Canada Outmaneuvered, Jumps Back Into NAFTA After Being Left On The Curb

"A survey by Nanos Research showed that 71% of Canadians surveyed approved of Trudeau’s handling of the trade file" - Enough said. I think Agent009 is trying to stir up trouble with false statements in his headline.

As Canadians, we are indeed nice people and do care about our neighbours and our allies around the world. But we won't be pushed into a bad trade deal by anyone, ever.

Don't look for a deal this week. Chapter 19 may be back and some more US milk may get sold in Canada. Everything requires a little give and take. What has been agreed re-autos was already put forward in 3-way discussions. The US car, aerospace, oil and tech and energy corporations will make sure this new NAFTA deal comes in for a smooth landing. I am quite sure of that. Nobody wants big change, just an improvement and modernization of what exists.

@Aspy11 - Feel free to criticize an entire nation (and look like an ass doing so) but you should know that while Canadians give Trudeau a 71% approval for the way he is handling trade, Americans only give Trump a 39% approval. Look it up. Apparently, the bull in the china shop routine plays as well at home as it does on the world stage.

Just because there may be a countrywide, f'ed-in-the-head response to Trudeau does not mean Trudeau is doing a good job.

@MD-Correct. While is trade performance is scored at 71% approval, his overall approval is sitting around 50%. I suspect next year the Conservative's will play the immigration card again and deliver the Liberal Government another majority. Fear of the other politics does not sell in Canada.

Trump is the biggest man child we have ever seen on the world stage. Most man children are stuck at about 14 or 15 years old, Trump is stuck at about 3 or 4 years old. Biggest wimp we have ever had for president. Totally opposite of Teddy Rosevelt, loud mouthed coward, never served a day...terrible bone spurs... I know he wanted to serve ... , then he has a little tantrum when a true national treasure dies and gets more news than he does... he is literally the epitome of a spoiled little child. The whole lot of em are corrupt up to their eyeballs too....actually look at what these cabinet members are doing, not what they are saying, but what they are doing. If it was Democrats doing this crap I would be the first in line to say kick the bums out and write paragraphs on a car enthusiast site about how terrible they are. But this bizarre cult of personality thing going on says the swamp creature Trump and his fellow cabinet swamp creatures who are totally enriching themselves in their new roles, all that is just fine... or I will stick my fingers in my ears, close my eyes and say fake news 100 times until it goes away. It is sad that people don't pay attention, as this is important stuff. I say that as a person who will give someone their due when I think they have done a good thing and I do when Trump is working on some of the trade issues (although he blew it with China), but one good thing doesn't make up for the massive corruption going on in Washington today. Hiring people totally unskilled, unknowledgeable people who have no idea what they are supposed to do for 6 figure salaries that normally might go to a skilled scientist or administrator etc... because they are buddies with Ivanka or are super right wing Republicans is nuts. Flying first class or military planes for shopping trips, having Halliburton (yes that Halliburton) get your microbrewery built in Montana because Zinke couldn't get it through the local govt etc... That's not even mentioning that he has exploded the deficit again (O took the annual deficit from over a $1T a year to less than $500B by the time he left and now it will be back over a $1T again and there is not even a national emergency) and we will have a nice recession coming up. I could go on for pages here and site verse and chapter of what is actually going on (reality is what is used to be called) in this corrupt administration but you can search for yourself if you are not too lazy to know want to know the truth about what is going on. I would advise that you stay away from political commentary (Hannity/Maddow etc...) and read actual news articles from multiple sources, Fox News is actually pretty good at News, so it the NY Times, BBC and many others.

All that proves is that 71% of Canadians are brain dead morons and are too ignorant of key political facts that they should not be permitted to vote. Nobody should unless they can pass a basic political proficiency test otherwise you get media and unions influencing and deciding elections on the SHEEPLE...

It is this exact extreme ignorance that got the oil trust fund baby Trudeau elected in the first place -that and he was going to legalize pot and all the dumb broads voted for him cuz he is cute! And how did this work out for Canada? We are being overrun by ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS that the government refuses to stop them from walking over the border and many of these slime are terrorists and criminals. Liberals don't give a shit as they will all be on welfare and social housing while they break in our cars for the next 11 years before we get caught up to the current backlog. Deport them all and build another wall along Canada to keep all the riffraff in.

Or maybe you are just partisan, and chose to ignore facts because they don't suit your political agenda? The Conservative party literally has the exact same trade policy as the Liberals. Trudeau doesn't have anywhere close to a 71% approval rating overall, but Conservatives realize that there is strength in unity. Especially when they are negotiating with a state with 10 times the leverage.

