Tesla's Musk Says He Wants To Talk Shop With Trump Over Job Creation

Oh to be a fly on the wall. You cannot bull shit a bull shitter...though Elon will try.

Curious to see how it goes.

Elon should come armed with a PowerPoint deck and a pledge to bring some jobs and/or more investments. Trump is tight with 'his' money.

Note that the Carrier jobs were 'saved' with Indiana taxpayer's money - not anytime coming from the Federal purse.

Trump did the dog and pony show yesterday with Masayoshi Son of Softbank, so he could stroke Masa's ego and also make him publicly on the hook for the BS in the PowerPoint deck. Trump did it to make Masa publicly accountable not to showcase Trump's deal-making prowess (contrary to what the liberal media says).

For the meeting to work, Musk must 'give' or offer to give something.

Notice how this is the opposite of how Obama doled out our hard-earned money - by giving the money first and asking questions later (or many times, NEVER asking questions since the money had been squandered - anyone recall "Solyndra"?).

Hopefully Trump and Elon parade down the Trump tower escalator and Donald holds another impromptu 'press conference' to put on record the BS that Mr. Musk is spewing.

@mre30: I agree with you on this one. For a narcissistic Trump, it's easy to handle him with a token shower of praise. Trump is as smart as a street vendor, Musk should not give him any BS. However, Trump seems to be fascinated with people with big words and big title - a polished PPT presentation with lots of pictures would do the trick.

Realistically though, I would expect Musk (if they ever meet) to provide an honest list of achievements he and his companies have done in the past 10 years and acknowledge the importance of government support in the drive for clean transportation.

There is no shame in accepting government help - a lot of scientific and technological breakthroughs came directly from government involvement - but it's not really fair to accuse Musk for using what's available to him to further his cause. The same government support is available for anyone involved in his industry.

Further, what he has done is open for everyone to see - not shrouded in mystery - and he single-handedly altered the course of not 1 but 2 important and deep-rooted industries: auto and space transport. Facts are abundant for those who want to know. A quick look at the current EV outlook can attest to that: all major European and Asian automakers are heavily invested in EV technology with Chinese companies as emerging forces to be reckon with. On top of that, the Chinese are on the verge of overtaking the leadership role in the Paris Climate Accord if Trump now changes the course.

For the US to be competitive in this new direction, it's imperative that the new administration continue the trajectory set forth in the last several decades. Ever since the industrial revolution, America has been at the forefront of scientific and technological innovations - it is even more urgent now that we keep the pace because emerging countries have been closing the gaps fast. Falling for short-term political gains to appease a small portion of the populace will cause long-term damage to the American strengths and global leadership.

If all that does not convince Trump, Musk can offer him a share in his Mars venture. Trump can post a sign on Mars and declare that he colonized it.

In a world of armchair critics, two people who wake up each morning asking "what can I GET DONE TODAY to make things better?"

(continued)

Although I don't know what Musk's intention in meeting with Trump, I would venture to guess that this is an olive branch to appease Trump's ego and to remind him of the importance of Tesla in the global push for EV development and its role in US economy. As shown in the article linked below, EV sales in the US have stalled while they have grown everywhere else. If the Trump administration does not support EV, the US will be left behind.

https://thinkprogress.org/china-to-boost-electric-vehicle-sales-10-fold-211053eb032b#.19spadvna

Translation: He wants to kiss Trump's ass to keep the free government money flowing in.

@MD: your subconscious is talking again. You're even dumber than BobM.

For anyone with reasons and demeanor to carry a civilized conversation, I will gladly provide a respectable retort. However, you two have consistently demonstrated that you are unable to move up from street level shouting match, so you will have to accept what I tell you - you're Dumb and Dumber (up to you two to choose which one fits you better).

The flaw with your argument is that Musk actually wants to end subsidies as long as they are also dropped for oil and gas. He has also said many times that the ZEV credits actually make Tesla less competitive against traditional auto makers (they effectively get 100% of the ZEV credit while Tesla has to sell them at 50% of face value). Also, Elon has achieved more than you would in one million lifetimes.

