VW Insists That Telsa Is Not A Threat And Diesel Still Has A Future

Agree on Both COUNTS
As long as diesel fuel taxes in europe are way lower than those on gas - even spending a little more for a diesel is easily justified. AND - humans - over the last 100 years - have shown that research can overcome polution problems (Correctly - they will not be able to do workarounds anymore) EVENTUALLY ICE engines may be just as clean as the power plants that supply electicity to EVs.

AS far as Tesla - it already is having problems - the Higher Priced models are not selling at all - the model s sold just 75 in the USA last month. Without sales of higher priced product - and with the end of Tax incentives- Tesla pricing will be squeezed enough that the introduction of additional models will need to be put off. ANd with competition coming on line - and with the TESLA sales model of few sales outlets - fewer people will have a reason to find a tesla outlet - when they have local dealers with competitive cars to go to.

@TomM: as the saying goes: "you can't teach an old dog new tricks" - in your case, you simply can't be taught or corrected.

This is the THIRD TIME you use the wrong info "75 Model S sold in the US in August" - someone already corrected you on the accurate number (FYI, 75 was the number of MODEL 3 sold in August). Regardless of how many times you cite this wrong number, it will never be true and will make you look worse every time.

Agree on Both COUNTS
As long as diesel fuel taxes in europe are way lower than those on gas - even spending a little more for a diesel is easily justified. AND - humans - over the last 100 years - have shown that research can overcome polution problems (Correctly - they will not be able to do workarounds anymore) EVENTUALLY ICE engines may be just as clean as the power plants that supply electicity to EVs.

AS far as Tesla - it already is having problems - the Higher Priced models are not selling at all - the model s sold just 75 in the USA last month. Without sales of higher priced product - and with the end of Tax incentives- Tesla pricing will be squeezed enough that the introduction of additional models will need to be put off. ANd with competition coming on line - and with the TESLA sales model of few sales outlets - fewer people will have a reason to find a tesla outlet - when they have local dealers with competitive cars to go to.

If VW is really doing BEV at large scale then Tesla is not a threat. Not because Tesla is small and will be "crushed" as many here like to say, but because the auto market is huge - all they have to do is build EVs comparable to ICE cars in price, performance and design then EVs will take over, and build an infrastructure to support it.

Since the big guys are still held hostage by the oil industry, I am rooting for the little guys to take the lead. Tesla is leading the pack.

According to the numbers I’m seeing, diesel passenger cars account for 40% or more market share (by country) in Western Europe. Since 1990, they’ve gone from about 13% (all Western European countries combined) to a peak of 56% in 2011, and down slightly to about 50% at the end of 2016. Here’s one example of supporting data.
http://www.acea.be/statistics/tag/category/share-of-diesel-in-new-passenger-cars

Meanwhile, EVs have been around since the 1980s, EV and battery tech has made huge advances, and yet today, all EVs combined account for low single digit share in the same market.

Who knows what’ll happen decades in the future, but today, and for the next few coming years, diesel does not look like it’s disappearing.

As the saying goes: "fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me". VW is counting on Diesel since it knows that the shame will be on YOU the diesel buyers - not VW.

HenryN: Actually, the real shame is how the North American public has been fooled into embracing the “dirty diesel / clean gasoline” narrative that’s been handed to them, without questioning it, without looking into the details.

Facts that are not in the common North American mindset, and even angrily denied by many “believers”:

- Virtually every model of car and light truck made by every manufacturer (gasoline and diesel), exceeds the lab-legal levels (BY FAR) when operated in the real world. Plain English: Virtually every passenger vehicles pollutes a lot more than we’ve been told.

- While the big offenders for diesel engines in NOx (Oxides of Nitrogen), this is a big problem for diesels without the urea injection system (DEF, or Diesel Exhaust Fluid). It’s on the level of “nuisance” for properly configured diesels with properly working urea injection systems.

- The big problem with gasoline engines – this being the problem that people who slam diesels aren’t talking about – is they emit a lot more CO2 than diesels, even when tuned properly and doing exactly what you should. This is where climate deniers just sweep this aside as being irrelevant and harmless. Part of the beliefs they’ve swallowed, hook line and sinker.

So yeah, while VW did a hugely shitty (and illegal and unethical) thing with the Dieslegate cheating, Joe Average consumer is firmly focused on “dirty diesel”, and living in a fool’s paradise believing gasoline engines are “cleaner” (less NOx, true, but ignore the other pollutants in higher quantities).

TheSteve: I'm not surprised you come to the defense of diesel. You are comparing 2 different animals: CO2 versus NOx, one a greenhouse gas which causes long term climate change, the other causes smog that has direct health effect to human.

While the argument between gasoline versus diesel is as long and useless as the argument between a Camaro and a Mustang, both gasoline and diesel are bad for the inhabitants of this earth - no matter how you slice it.

The bottom line is that auto industry has always had its way for more than a century. The agent of change now is EV - you should give it a try.

"Problem is, the model 3 is price over 40K, and it's a 15K car."

You really just need to stop typing and find a hobby or something. You sound like a fool.

I would be at my VW dealer tonight if I could get a new Tiguan with a TDI. Wouldn't even wait until tomorrow.

They say a sucker's born every minute. VW loves suckers who look at the company's criminal deceit and decide to buy one anyway.

atc98092: I hear ya! I'm driving an Audi Q5 diesel, and I positively love the car and the engine (Dieselgate scandal aside). I'll be doing a 1,558 mile (each way) road trip at the end of September. With a 19.8 gallon tank, I'll need just 1 fuel-up mid-way :-)

What is this Telsa that you speak of?

I recently drove by an almost mile long field of cars in Colorado, much too large to be a trade-in auction lot, then recognized they were VW models. Must be Mueller is talking about future of liquidating 500k reworked diesels.

VW joins the pantheon of deceitful scumbags preying on car buyers. They'll need to go a long way to surpass Murderous Ford and their Pinto, but they seem to be on the right track.