Your suggestion from previous posts is to fall for Trumps bluff. Anyone with any negotiating experience isn't going to be impressed with the "art of the deal" nonsense. Trump cannot easily pass a new NAFTA without democrat support. Democrats and many Republicans can't abandon Canada due to the linked supply chains.

Appeasing Trump is easy, just give him something to stroke his ego. Ideally something like the dairy tariffs that he has been crowing about (unfortunately both the cons and libs are too afraid of losing votes). Then subsidize the farmers in a more US style system. Lighthizer on the other hand is hard to pull things over on. He managed to get some pretty large concessions out of Mexico. SHould be interesting to see how this turns out.

What it actually does prove is that Canadians are NOT americans - and really do not care much for the political nonsense and stupidity that is going on in the US Executive Branch. THey have their own country - and favor agreements that are in their best interest.

The problem here is that for the most part - when you separate out OIL- we really do not have much of a trade imbalance with Canada. The car situation is almost a wash.

As far as your comments on Liberals- the ANARCHISTIC alt-right people like you manage to file ALL liberals into a category that does not apply - welfare and public housing. But the actual numbers do not back up your unsupported claims. At least Liberals do not use RUSSIAN assistance to hi-jack an election that should be Nullified. PUT THEM IN JAIL - because they actually DID conspire with the Russians- DID and continue to attempt to Obstruct Justice- and in the end - their own people will be the ones that prove it.

The man knows how to negotiate, can take the heat and not afraid to stand up for his country. Those who cannot tame him, blame him. US tariffs in major trading categories are 3 to 5 times lower than many countries including China and reflect past weak kneed Washington politicians on both sides buckling to international puffery. You can hate the man but his policies are working...strong economic growth, low employment, higher wages, strong stock market etc etc. in only two years. Is anyone tired of winning yet..more to come!

correction...low unemployment...

zairnaim

Good points and I always welcome intelligent conversations and debates and I prefer to be the dumber party as you always learn something of value that way.

If you think I am hard on Mohammed Trudeau you should see me on Andrew Scheer or as I call him -"the invisible man". 95% of Canadians don't know who he is nor could they recognize him from a picture so the Conservatives next election are likely screwed or at best will hold a minority...

You are right and the C's are nothing more than "Liberal Lite" and Bernier should have got the job (even though I cringe at the thought of another Quebecor PM). I am sick of politicians and want businessmen running the shop and not be shackled by all this PC bullshit that is handicapping us in a state of absolute paralysis. I like Bernier and his ideas and may break ranks from the Conservatives to wave his flag as Sheer is another useless PC putz.

We could have cut a deal with the US in the Spring as there were only 2 small issues (softwood & supply managment) that needed massaging. The real drag on NAFTA was Mexico that did cause massive job losses for both countries as we can't compete with there wages, Health and Safety and Waste Management (lack thereof) costs.

Drama School teacher disrespected Trump and the US -our biggest customer and ally because he was too worried about looking good to the world and siding with Mexico rather than do what is in our best interest -the fucking ego of Prince Trudeau!

Lightzer/Trump will now put the screws to us and rightfully so. Aside from natural resources/minerals and weaponry, the world doesn't buy much from Canada and the US and all the more reasons why we should be protecting our own and working together collectively for mutual economic benefit instead of the drama school theatrics this little air head is playing.

I can't say I support Bernier overall, but I'm definitely with him on trade. Sheer should be giving us a solid alternatives to the libs, instead of running as a lib light. I don't buy this nonsense of us dropping trade barriers leading to a disaster. Canada's de minimis at $20 is a joke, we need to raise it substantially so that businesses and consumers can benefit from the massive scale of the US economy. Protecting low level retail jobs is not worth the increased cost of doing business/living.

As far as Trudeau is concerned, he should have kept his mouth shut. We are dealing with a very "stable genius" who needs to be kept appeased while the real work is done behind the scenes. One smart thing he said during the election was that he wouldn't denounce Trump. He should keep his promise because I'm certainly not willing to finance his ego.

@zairnaim. Trudeau has done a great job of steering away from any direct criticism of Trump. His statements related to NAFTA were spot on and that is why he has a 71% approval rating. But you are correct about keeping Trump happy and feeling loved in the meantime while the real work is done.

