as the Germans have a high level of Arrogance. I predict the Japanese will win this luxury car war with the Germans one day soon. However, the Germans are too arrogant to admit how close the Japanese are to defeating them.
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Spare me. The Japanese are still a long way from ever catching up to the Germans. Why do most Americans think that just because the Japanese brands are doing well here, that they’ll dominate the world?

They won’t. At least not yet.

Ask your global world citizen which luxury car he prefers, and they’ll answer with Mercedes-Benz, Rolls Royce, Jaguar, BMW. Lexus? What’s that? Infiniti? Never heard of it. The Japanese brands might be superior to the Germans, but they totally lack brand image. Image is important everywhere else. You can’t really create brand image in decades, especially with something as complex as cars. Brand image has to be built over many decades, through innovation, success in motor sports etc. Oh, and last but not least, CLASSIC CARS have also done a lot to strengthen the brand image of the Europeans. Jaguar XK150? BMW 502 and 507, Mercedes 300SL Gullwing and 500K? Where are the Lexus, Acura and Infiniti equivalents? Where?

Heck, even in Japan, where these brands come from, people are still ignoring Lexus. The Japanese are among others, very image conscious. Check out the recent article on Businessweek that told of how wealthy Japanese preferred to spend their money on a BMW, Mercedes, Jaguar etc. basically European luxury brands. Lexus means squat over there.

Infiniti? You should know that they recently entered Russia. And they’re doing the classic Japanese luxury marque mistake: offering gas-guzzling engines in a market screaming out for diesels and smaller motors. Russia does have a wealthy upper class for whom this is no object, but move further west into Western Europe and you have wealthy folks who’d prefer a 730d over a 760iL. Bottom line, the Japanese luxury brands like Lexus (and Infiniti) are flopping (and will flop) because they’re offering American-style luxury which doesn’t fly over there.

The same applies to other parts of the world where there are expensive taxes on engine cc’s and power output. Middle East? Last time I checked, these guys still bought German.

Worse, you are

Worse, you are assuming that the Germans are sitting back and watching the show. They're not. The competition in this segment will become fiercer and fiercer.

Run flat tires SUCK,wait untill you are stranded 3 day's on your vacation.

which has a faster 0-60 time?

335i sedan with paddle shifters
or
335i sedan 6spd.

which has a faster 1/4 mile time??

335i sedan with paddle shifters
or
335i sedan 6spd??? please help because i am getting this car in a week and i want to know which to choose...i would like, of course, the faster vehicle...please helppp!!!!