REVIEWS: USA today confirms Auto Spies rave review of the new Lexus ES350

Can I buy the Lexus ES350 with a 4-cyl?

And doesn't this car look kind of fat?

When the GS & IS sedans came out, I was surprised to see a Lexus with some interesting design cues (All of which are just another version of BMW's flame surfacing technique). That said when the ES came out, it was so ugly and similiar looking to the GS & IS, that I started to dislike their design too.

If anything is to back my point on Lexus's being nothing but a refined Toyota, this is it. In fact this model from Lexus literally is just a rebaged Toyota. Camry to be exact.

Excellent engine for ES350. If some dont like it, its their opinion but to be honest this car is not ugly at all. We can fine much uglier car among Japaneeses or German luxury cars!

GS and IS have no flame surfacing, and ES is not a rebadged Camry, any more than an A6 is a rebadged Passat, or a G35 is a rebadged 350z. Its called platform sharing, and everybody does it.

Typical Toyota bashing, with nothing new to add.

You couldn't possibly be as stupid as you seem. But who knows....

"GS and IS have no flame surfacing, and ES is not a rebadged Camry, any more than an A6 is a rebadged Passat, or a G35 is a rebadged 350z. Its called platform sharing, and everybody does it. "

The only difference is the A6 isn't based on the Passat platform.

In fact, it's not based on any VW platform at all.

Audis based on VW platforms:

TT- LOOSELY based on GTI platform. I say "loosely" because it was re-worked with 70% aluminum.

A3- GTI platform.

Q7- Again, LOOSELY based on Cayenne/Touareg platform. It was stretched six inches and the off-road gear was taken off.

I disagree with you. A lot of folks on here preconceive the notion that a Lexus ES is a just a rebadged Toyota. Its a division of Toyota but it doesn't look or feel or even drive for that matter like a Camry. The chassis may be based off of a Toyota Camry, but everything else has been upscaled to meet par with Lexus which is pretty stringent. With that said, I must say that even for all the "Toyota" cars its level of quality surpasses many auto makers amongst the likes of Cadillac, Ford, Lincoln and even some European brands. This review for the Lexus ES couldn't be said the same for a Toyota Camry, and why? Because its not a Toyota Camry.
It's no different than saying that an Audi is just a rebadged Volkswagen, which from my personal experience, have very poor build quality.

I have owned an A6, driven my son's outgoing A4 many times, an S4 Cabriolet currently, and also an A3 as my winter car.

And build quality is the least of their problems- in fact, they don't have any problems at all. No reliability glitches beyond a broken headlight washer cap on my A6, no creaky parts, no cheap materials at all, and, best of all, very satisfying owners' experiences. I've gotten to know one salesman that I always use, and oddly for Audi, my dealer is about as accomodating as my wife's Lexus dealer.

To say VW/Audi have poor build quality is like saying Toyota/Lexus have poor reliability. They're basically KNOWN for their GREAT build quality- best-built interiors in the business.

S4,
Maybe you just got lucky with a good batch of Audi cars. I've had an A6 and A4 that gave me numerous problems. BTW - Audi/Volks was never a recommended vehicle on any consumer reports for reliability. I could be somewhat wrong, but Consumer Reports is not a bias opinion against any makes.

"BTW - Audi/Volks was never a recommended vehicle on any consumer reports for reliability. I could be somewhat wrong, but Consumer Reports is not a bias opinion against any makes."

Great. And that makes a difference in my Audis' basically flawless track records, how?

We were talking about build quality, not reliability, BTW. And Audi has the best build quality in the business, bar none.

so.. i was at the taste of lexus .. and the es350 is a pretty decent auto.. but heres the bad part.. seems like lexus's, as reliable as they are, arent meant for rough driving. A brand new LS460, had its check engine light on after a couple of laps with a pro driver.. hmm.. as long as you dont drive your lexus like a bmw. your fine.. i guess :) .. oh btw.. no hate on lexus.. their good cars.. :)

SSP350,

Agreed.

You can't post a comment nowadays without somebody pointing out that a car manufacturer shares parts. So what? Every large car company in the world does this.

Sharing parts with Toyota is a positive thing. I completely agree with you about your VW/Audi comments as I have owned both.