@BobM: you keep yapping about the $4.9B the LA Times fed you, so here are the numbers directly from the article:

http://www.latimes.com/local/la-fi-hy-musk-subsidies-box-20150530-story.html

TESLA MOTORS: $2.391 billion total

$1.29 billion — Nevada tax incentives for Gigafactory
$45 million — Value of discounted Department of Energy loan
$90 million — California Alternative Energy and Advanced Transportation Financing Authority
$517.2 million — Sale of California and other regulatory credits
$284 million — Estimated value of federal income tax credits for eligible U.S. buyers of Model S sedans
$38 million — Value of California rebate for California buyers of Model S sedans
$126 million — California Self-Generation Incentive Program
$647,626 — California job training reimbursement

SOLARCITY: $2.516 billion total
$750 million — New York State cost to build solar panel factory
$1.5 billion — Estimated value of 30% subsidy for solar installation since 2006, including at least $497 million in Treasury grants
$5.6 million — Oregon tax credits and rebates
$260 million — New York local property tax exemptions

SPACE EXPLORATION TECHNOLOGIES: $20 million total
$20 million — Texas state and local incentives and rebates for space launch facility near Brownsville


Assuming these numbers are correct, a total of ~$1.8B ($284M for Tesla and $1.5B for Solar City) came from Federal government - $497M in grants for Solar City and ~$1.3B in tax credits !! The rest came from states and most also involved tax credits. The entire sum is over the period of ~10 years. Over that same period, how much did Trump pay in taxes ?

Remember that with tax credits you don't get squash if you don't owe any taxes to begin with. And the credits are split between individual car/home owners and Tesla/Solar City in the form of leases.

For comparison, US tax payers lost $9.3B in the bailout for GM and Chrysler. The money came straight from Federal coffer, no string attached.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/money/cars/2014/12/30/auto-bailout-tarp-gm-chrysler/21061251/


Now back to MD comment: "He wants to kiss Trump's ass to keep the free government money flowing in"

I already minced my words calling him dumb. Just take a look at the list above and tell me what Trump can do that would benefit Musk personally, or Tesla for that matter ?

Tesla would have exhausted the federal tax credits by end of 2017 or early 2018, even if Trump wanted and successfully repeal legislation, Tesla would not hurt one bit. Tesla would do just fine without the incentives - but I am not so sure about other brands.

Although I don't know what Musk's intention in meeting with Trump, I would venture to guess that this is an olive branch to appease Trump's ego and to remind him of the importance of Tesla in the global push for EV development and its role in US economy. As shown in the article linked below, EV sales in the US have stalled while they have grown everywh

(continued)

Although I don't know what Musk's intention in meeting with Trump, I would venture to guess that this is an olive branch to appease Trump's ego and to remind him of the importance of Tesla in the global push for EV development and its role in US economy. As shown in the article linked below, EV sales in the US have stalled while they have grown everywhere else. If the Trump administration does not support EV, the US will be left behind.

https://thinkprogress.org/china-to-boost-electric-vehicle-sales-10-fold-211053eb032b#.19spadvna

@BobM: point out which number from the list above makes it a "SCAM" ? if it still doesn't get through your head, those numbers are TAX CREDITS !! Tesla as well as all other companies making similar products will have the same benefits.

Did you ever claim a tax credit in your income tax returns ? if so, does it make you a scammer ?

Speaking of scam, Trump is the ultimate SCAM we all have witnessed. I suppose your post "a person who's net worth is almost $12 BILLION dollars. And I may add has NOT paid any Taxes on any of these companies of his" refers to your King Trump (although his net worth maybe a fraction of the $12B).

If you don't like how Musk runs his company, you can either short the stock to the ground, or buy into it and use your voting power to vote him out. Spewing your hatred here only pollutes this site and does no good to any body.

Agreed, I'm not seeing any logic behind the scam comment. Tesla has received far fewer subsidies than other manufacturers, has actually created 35,000 high-paying jobs (versus shit coal jobs), and has not done anything tax-wise that other manufacturers and Trump himself wouldn't have done.

Just to see if you are really so one sided, what about HenryN's comment on the US losing $9.3B in the bailout for GM and Chrysler. Remember the CEO's of GM, Chrysler, and Ford taking private jets to go beg for handouts?

Do you think that was a scam? Or do you have a double standard?

0 evidence to back up that comment