Researchers Confirm That FCA Diesels Are Just As Bad As Cheating Volkswagen Diesels

Fiat Chrysler diesel vehicles spewed pollution as much as 20 times the legal limit, according to testing by the same researchers who first recorded the excess emissions in Volkswagen AG’s diesel cheating scandal.

The revelation from a West Virginia University laboratory sheds new light on the U.S. Justice Department’s allegations in a civil lawsuit last month that Fiat Chrysler Automobiles has used illegal "defeat devices," software that helps evade emissions tests. It comes amid growing concerns about the ability of diesel engines to satisfy U.S. emissions limits and the extent to which automakers may be working to navigate around them.

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MDarringer - 6/14/2017 8:52:58 AM

-2 Boost

When the crap hits the fan....Cue a quick sale of Fiat, Alfa-Romeo, and Maserati to Ferrari. Cue bankruptcy for FCA. Cue a sale of the carcass.

Vette71 - 6/14/2017 9:31:21 AM

0 Boost

FCA is still selling lots of Rams and GCs without the ability to sell diesel versions. Similar to VW, Audi, et.al. they can make it. The only downside is lots more CO2 released by these versions versus diesel versions. There is no free lunch; less CO2 means more other stuff. Even EV's have pollution issues.

Vette71 - 6/14/2017 9:17:44 AM

0 Boost

"Liars figure, but figures never lie" One can "prove" anything they want to prove by manipulation, be it the assumptions in a mathematical model, or doing out of the ordinary things (weight, speed,etc.) in a "real world" simulation. You have to wonder if these type tests were run on a similar gas vehicle how would the "real world" results (MPG, CO2 output, etc.) compare to the lab results that allowed those vehicles to be EPA/CARB approved in the first place.

TheSteve - 6/14/2017 10:58:04 AM

+1 Boost

Just a reminder that shortly after Diselgate blew its lid in September 2015, the U.K. government did its own tests of a variety of diesel and gasoline (petrol) passenger vehicles (multi-brand, multi-model), and discovered that all tested diesels and virtually all test gasoline vehicles produced far beyond lab-legal emissions when operating on the road... and VW's diesels were not the worst offenders. Fiat/Chrysler, GM, Mazda, Mercedes, and others were named offenders.

This, in and of itself, is not illegal (go figure!) Using what the law defines as a "cheat device" to pass the in-lab-only emissions test, is. Is it any surprise that the auto industry optimized their vehicles to pass the test?

In case you want to point fingers, the auto industry's "experts" devised the in-lab-only tests (which they knew they could easily game), and they act as advisors to legislators (who don't have scientists of their own on-board, to challenge the auto industry's "experts".) Basically, the auto industry wrote it's own rules, which it knew it could easy game... and in late 2015, the U.K. government showed how they systemically did just that.

Firewombat - 6/14/2017 3:24:39 PM

+1 Boost

Is it a surprise that that you can't get the same fuel economy in real world conditions as a lab-controlled test? No.

Is installing cheating software to your cars to circumvent lab testing conditions an industry-wide phenomenon. No. That was Audi / VW and now it seems FCA may be involved.

Spin this as many ways as you want to, most manufacturers did not create the source code for cheating software, distribute that cheating software and / or conspire with other parts suppliers to implement said software to their vehicles.

The full extent of the usage of cheating software is still to be determined but the main culprit so far, after many investigations, some of which are ongoing, is still Audi / VW.

TheSteve - 6/14/2017 3:47:12 PM

+1 Boost

Firewombat: In case you missed it, this conversation is about *emissions*. If you believe it's perfectly fine for a vehicle's real-world emissions to be 40x higher than its lab-legal levels, then that's your opinion, and I won't argue with you. According to that line of thinking, all VW needs to do to is achieve their same "clean in lab, filthy in real world" results WITHOUT using a cheat device, and they're all good.

Fortunately (personal opinion), the U.K. government was one of the first to believe that line of thought is not okay, and they quickly engaged in developing new emission testing methodology that will more closely reflect real-world conditions. This will result in a situation in which if a vehicle passes the new emissions test, then it will have very similar emissions when operated in the real world.

I believe (personal opinion) that it's downright daft to have an emissions test that allows a vehicle to legally be considered "clean" in the lab, while producing many multiples and more than an order of magnitude more pollution while operating in the real world... but that's just me. I'm pleased that the U.K. government agrees with my position, and I'm hopeful that other controlling agencies will eventually come around to this way of thinking too.