I prefer the cabin design of the last-generation ES 330 to this interation.

This is a surprisingly nice car. Especially for entry-level. I test drove one and my area is infamous for bad rail road tracks and the ES went over them like a cloud. I was very impressed. In fact, my dad has ordered one and is going to pick it up in a couple of days.

I don't get it. It's not German.

hahahahha... that was hilarious.

Probably the perfect car for people who don't like cars

autoegr, plenty of companies survive on that.
gm and ford notably.

Its more an E-Class, 5-Series competitor since its options can easily run the price over $40k and its not as compact as the IS.

I'm not saying that it's a boring car but everyone I've seen driving it so far has been an old man.

If it is perceived by some as a 5-series and E-class competitor, wouldn't it also compete with the GS sedans as well?

Wow! That's really boring!

Exactly!!!

That is the point. I don't know why you expect a luxury only car to be a sports sedan. If you didn't know let point it out - Lexus didn't want this car to be sporty. That is why there are two entry level cars in the Lexus line up.

But the IS really isn't sporty at all. I drove one, and between the bad brakes, nose diving and rolling through corners, I failed to see how this car could be considered a sports sedan.

aefsc430,

You can go ahead and say it's boring. I don't mind.

"1970toyotamarc"

How are you going to argue Lexus L-Finesse design program doesn't incorporate any flame surfacing design cues. The GS has a "Bangle Butt" for christ sake!

Also for your information the Audi A6 is on it's own platform, not a Passat's. That said I won't argue the fact that there is most definitly a VW feel to Audi, but how that compares to the Toyota feel of a Lexus is ultimately...un-comparable.

Unlike Lexus for the most part, Audi creates it's own technology & ideas seperate from that of VW. In fact VW incorporates more of Audi's technology than Audi does VW, and VW's the parent company...So what does this tell you? Audi is their own company under outside ownership by VW!

VW didn't create Audi like Toyota created Lexus. I'm just trying to get ya to understand. What can I do?... To get ya to understand?

Thank you.

(A standing ovation)

"1970toyotamarc"

How are you going to argue Lexus L-Finesse design program doesn't incorporate any flame surfacing design cues. The GS has a "Bangle Butt" for christ sake!

Also for your information the Audi A6 is on it's own platform, not a Passat's. That said I won't argue the fact that there is most definitly a VW feel to Audi, but how that compares to the Toyota feel of a Lexus is ultimately...un-comparable.

Unlike Lexus for the most part, Audi creates it's own technology & ideas seperate from that of VW. In fact VW incorporates more of Audi's technology than Audi does VW, and VW's the parent company...So what does this tell you? Audi is their own company under outside ownership by VW!

VW didn't create Audi like Toyota created Lexus. I'm just trying to get ya to understand. What can I do... To get ya to understand.

Im really not saying its boring. I'm just making an observation.

You say that the LS460 had a DTC(check engine light)after a test drive?well it must have been a loose gas cap,because Lexus and Toyota are very sensitive when it comes to Evap!!Me being a tech for Toyota,I know Lexus and Toyota well,they may not handle like a BMW but they are tough cars!I don't think that driving it hard would cause a DTC.

well.. if driving a ls460 rough means the gas cap gets loose then i dont want one at all..kinda dangerous dont ya think? oh and btw genius .. since when does a gas cap set off the check engine light? .. whats your next excuse .. " it was a pre-production prototype.. haha.. pleaseee.. the cars are meant for the old.. and the slow drivers.. oh and a plus was that the ls460 did handle very close to a 750i ... so i guess you dont know lexus and toyota as well as you would like too .. mr. tech ;)

Just curious, are you a woman?

curiousity killed the kitty.. now mike either you are a really pro lexus guy/girl.. (NOT SURE ABOUT U EITHER BUDDY) .. like many others on this site.. who just cant hear nething bad about their perfect cars.. while the bmw fans.. actually give harsh criticism to bimmers.. now why is that? so the question is.. are you a narrow minded woman.. or a thickheaded man.. oh and as far as my gender is concerned .. ill leave that to ur imagination.. :) .. dont go too wild now.. haha ..

"while the bmw fans.. actually give harsh criticism to bimmers.. now why is that?"

Oh, please!

All BMW fans on this site think their cars were created by God himself!

