Tesla Potentially Faces $200 Million In Refunds If EV Tax Credit Goes Away

Reminder: The EV tax credits, as originally designed, go away when a manufacturer produces a certain number of vehicles (200,000). It was intended to help EV startups, and not as perpetual subsidy for EV makers.

Until the market for EVs that are priced based on their own profitability is established - we will not know whether people are willing to pay a premium for them. It still seems that it is not possible to produce an EV at about the same price as an equivalent in size ICE car.

THE Ev manufacturers have been using comparison data that is based on CHEAP Electric - about half the price of what is actual - so the cost benefit over ICE cars either goes away when you use real figures or makes ICE cars better. ANd the infrastructure to support all of these EVs has not been factored in as well - Trillions of dollars will be needed to do that one.

AND now - it seems - the green advantage - when taking in the ACTUAL way they produce electricity - (Natural gas and coal) - is not as advantageous - it is still there - but it is now questionable as to whether it is worth the difference.

So - Lets see - Far more expensive - poor infrastructure - poor dealer support (none for tesla) - and not as green as claimed as well - !

I still say that it will be many years before the EV even becomes the dominant form of car (50% of the market) - likely long after I am dead.

I don't see any ICE performance and feature-wise that is better than the Model 3 at $35k. I know that is still theoretical because it will be a year before a $35k Model 3 ships to buyers. I think the Bolt ($37k) would be a hit if it wasn't so awkward/ugly on the outside and if it had access to something similar to superchargers.

Do not make yourself look like an idiot.

Back it up with an example

I am tired of supporting Tesla and other EV makers with my tax money.

I'm tired of gas being subsidized as well. Looking forward to a days where there are 0 subsidies for both EV and ICE cars.

You dont. At least a lot less than you pay for the health issue caused by all the dirty stuff in the air.

SanJoseDriver what on earth makes you think that a model 3 is competitive with any ICE vehicle at that price range. Or any price range? The car can't even be configured because Tesla doesn't want to divulge that the car won't be anywhere near $35k unless you want it equipped like a Chevy Aveo. At $35k, it is bare bones, and that also includes the tax break, so let's go back to the $42k it really costs for a base model 3. Nearly any car that costs $42k in the market is a more attractive, as quick or quicker, more appointed, better fit & finish, and more reliable.

Look at another new car in the segment, the Genesis G70. It will max around $42k, have quicker acceleration, a much more luxurious interior (since you can't even get real leather in the 3), more reliable, better warranty, better fit & finish and so on. Almost any vehicle in that class is a better option. A model 3 tops out around $55k!! supposedly and that's insane since you're still only getting basic features on competitive vehicles at that price.

Why do you blindly defend a company that has failed at executing a car company simply because Elon Musk thinks he can do everything better than everyone. That notion is what has put him behind schedule on every vehicle because he thinks his 9 years of making cars makes him smarter than companies that have been doing it a century.

At 35k you still get a really fast car with amazing handling and range. You have autonomous safety features included at no cost and the future ability to unlock autopilot/full self-driving. You get the best infotainment platform on any car period with many features exclusive to Tesla at any price range (GPS-based garage door auto opening/closing is a tiny example)... that includes unlimited internet access, music streaming, and a nav second to none. I drove a 3-series BMW over the weekend and it was crazy how outdated everything felt.

Also those non-leather seats are amazing and you would never know they are not leather. They are almost as comfortable as a Lexus I used to have. I have first gen real leather seats on my Model S and I would trade them for the synthetic ones in a heartbeat--easier to clean and last longer as well.

The G70 looks like a solid car, but the base model is $35k and has the same 0-60 as the base 3. Motor Trend says their first run Model 3 with the bigger battery is getting 0-60 in 4.8 seconds (Tesla might be sandbagging the actual figures to encourage people to get the performance/dual motor versions). That is on par with the upgraded G70. It's personal preference but I like the Model 3 interior way more than the G70, especially since it looks like it uses the same crap infotainment system from the early 2000s everyone is somehow content with. I think just like people love the iPhone today, the trend will go to cleaner interiors with few buttons and streamlined design.

There are lots of cool little things about the 3 as well like the ability to use your phone as your main key, remote climate control, calendar integration (instant nav to your next meeting). I can promise everyone you know with a Model 3 will either like it a lot or love it, especially if they are a 1st time Tesla owner.