European Study Shows That Volkswagen Vehicles Are Still The Cleanest Of All Diesel Models

Based on the US Government's tact and the reporting of the North American media with respect to the matter of Dieselgate, the key issue at hand is *NOT* real world emissions. It's cheating on the lab-test. That's where *ALL* the focus has been, this side of the pond. I doubt this article will change that.

The problem with the last statement is that there is no REAL WORLD standard to compare the emissions to. ALL of the standards are based on REPEATABLE and UNIFORM lab tests - and since we cannot produce repeatable tests in a world where the weather and temp actually change - that is how the tests HAVE to be.

The idea remains that when they tighten the emissions on the lab test - that there will be less emissions in the real world - although not necessarily the same things. Example - the US gas mileage standards are based on a lab test - and the results are not remotely close to real world gas mileage - BUT - as the MPG standards required better gas mileage - the cars in the real world also got better gas mileage - which is one reason why the USA is now energy independent from OPEC - cars actually use less gas.

TomM: Read my post at http://www.autospies.com/news/Consumers-Now-Believe-Automakers-Are-Liars-and-Cheats-What-Do-You-Think-89654/

Specifically where I wrote "...The success of consumer brainwashing is so complete that you'll even have people arguing on forums that we must continue to use the current (flawed and easily falsified) testing methodology for the sake of replicable consistency..." (almost 3 hours before your post)

I just want to add: Any flawed process that can be repeated with consistency will repeatedly and consistently deliver flawed results.

Input -> PROCESS -> Output
If the process is flawed, then no matter when input is provided, the output is garbage. Data Processing 101.

^^^
Typo correction: "If the process is flawed, then no matter *WHAT* input is provided, the output is garbage. Data Processing 101."

And I have been posting that statement for YEARS - however - to call it consumer brainwashing is simply going too far.

THe fact is - increasing mileage of cars on the Lab test DOES show up as increasing MPG in the real world - and while the actual numbers don't match up - the companies have indeed made progress in increasing gas mileage and reducing emissions in the real world too.

THe problem is that a real world test would be the one that is not repeatable and therefore flawed too. I think by now - people already know not to believe the gas mileage numbers on the cars - and they are basically only useful as a comparison between cars - not actual on the road number. However - ALthough I have always had a high performance car/cars (I still rebuild transmissions for drag racers and have for decades) - I also have always had a station wagon/van/now MiniVan - because I also have a gaggle of kids and dozens of grandchildren - and Today - with My Chrysler Mini-Van - I have no problem duplicating and actually beating the number that were on the label - often by 10% or there abouts. ANd that is with lots of kids in the car. On a recent trip to Florida - I averaged about 29MPG on the highway against a 25MPG rating. ANd while this depends highly on how I actually drove the van - it also points out another problem in real life - that the DRIVER and the Driving style is the biggest variable in real world tests - and it would be impossible to create a test that would remove that variable with a real driver.

Still - with the advent of self driving cars - I suspect a test using the computer to drive the car would be more consistent - even if other variable cannot be actually matched as well. (Weather among them)

The cleanest of all that are dirty...something to be proud of?

Having has a Mercedes Diesel back in the 1960's - I can say that todays diesels are far cleaner than they were back then. It was expected that on acceleration - you would get a big puff of smoke/carbon every time. And the early Diesels in cars were also slow. However - the fact is - the diesel combustion cycle is simply so different from gas engines - and the fuel itself is also not as clean - that they will never be equal at any time.

However - one must also remember that Hydrocarbons are given off by lots of other LIVING things. I recall a study where they found that in a National Park in the Northwest - the hydrocarbon levels in the air were worse than in Los Angeles. This was found to be because of the emissions coming off of PINE trees. And passing laws to force the trees to give off less emissions doesn't appear to work at all!!!

How much did VW pay for this news item?

"Who paid for this study" is a very valid question! I don't know the answer, but it does look suspicious in light of the Dieselgate scandal.

...in other news - Jaguar and Mini are found to be the winners in comparison tests organized by British car magazines..Evo and What Car.