They're all single-minded, except a lucky few.

BMW owners give harsh criticism to their favorite cars on this website???

Yeah right - which comments have you been reading?

oh.. it was just a matter of time b4 lil willy had to put up his two cents.. Will.. you should be on Yo Momma.. cuz the stuff you say is more funny then important.. yes a check engine light can be activated by a gas cap evap.. i know that einsteins.. but how does a brand new lexus LS... the car with 100% fit and finish ..(psshhh).. have a loose gas cap.. and on top of that enough evap to cause a check engine light to come on .. hmm.. makes your think doesnt it.. ill try and loosen all my cars gas caps for half and hour and see if the check engine light comes on.. prolly wont.. oh and btw .. bmw fans on this site.. do point out ups and downs about bmws... and they do the same thing for lexus.. you guys just have to get ready to defend.. and cant just accept the facts.. its ok though .. i think bmw fans like being on the offenseive.. haha.. "the ball is never in your court.. you can have it after we score.. and try to catch up "

Come to think of it, if my Corolla's gas cap is off the slightest bit, I get a check engine plus another warning symbol on my dash.

for what it's worth, toyota/lexus have both HIGH STANDARDS and highly SENSITIVE monitoring computers.

the check engine light once came on, on my 1994 toyota truck. i naturally pulled over at the first opportunity to see if i could find anything obviously wrong. the coolant was just a tad low.

added about a pint or so. in less than a mile, the light went out. it has NEVER come on again. truck still trucks on, with total reliability.

Wow, we're really back to this crap again?

Look, in an age where some BMW's and Benzes are made in the U.S.A., where Lamborghini is owned by VW, where Chrysler uses "Dr. Z" in commercials, and Jettas come from Mexico, we consumers should focus on the end result. The damn car.

If the new ES and Camry share a platform who cares? If you like the ES that is all that matters.

"You guys seem to be forgetting that having Toyota as the parent company isn't exactly a bad thing. Toyota is the most successful car maker in the world, so it is no big surprise for it to be the parent company of anything, and no big pitfall for it to be the parent company of a luxury auto maker. The relationship that Audi and VW have and Toyota and Lexus are very different. Also, each have their pluses and minuses that make Lexus and Audi unique from each other and can also be appreciated for their qualities by an openminded person."

Very nice. I know Toyota isn't a bad brand to be based on-- but too many people have said Audi is to VW as Lexus is to Toyota. Lexus shares more platforms with Toyota than Audi does VW, and Lexus leaves them basically unchanged. This can be percieved as either a good or bad thing. I don't dislike the Lexus brand; my wife drives one. I try to keep an open mind, but if a car like the unimaginative new LS comes out (styling-wise), and people are calling it the most gorgeous Lexus ever, I just can't contain myself.

"Name one car in the Lexus line-up other than the ES or the SUVs that shares a platform with a Toyota."

There are none, which is exactly what I was saying. There are four Lexus models based off of unchanged Toyota platforms, while the only platform Audi uses that is only marginally changed is the A3/GTI. The Q7 platform is modified from the Cayenne/Touareg in that it is half a foot longer and eschews the cliché'd off-road gear, and the TT is 70% aluminum and 30% steel, which makes it quite different from the GTI's all-steel body.

LOVELY LOVELY LOVELY!

"...and with the name of a high profile luxury automaker"

and there are NO FOUR cylinder lexuses either, unlike some other "prestige" brands.

is220d is a 4 cylinder.

That is a diesel engine - I believe it was made to appease the fuel conscious Europeans who like to have their S-classes with V-6 engines. It is again just like Toyota to give the customers exactly what they want instead of trying to get to like something they don't need.

"with the reliability of a rock"

doesnt that give it the same reliability as a chevy.. :)

giving the customer what they want? if they were any good a that, all lexuses would have diesels.
giving them something they don't need? how about 2 giant suvs, instead of 1? or hybrids?
s classes do very well with v6 engines, if you can spec it up to 550 spec or more and it still gets like 33 UK mpg AND costs less initially, why not?
there should be a lexus GS 250 and IS200, and a GS diesel, which is absolutely essential in that market, i acually can't believe they don't have one. i NEVER see e class petrols here.