CC, I'm not saying what Trudeau said about NAFTA was wrong. My point is that even indirect criticism is not worth it when so much is at stake for both countries. Trump creates imaginary enemies so that he can be the good guy. Have you not seen his constant whining about how everyone is treating him so badly?

@zairnaim - Yes I have. Enemies are everywhere. Now it is Google's turn as of this week to be "investigated" for wrongdoing. Great care is needed when you are dealing with an unpredictable person.

The real fake news is that existing tariffs were weak. it is a complex system and much of what China buys from the US is agricultural and less in value. Trump and his minions misrepresent the tariffs by cherry picking numbers. it seems in every negotiation he settles for the same or less and declares victory (daddy must not have hugged him enough). "the Art of the Deal" was essentially a coloring book.
Good economy?? It was on a 7 year streak and nothing he has done has altered the trajectory of the GDP or the less indicative measure of the equities.
There was a small bump up after the tax breaks, but it was short-lived. 4 percent GDP for a quarter? Obama did it 4 times and he took over an economy in freefall.
The real fallout from Trump's impulsive policy initiatives will not impact us for 1 -3 years and will be negative.

As usual I cannot help myself Truthy..."1%-2% annual GDP growth is the new norm"...where did I hear that before? Oh yea now I remember...

@Pugproud, You are too smart not to appreciate the difference in the USA economy when Obama took over vs when Trump took over. And you know well that any roaring economy did not need a $1.5T stimulus which was like throwing gas on a fire. And about as short-lived a result.

The US has been talking to Mexico for 5 weeks with Canada listening in. We have not been shut out. But having said that, what took 5 weeks to agree to can't be agreed to by another party in 5 days. This will likely take a while before a NAFTA II deal is done.

@pugproud Ignore @CC. He thinks his opinion about the USA should be heard. #arrogance

autospies has sure taken a turn for the worse and become a chore to read with all the arrogant and rude commments

@CCC - Agreed. This is what happens when we stray from talking about cars.

@CCC Yeah if we got rid of the Alt-Left Antifa boys, it would be better. I agree.

@MD - Look to the plank in your own eye before you point out the speck in your brothers. You should familiarize yourself with this verse in the Bible. Nobody stirs up more strife on this site than you. And you know it. I didn't insult a whole country. I didn't insult new immigrants. The rabid Right on this site did. As usual.

Just another example your your hubris...you quote the Bible as an atheist.

Trump is using the power and leverage of the US economy and market to level the playing field with our friends and allies (who have selective memories) and bringing our enemies to their knees through tough new sanctions. I can foresee by the end of next year the Iranian ruling party being under enormous pressure to change its ways or face a revolt by its populace. Any country or company that does not halt doing business with Iran come November will regret crossing Trump. Trump's personal behavior can be deplorable at times but the man has this country's best interests always at the forefront of his thinking. I'll take that over an appeaser, apologist any day.

@Pugproud - The vast majority of Iranian oil goes to China and India. Both of which value their relationships with Iran and won't be easily pushed by the US Administration. The US can retaliate with tariffs, but so can China and India in return. And while the US has left the agreement, the other signing members remain. It is sad to see trade by used as a weapon instead of relying on diplomacy.

Au Contraire @CC...Chinese economy slowing and its banking system is under pressure from overextending credit. Challenging Trump over Iran oil creates more risk for them that may not be worth the game. But even if it continues to buy oil from Iran the sanctions' devastating impact to Iran will be significant. Latest estimate by notable analyst is that Iran oil exports will be halved in November not to mention the far more accelerated pace of decline already. Even Germany which was looking for a way around the sanctions is starting to heel to Trump's will. Three of Germany's biggest companies have already announced that they will cease doing business with Iran until the sanctions are lifted. For political reasons you are looking for reasons Trump may fail...the tough new sanctions say otherwise. Time will tell...

Trudeau screwed up by having his press conference after an apparent agreement had been reached. You dont mess with Trump like that...he always wins. As for his approval, given most US polls underestimate Republicans by about 5 to 8% and overestimate Dems, his real approval is probably in the low 50s, and if the 2020 election were held today, he would easily win re-election despite 90% negative coverage by the media. The poll bias was in full effect in 2016....pollsters believed Obama really had close to 60% approval...yet his policies and the direction he was leading the country was completely rejected on election day.

Trump understands that America has the resources, economy, military and technology to be completely self sufficient and the need to do business with us comes from the other side of the table...always. Between this and his insatiable ego to be remembered as the best President of modern times, you can bet he's gonna do everything he can to get quantifiable results irregardless of anyone's opinion of his temperament. Being nice and centrist is what got us into this mess where we hold all the cards and routinely get taken advantage of. Maga!

