2018 Lexus LS versus the Germans

When Lexus first came out, they competed against Mercedes by giving you a similar product for a whole lot less money.

Today, Lexus does not compete with "The Germans." They have their own market of devout followers who value few initial defects, relatively low maintenance costs, a high level of apparent luxury, and noteworthy fit and finish. These devout follows either like Lexus's "polarizing" styling, or are willing to put up with it to get what they want.

The says of a prospective buyer scratching his chin and going "lemme see... Mercedes or Lexus?" are long over.... unless we're talking Mercedes' bottom end.

Steve, sadly so, I sense a bit of passive aggressiveness in your description of Lexus compared to your more relaxed and mature commentaries. Undoubtedly, the S-Class is the benchmark and I hold that car dear, but the LS was able to shake things back then, and I foresee it will again do some damage. Further, the new LS will easily put the 7 on check, and leave the A8 in more precarious situation against Genesis.

carsnyc: What you "sense" is in your imagination. I truly believe if what a consumer values most is few initial defects, relatively low maintenance costs, a high level of apparent luxury, and noteworthy fit and finish, then Lexus is a smart choice! And lots of people make that decision.

I've owned several BMWs. I didn't get them because of low maintenance costs. In fact, BMWs are amongst the most expensive cars us common folk can own (I'm excluding Bentleys and such, products for the Uber-Rich). I got my various BMWs because I loved the feel and the look... and admittedly, I liked the feeling of being a BMW owner (yeah, that's the smell of Status-seeking you detect).

Today, I drive a 2015 Audi Q5, knowing that it's going to cost me considerably more over the long haul than a Lexus, but I love the styling inside and out, and I can't say that for the Lexus (that's a 100% subjective statement, BTW). I honestly can't tell you if I'm over the status-seeking thing: on one hand, some people see Audi as a luxury car comparable to Mercedes (i.e., a poor man's Mercedes?) while others see it as a less reliable Lexus or worse, so I don't *think* I'm a status seeking (but I honestly can't tell you if I truly am, or if I'm over that to a great degree). I just know I like my car, even though it's not as prudent a financial decision.

So I don't see what you mean by me being "passive aggressiveness". I give credit to Lexus, although it's not my cup of tea, almost entirely due to styling. In fact, Lexus was one of the first places I looked when I was shopping for a new vehicle (because I believe they're noteworthy vehicles), but I disliked their styling so much, I dismissed them.

I think it will out perform the germans....

In terms of quality (durability and reliability) it already does.

I have changed my thinking in the last 3 years of Mercedes ownership. The regular 'scheduled maintenance of $1,200 +, the loose front strut, replaced oil pan gaskets, and other issues, I am getting rid of my C300 before the warranty expires and the bills go even higher. I am getting the IS 300 F-Sport. Sure, it is slightly less roomy than the MB, but the reliability and build quality plus more features have me convinced.

That sucks. In contrast my parents were upset that their 2011 RX needed new shocks for a few hundred and the battery finally needed to be replaced...

I have owned several Mercedes - and had good luck with all but one of them - a 1973 450SE. Remember - I am a mechanic (Trans rebuilder) and do my own maintenance though. My 450SEL 6.9 literally had nothing go wrong with it - and I was not expecting that with the NEW Hydro-pneumatic suspension and high performance engine . My current S600 - which are noted for problems after 3 years - has had 1 coil go bad in almost 3 years. I would have expected a loose front strut to be a manufacturing issue that would have been covered by warranty. Unless there was impact damage - I would suspect the same for the Oil pan gasket too. Maybe I have a higher threshold for problems since I know what can go wrong. The problem with ALL these high end cars in the obscene prices they get for replacement parts - which in many cases are not available in an aftermarket unit. $1200-1500 struts are not uncommon in higher end special suspensions that sell in too few numbers to have aftermarket interested in making replacements - but that was true of the air suspensions in Lincolns for years too. The reason why they are so expensive to fix is that the higher end cars all get the new gadgets first - and that does not leave out Lexus. Many Lexus vehicles that are not based on otherwise Toyota cars - have no aftermarket for many parts too. THe RX is not a fair comparison - being a Toyota in Disguise - something the LS is not.

The owners of these cars are the guinea pigs for all sorts of new things that don't break by the time they get to the mainstream cars (Anti-lock brakes was a great example where complexity had been reduced by orders of magnitude) Add in that the dealer mechanic has to figure out the problems - which are already known by the time the car hits the used car market.

For these types of cars - I would be looking for a long term stable service department where people stay for long times. Normally that is a smaller - local dealership - with involved ownership - instead of a chain. I had a dealership where the service manager was from Germany - and was with the same dealership here for more than 40 years before retirement.

Tom, how long do you keep your vehicles on average? If I were in a position to buy a new car every 3 years I'd probably buy a benz since reliability is a non-issue. The problem is that if you are forced to buy used or keep them longer, it gets a bit out of hand. Especially since most of us aren't mechanics so we have to cover the labor costs.

The Lexless spindle grill is absolutely hideous.

This is the kind of feel the 7 Series needed. The look is sensational.

Too big of a vehicle to have so much Lexus-ugly on it.

For sure the Germans are slipping. I owned a 335i which was fun but troublesome. Just drove a new E350 for a week and was extremely unimpressed. It just seemed cheap and flimsy. Porsche is a different story, but it is in a different price league.

I take my criticism back from a few weeks ago - the interior is truly amazing!!!