Rupert - In Europe "Lexus" is behind in offering diesels and smaller engines. I believe it is because Toyota thought that giving their "Luxury" cars economy type engines would hurt image. It is probably now apparent to them that more people europe are looking for the smaller engines that is shunned in the US. It has been one year since they have been out in Europe, so we should give it a few more years and Lexus will be giving Europeans what they want, just they do in America.

Also Giant SUV's are need (Lexus has one Giant SUV - the LX and one midsize one the GX - which one is the second Giant?), I don't want to take 5 yaris' when I go across town ;).

But if you look at the Toyota and Lexus lineups they have something that fits in every class (unless you are obsessed with German cars or BMW's). This is why they have two entry level cars, Toyota has two suv's in each class to serve the purpose of everybody - whether more offroad based or better pavement ride. Toyota looks at what people need and then gives it to them. Now do other companies do this, yes.

Don't worry Lexus will probably have the smaller engines and fake leather in Europe soon - I just hope they don't bring them here.

giant suv here means anything bigger than an x5, or anything truck based.
and i meant toyota, not lexus. non-premium big cars have no place in the european market, they don't sell. look when ford tried to sell the explorer, it bombed. the LC (what we call the toyota version of the gx) and LC amazon (our Land cruiser) and the nissan pathfinder are the only non-premium big suvs on the market. (i count the touareg as premium, and it's non-truck based).
here we realise we don't need a huge car, hence many mini-mpvs with 7 seats, like the zafira, s-max, scenic, espace etc.
there are 7 seat suvs, but not too many giant ones. (and believe me, a gx/lC/4runner is a BIG car here. it is completely out of touch with the market, we want crossovers! there aren't any truck based ones here! and we care zilch about off-road ability.
lexus' line-up is lacking, not enough engines, no wagons, just the RX. toyota's line-up is lacking too, all (bar new rav-4) are outdated and dull, and the hyundai santa fe offers good competition for the rav-4 too, and the rav-4 doesn't have 7 seats here.
2 entry level cars? if you mean lexus, then no. we don't get the ES. if you mean toyota, then yes. we get the aygo, a very small car, and the yaris, a slightly bigger car. the corolla isn't worth talking about here, it is outclassed, the avensis (passat sized) is nothing compared to the passat or laguna or vectra, the LC and LC amazon are dinosaurs. toyota offers nothing special over other manufacturers here. it is out of touch with the european market place, offering boring, american friendly cars. no good-handling cars, no luxurious cars, no special or "different" cars, just fairly dull styling and dull image.
and " It has been one year since they have been out in Europe,"
umm....lexus has been here for at least 13.

"stylish look" ohh please.


G

'with stylish looks'

Questionable. VERY questionable.

VEEERRRRYYYY questionable!

"Not really. It looks better than any Cadillac, or Lincoln, and the 3-Series, and 5-Series, and the TL, and pretty much any other car I can think of that compares to the ES. Except the E-Class."

Except for the E-Class comment (it's pretty beautiful), all of that is completely objective. I think the 3 and 5 are very good-looking cars (I used to hate them, but the more I saw them the more I liked them), especially the new 3 coupe. Look for it at your local BMW dealer- it's stunning. TL is a good-looking and nicely appointed car, but I'd have to go with the ES350 over that one, but thank God I don't have to make that choice.

The Cadillac STS is quite a nice-looking car, and wait for the new CTS before you rag on it like that.

And by the way, the ES may be eye-pleasing, but it's on the ultra-bland end of generic.

The ES does look quite good in person, pictures don't do it justice.

Will, eye-pleasing and boring can by synonymous. As long as you're not offended by it, it's eye-pleasing, but it doesn't captivate you with its good looks, either, so it's pretty generic.

kart1- I've seen it. It looks like a Lexus. To some this is percieved as a good thing, to others, not so much.

The ES 350 does look good in pictures, however, in person it looks beautiful.

Many people perceive Audis to be boring and generic looking cars with big square grilles. I understand the Audi design, though. I think they are understated, masculine, Germanic/Bauhaus(if you will) designs. Audis remind me of a classic, fine-crafted watch.

The same applies (not the same attributes, of course) with the Lexus ES 350. The ES 350 in person looks very sleek, slippery, elegant, luxurious, and even - dare I say - sexy. It has a feeling like it is in motion, or, it is like a blade cutting through air.