Nah. Just more Alt-Right drivel. Y'know, Trump-worship and thinking the rest of the world is clamoring to be by Trumpty Dumpty's side.

Devottes: Get a passport. Visit some foreign countries (Canada is nearby!). Find out what they think of Trump and America. Discover what's *really* going on... outside of Fraud and Friends :-)

Alt-right Drivel? Trumpty Dumpty? Fraud and Friends? Are you trying to be taken seriously?

We would base our opinion of Trump on what non-citizens say, why? Foreigner can take their opinions and shove them up pie holes.

Reported in WSJ that the bastion of liberalism, California, cannot keep Rolex watches in stock. The liberals there are riding high on Trump's economy but their ideology won't let themselves admit it. The evidence of greater prosperity (the American dream for everyone, citizens and immigrants alike) of every age, gender and race is in front of you if you just look. Lowest black unemployment ever, lower Spanish unemployment ever, more jobs than applicants now, rising wages, etc etc. As yogi Berra once said "Its amazing what you can see if you just look!"

@Pugproud what is amazing to those of us outside America is that Trump gets so much credit for the current state of the US economy when he has only passed ONE piece of legislation. Think about that. There has been no infrastructure Bill, No tax increase to fund any special initiatives, the Wall has not been built. A balanced budget was not passed with savings put into bridges or roads. Starting trade wars doesn't create jobs and has cost the US taxpayer millions in subsidies paid by those hurt by them. Can you point to anything *specific* he has done to drive economic activity in the USA?

Well for starters, the tax reform bill was extremely comprehensive, and the lowering of the Business tax rate unleashed expansion by businesses of all sizes. Additionally, Trump has cut more regulations than any POTUS since Reagan, and in the US regulations have a direct correlation with how businesses make decisions. With the highly regulatory Obama years, businesses were afraid to grow, and many smaller businesses stopped from growing for fear of having to comply with Obamacare taxes (if they had over 50 employees). The typical approach of the Left in the US is to have the government involved in everything, and in doing so, that stifles entrepreneurship and competition. Obama had the ability with a GOP congress to reduce regulations and business taxes and chose not to, and hence he will forever be remembered as the only POTUS to never have 3% annualized GDP growth.

PUGPROUD, Trump inherited a roaring economy. It was on a 7 year run. Nothing he has done has altered its course. Look at statistical and historical trends. I can provide or explain them if needed. He was put on third base and acting like he hit a triple. Obama hit over 4% quarterly growth 4 times and he inherited the 2nd worse economy in the last 100 years. And the hypocrisy of Republicans whining about the deficit and then enthusiastically supporting Trumps tax break is unreal.
No PUGPROUD, this buffones impulsive policy initiatives will hurt us for years down the road.

With all do respect Truthy, Obama is the only POTUS in history to not have annualized 3% GDP growth. Moreover, Obama and his peers laughed at Trump's prediction we could get to 4% growth. Well just as the left thought Trump would never win in 2016, they are wrong yet again about his ability to get the economy moving. Here is one writeup regarding the early 2017 predictions about GDP growth, and Trump has once again defied the odds.

http://www.latimes.com/business/hiltzik/la-fi-3percent-20170519-story.html#

bnilhome, Trump has not gotten to 4.0 % annual growth. It was one quarter (3 months) and partly driven by companies trying to beat tariffs ahead of the implementation. The next quarter projections are between and 2.5 and 2.9 percent. Obama hit over 4.0 % in 4 quarters despite inheriting an economy in freefall. The corporate tax rate needed to be changed to bring back monies from overseas, However Bush could not get this done either. And it could have been done without the additional cut to the top .05% income bracket.

Truthy-You ignored what I stated...Obama is the first POTUS to never get to 3% annualized growth. Meanwhile, Trump is on his way to 3% annualized growth after the tax bill took effect. Moreover, nearly all other economic indicators are at all time bests. Black and Hispanic unemployment have reached record lows under Trump, consumer confidence is the highest in decades, small business confidence is highest in decades, stock markets have reached all-time highs, and on and on. There are plenty of areas to criticize Trump for going over the top in attacking others, but trying to refute the success of his economic policies is not going to get you very far with the average American.

Also, Trump did not win the election, with 3.5 million more votes for his opponent and not insignificant help from a foreign adversary, he may have won the electoral college.