I like it.

Oh, by the way, the e90 seems to only look good in gold... :S

"since when does a gas cap set off the check engine light?"

haha - you have to be kiddin me. You do know that modern cars do get the engine check light on because of a loose gas cap. And you are trying to make fun of other people. Don't look like an idiot yourself first okay.

ehh.. read my response first.. mmmk.. bud.. i was referrin to the car at hand :) .. sory that you got confused

I am almost 100% certain that the LS 460 would classify as a modern car.

mmmmmmk, so, like watever, like explain urself? mmmk?

sory that we dunt understaynd

Well whether you were referring to the LS 460 or cars in general for both it is the same. Trust me if a $15k Corolla can get the check engine light on, then a $65k LS 460 will have the check engine light come on as well for the gas cap.

I think you are confused, because the way you worded that phrase, "since when does a gas cap set off the check engine light?" it means all cars in general. If you buy a car fromt the dealer, the person who delivers the car (the one goes over the manuals, keys, functions of buttons, etc) also tells you that if you don't tighten the gas cap until it clicks you will get a check engine light. It is also written on the gas cap (At least it is written on the one from my car).

Woah, Wilco, you're right!

All of MikeG's posts have disappeared!

Was he booted from the website or something?

Because if he was, I can think of many people who deserve that more than him... I'm not going to name names... but they think they're logical.

It is definitely wierd.

Isn't it true the Lexus ES350 is simply a streched version of the Toyota Corolla?

Long wheel base if you will.

MikeG,
I'm with you on that one.

lol thanks!

Speaking of 'Yo Momma'

"Yo momma so stupid, she paid $40k for a Camry-derived ES."

At least she didn't pay $40k for a Passat which breaks down twice a month ;).

"At least she didn't pay $40k for a Passat which breaks down twice a month ;)."

Do you mean an actual Passat, or a non-Passat-based Audi, because there's no Audi based on the Passat?

VWs are better than you think. They have a thing that Toyota can't seem to figure out; it's called character.

S4 - I was talking about the actual passat. Character maybe harder to get for all business Toyota, but reliability should be easier for VW who needs to get their quality management in order. It looks really bad that a company like VW has so many bad reviews about reliability. You see you don't get all of the character until you drive the car, but the reviews get seen by everyone who watches the news (that's alot more people).

Has anyone else noticed that Lexus tends to be attracting many geriatrics as of late? I really do worry about them...what's going to happen 10, 15, 20 years from now?

I know no one in my generation seriously wants a Lexus.

Are you sure that you are referring to your generation or just your circle of 3-4 Audi fans.

Will, you DO live in a southern state, and we all know that the south isn't the most intelligent part of the US--lots of backward thinkers there.

Go to Connecticut, Vermont, upstate New York you'll see more Audi's than Lexus.

El34 what the hell are you talking about?the Corolla only shares a platform with the Matrix!
I have seen the underbody components of the ES350,and to me it's more simular to a Avalon than to a Camry,
the Camry is smaller than the ES350...

2JZSoarer, go and check the dimensions of the Camry and the ES350 and you will discover they are the same to the tenth of an inch.

Thus, I would say the ES350 is an upgraded Camry and may very well be born out of the Totota Corolla.

Now the Toyota Cressida turned into the Avalon/GS.

the last generation ES was designed FIRST, then the camry version came along.

so rather than the ES being a fancy camry, the fact is the camry is a decontented ES!

i can't verify the same holds true for the '07 ES and '07 camry. but what does it matter? EVEN the CAMRY outclasses EVERY german car in reliability and especially electronic components. so does the COROLLA for that matter.

lexus is in LEAGUE OF ITS OWN.

The ES is a beautiful car, the interior is amazing and it has the reliablilty that none of the german cars has. It is very fast and some tests prove that it can do 0-60 in less than 6.8 claiming it can do it in 6.4 and 6.2. A 3.5 engine that gives this power is quite impressive. This car kept up with an older version E500 until 200km/h. Isn't that impressive? As for handling, it handles well enough for driving in the city and on highways, it's not like you drive to your work on a bloody race track. When can you ever relax in a 5 series? it's too stiff and rigid to be able to do that. On the other hand, you have an incredible sound system in the car, comfort, silence and it costs much cheaper than a 530 or an E320. It is based on the camry, what is so bad about that? They just share the same platform and they made a MMMUCH better camry which is refined and world class luxury comes in it.
As WILL said, you guys just can't accept the fact that the car is better than the cars you like.

I agree with you 2JZsoarer. On other thoughts do u own a soarer? if yes check out the SC300 that does the quarter mile in 9.59 seconds on youtube.

I sure as hell would not pay 40k for rebadged VW(Audi)!!!I'll stick to my rebadged Toyota (SC300 twin turbo),at least mine does not break down every 3,000 miles!!!VW and Audi is just a bunch of cheap German/Mexico made crap !!!

"I sure as hell would not pay 40k for rebadged VW(Audi)!!!"

Oh, you are an idiot!

My S4 Cabriolet can blast your car, anywhere, any time, and it never, ever breaks down!

You are SO biased!

In fact, my Audi reliability experience has been slightly better than with my wife's Lexuses!

I buy them every week.

And I think I can afford just about anything, thank you.

Not only does it break down every 3000 miles but it will give you a very hard time getting to these 3000 miles. German cars are just crap!!

i was just browsing the latest Consumer Reports guide to new cars.

towards the end of every car review, they present the reliability track record.

ALL german cars have terrible problems with the electrics and to a lesser degree, power eqpt. VW is the worst, but audi, bmw, and even MB have problems too.

many also have problems with the ENGINE after only a few years. UNTHINKABLE and INEXUSABLE in this age where even korean cars have totally reliable engines.

many german cars have more problems after just 2 or 3 years, than the cheapest toyotas and hondas after 8 years.

i'm not saying all german cars are TOTAL crap. some are fun to drive. some have nice interiors. but apparently ALL have crappy electrical systems.

Ok, the biggest problem we have here is that you are in the UK and I am in the US, so our point of view is relative of where we are. I realize I can't make an accurate prediction for Europe since I don't live there and am heavy influenced by the typical American demands (Big cars, bigger engines ;) ). For the American market Toyota's line up is very good. I guess after reading your comment I see what is more of a demand in Europe (thanks for the information).

In terms of comparison, I would compare the new LS460 to an E Class.

For no reason, EL34 is just narrow-minded against Lexus, thats all. From what I've read he's extremely bias against Lexus. I pretty much just ignore him, Wilco.

Oh, by the way, the new S-Class looks like a kit car now with wheel arches and that. Its beginning to look like it comes equipped with a body kit instead of OEM parts.

SSP350, I'll bet you a dollar to a doughnut the next Lexus will have wheel arches, because after all, we know that Lexus never makes a move until they copy a Benz, BMW or an Audi.

Wilco, now you know better than that, the Lexus is a Toyota which has been dressed up to make more profit.

Will, wouldn't you agree the new LS460 looks like a BMW 5 series?

It does to me.

S4 you won't stand a chance,my SC300 has a 2JZ-GTE and it's moded.So stop making me laugh!
I killed a modified Audi at the drag strip,I don't know what the hell it was since they all look the same!

I'm not tryin to bash Toyota... I mean Lexus, but imho tha new ES looks horrible. It has no style what so ever.

I know you Lexus fans are droolin over it but i just cant figure out why. And by tha way that brown color looks like "crap". Last generation ES I really liked, but this one is very disappointing.


G

I'm not being bias to any extent about any car. I do perfer BMW just out of prefference, but I also like other brands as well.

So even tho I dislike new ES, I do think that IS350 looks way better than 3 Series sedan, but 3 series coupe is another story.


G

Refugee
ES350 is like a JEWEL.Reflects pure craftsmanship.

JUGNU

wilco is mikeg?


*confusion*

S4cabriofox: you don't know crap about quality or reliability. Build quality and reliability are practically the same thing.

Just because you got a "reliable" car in the bunch doesn't make the rest of their cars, highest build quality or reliable car. I can buy a Ford and get the winner from the group.

Cosumer Reports base their findings on unbias testing and consumer problem area (based on their annual survey they send out) and dependability from cars 2, 3, 4, 5 years old from every manufacturer.

C/R is pointing out that the chances of a person getting a bad car or trouble car are more likely with an Audi, VW or etc.