Truthy-If you really want to be taken seriously, please do not recite talking points from the left. Trump won the election fair and square and frankly outworked and outmaneuvered Hillary Clinton despite having way more negative media coverage than Hillary did. Citing the popular vote is like the loser of the Super Bowl coming out and saying....but we had more total yards than the other team.

Sure Canada will have to cave to the schoolyard bully and hand over his lunch money. But in the process, America has solidified its stereotype as the proverbial "Ugly American" with the Trump Presidency. That, with all the evidence of his character and personality, they knowingly continue to put up with this narcissistic psychopathic bully says a lot about Americans.
Good luck to your grandkids in cleaning the stench off your nation's reputation.

bnilhome, your fux news talking points are not taken seriously. There is overwhelming evidence that Russian influence got Donny elected and that he welcomed it. The Mueller investigation will determine how much he worked with them. Russians are still working on influencing our midterms with DD doing nothing to stop it.
Republicans no longer believe in democracy, just on winning. Stop large blocks of people from voting, check. Allow billionaires to contribute as much as they want, check. Gerrymandering to allow states who overwhelming voted for democratic representation but get republican congress, check. Stop legislation for universal background checks that 90 percent of US favor, check. Call a free press, "the enemy of the people as Lenin did, check.

If you really believe that vote tallies were changed in 2016 by Russians and that is the only reason Trump won, you have been watching way too much MSNBC and CNN. The Mueller investigation cannot be taken seriously...they were tasked with Russian collusion and now are focused on porn stars.

You completely dodged all the other economic points...and for a reason, they are true. The left has lost its mind realizing that liberal policies do not work and that Conservatism is working for the American people. Trump has achieved more in 18 months than Obama did in 8 years and he is well on his way to re-election despite a Resistance movement based on and supported by Fake news.

To Thruthy...Jer. 5:1 (King James version).."None so blind as those who cannot see." Open your eyes, look around and see what real hope and change looks like. Its not ideology its real prosperity and potential fo



Truthy..."None so blind as those who cannot see"...Jer. 5:21 (King James version). Open your eyes and what you will see is what real hope and change looks like.

PS: I started the Bible quoting trend.

Amen!

Isaiah 5:20-21 20 Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!21 Woe unto them that are wise in their own eyes, and prudent in their own sight!

This is the thread (Song) that never ends...

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing what it was
But people kept singing it just because

This is the song that never ends
Yes it goes on and on my friend
Some people started singing it
Not knowing wh

bnillhome, I addressed the economic points in an earlier posts. I can smaller words if it helps. The economy has been on a seven year positive run. DD has been in office less than 2 years. No policy he has implemented has changed the trajectory of the market at all. There was a brief bump after the tax bill was passed, but this has passed and the great deficit increase will offset this in future years. This is the longest economic expansion in history that Obama launched after he inherited a mess. DD inherited a booming economy and is taking credit for it. It takes a full 1 -2 years for a new president's polcies to have an effect.
Do some homework from reliable sources, not fux news [sic]. The statistical and historical data show the economy is on the same growth path it has been on for 7 years.
The Neo-nazis willingness to believe every statement from DD without question shows his followers are truly blind. This guy does not even have the balls to have a press conference. Gutlessly sending out tweets. He cannot think fast enough on his feet to have a press conference.
How is the "deal" with North Korea going?

Which policy did Barry Soetoro pass that spurred economic growth? The US economy will always grow, long term but it can be slowed by a variety of ways like regulations and tax increases. Remove barriers to growth and it explodes. Kennedy and Reagan did it and now President Trump is too. Funny how the unqualified incompetent Barry Soetoro’s $10T debt is never mentioned by commie libs but they are debt hawks when a Repub is in office. Trump is going to reduce the size and scope of the Fed Gubment soon and will adddess debt as well. The current plan is economic growth and a sound foundation for continued growth. He said he’d address the Fed Debt during the campaign and no other president except Reagan has actually kept his promises. Only idiots cannot see the huuuge progress achieved since day
one.

bnilhome, the Mueller investigation is not over. He is thoughtfully and THOROUGHLY building a case. Unlike DD, he is not impulsive and pays attention to details.
If you do not understand the reach of Special Counsel, do some reading. Criminal campaign violations, working with foreign agents (Flynn, more to come), etc are within scope. He already has dozens of indictments, two convictions, numerous guilty pleas as he builds the case toward the big catch.

Before you whine about the scope of THIS special counsel, Clinton's was looking into the decade old land deal and wound up being about his personal life.
I cannot wait for Mueller's report, the blue wave and the spring impeachment!

keep dreaming....