JD Powers ranks VW & Audi near the bottom in quality. It doesn'tmake a difference if you build the best interiors, while having an overall unreliable product. I guess that is why Lexus has won the top honors in Quality for 12 out of the last 13 years (issed it by a couple points to Porsche this year).

Where in the heck is VW and Audi in the list - toward the bottom. Get your facts straight if you want to be a "true car enthusiast - not a wanna a bee".

Audi is above Land Rover, BMW and Mercedes-Benz in the reliability rankings. ESPECIALLY Land Rover. Not much of a feat, I know, but they're about on par with Infiniti.

I have a feeling reliability has a lot more to do with how you maintain your cars. I question some of my friends' care with their cars; one friend has an A8L and drove so slow all the time that the transmission turned into "Grandma Mode", Audi accused him of ruining the car, and basically, it's a lemon now. I have maintained all of my Audi models meticulously, and none has had a problem more major than an oil leak. Our Lexus wasn't maintained quite as well mainly because it's an SUV and our kids are in it a lot; therefore, it hasn't worn quite as well with time. The RX300 we used to have had its instrument panel frozen in the last two months of ownership. Not too much fun.

Why buy the ES350, when you can buy a Tiyota Camry and put the 10 grand into a nice mutual fund.

It just doesn't make any sense to buy this car!

"It really doesn't make sense to buy an A4 either, when you could just get a Jetta and do the same thing."

Except, the A4 has no relation to the Jetta. The A4 is infinitely better to drive, has a much more opulent interior, is better to look at, and has the prestige of being an Audi. I say, if you're going to load up a Jetta GLI, why not just get an A4?

But there's a much larger connection between the Camry and ES- there's no significant interior upgrade, style injection or better driving experience. I see the ES as more of an elderly car than the Camry. If you're going to get a car for old people, just go all-out and get a 2004 LS430!

Will & Wilco, who told you a mutual fund are not a good investment?....because after all they're made up off a bunch of different stocks and I just watched Jim Cramer on Mad Money and he had on the show NY Giants kicker Jay Feely and Jay is the go-to-guy for investments in the NFL and Jay always advises players to get money in Mutual Funds - the key is which one and how much risk do want to take or how much money you want to make, I know I make money every month and always will.

And people that buy a Lexus make payments - people that buy a Benz pay cash from their investments.

nanner nanner nanner

Question for you EL34,

Are you trying to be the most unintelligent poster on autospies.com, or is just turning out that way?

Starts with 'd' and ends in 'oosh'?

I ain't yet got that figured out. All I've got is doosh. Lol.

Oh and ignore JUGNU. He is delusional and has undergone brain experiments. Unfortunately, after doctors wiped his memory, he was free to leave the hospital. Dazed and confused, he stumbled into a Lexus consumer clinic, where some suited man was showing a small audience a series of flash cards, with the words 'Lexus', 'Reliability', 'Craftsmanship' and 'Style'.

JUGNU then spent two confusing months relearning his whole life. Unfortunately that surprise encounter with a Lexus consumer clinic just minutes after doctors wiped his memory has produced a man so fixated on those four words, that he is unable to make rational and justified statements.

A side-effect of his top-secret treatment is that now, occasionally, he will type certain words in CAPITALS FOR NO APPARENT REASON. And he calls himself the 'Carman'. One can only speculate that he was told by Lexus representatives that he was a 'calm man' after someone in high heels stood on his foot and he failed to make a noise. He misinterpreted the statement.

A background search has revealed JUGNU was a perfectly rational Saturn driver who was uninterested in cars.

Fate is often an unkind thing.

Mathew it shows your level of maturity.U r a name calling teen.Don't u ?

BTW i forgot to add that Lexus ES350 is the best gift(if it's a car) u can give to someone special.

And it happened too.One of my friend gave her wife the new ES350 on the birth of their first child.

Wow.........amazing.

Lexus apppeal

LEXUS FOR LOVE

Lexus FOR LIFE


JUGNU----->THE CARMAN

And you have an M5!

**Embarrassing**...

gave her wife?
i thought that wasn't legal in the states? and having children would be a problem....;)

Yes wilco i am no american or english.Thanks for reminding me and others about myself once again.

JUGNU